Goodbye Bali

[harryopal1]

I hate to think how Bali will be in say 20 years as the tidal wave of building and development threatens to become a tsunami with the same ominous outcomes that we now associate with the word Tsunami.

Here's a glimpse of that future from the ABC news today.

A Russian-backed 'city' is emerging over the back fence of Bali's Eat Pray Love house

This patch of dirt was once a lush jungle that locals say was home to ancient spirits. Now, luxury villas, bars and restaurants are being built here instead to bring in foreign investors.

www.abc.net.au

 

[fastpitch17]

I hate to think how Bali will be in say 20 years as the tidal wave of building and development threatens to become a tsunami with the same ominous outcomes that we now associate with the word Tsunami.

Here's a glimpse of that future from the ABC news today.

A Russian-backed 'city' is emerging over the back fence of Bali's Eat Pray Love house

This patch of dirt was once a lush jungle that locals say was home to ancient spirits. Now, luxury villas, bars and restaurants are being built here instead to bring in foreign investors.

www.abc.net.au

View attachment 3843

I don't think one needs to wait and see in 20 years. These changes in Bali have been going on for years with increases annually. I know quite a few that visited Bali regularly that refuse to go there again. I have read on numerous sites people complaining about the changes to Bali. The government seems to be giving their blessings to all these changes.

There needs to be Indonesian's involved because I can't see how an Ukrainian could do this by himself or even with a Russian company involved. Someone with big cash is involved as well as all those that approved permits. Unfortunate the locals are those that have to suffer just so a bunch of rich draft dodgers make money away from their own nations.

 

[merahputih]

I red somewhere (may be here in this forum?) that there was (still is?) similar project, Eco beach city, by Spanish developer in Karimun Jawa. People are against it because it's conservation area.

 

[Shadrach]

This a sad interesting story, that doesn't shock me at all. If the people are starving without tourism then they should look at themselves and see that it's their own fault to be so addicted to money. Everyone portrays Ubud chaos and traffic on tourist when you see it's Indonesians flooding to Ubud, Changgu, Uluwatu to chase money. 90% of the drivers are Indonesian, not tourist! These construction projects can only be allowed if the Balinese condone it, to fill their pockets with money! They look square and ugly and I'm sure the construction is very bad quality which will start breaking down in a short time. It is a well known fact that tourist cannot own land, houses cars, motorbikes without the title being in a Balinese person's name. Whoever is so called selling these houses, land, apartments, villas know that the tourist are getting ripped off and welcome the fools. I have no sympathy for Balinese letting this happen. It is all corruption from the bottom up to the government! Greed is a wicked drug that is very addicting! But Karma is inevitable and it will bite everyone in the ass, when their time has come! Money is the root of all evil!

 

[merahputih]

I red somewhere (may be here in this forum?) that there was (still is?) similar project, Eco beach city, by Spanish developer in Karimun Jawa. People are against it because it's conservation area.

The current project location is in Sumba now, stated in their website. It advertised differently than before. The previous advertised pretense that foreigners may own house(s)/villa(s). The current said vaguely about ownership, emphasized on investment.

 

[vocalneal]

240,000 for a grass hut they are taking the piss

 

[pantaiema]

"At the Hidden City, a 30-year lease on a villa will set you back around $US600,000. So one thing is clear: these cities are not aimed to house locals."

This Marco from Canada has the potential to become a wealthy millionaire by selling his hut and the land it sits on. Given its value proposition, the property would likely command a higher price due to its location in the middle of a forest, where a person such as Elizabeth Gilbert embraces serenity as described in her memoir. It's plausible that Marco owns the land as freehold (hak milik) property, rather than leasehold, granting him or his family perpetual ownership of the land. "Pak Tani" might also want to copy the same business model.

Excellent article about growing up as a mixed kid in Indonesia

https://indonesiaexpat.id/featured/mixed-race-children/ Since this community is surely growing, not only in Bali but elsewhere, this is a really good article showing the practical issues involved, such as: Indonesians see them as foreigners, but their "other" country sees them as Indonesians...

www.expatindo.org

But a movie is a movie, and a memoir is a memoir. I highly doubt that many people would want to lead a life, or have the means to lead a life, like Elizabeth Gilbert in seeking love, spirituality, and personal growth pay $US600,000. for a property in Bali where they can not have a freehold.

Where are Julia Robert, Javier Bardem living now. were they living in "Eat Pray Love" house ??

 

[Shadrach]

I remember seeing this many years ago, on Sumba! The illustration was out of this world! Very futuristic! And they were saying everything new age dreamers wanted to hear. They were trying to sell properties without having roads, sewage, houses, schools, Etc. And The people I talked to were eating it up! I don't know if they bought into it or not. To me, It was obviously a scam. But there's a sucker born everyday.

This new development near Ubud doesn't surprise me at all. Some Balinese has obviously leased the land for this project to fill their pockets with money. That story about about Pak Liyer and his son Gede and wife, is not all that true. They have been capitalizing on the Eat, Pray, Love, story and making a lot of money from it since. Many years ago My friend went there and bought a lot of herbs that didn't help her and were making her feel sick. When she went back and tried to exchange them she was refused with no replacement herbs or refund! It's a shame this is happening, but it is only happening because of Bali locals and investors. If the people grew small gardens wherever they could, they would not be starving. I have seen plenty of land not being used for anything, when the neighbors next door are hungry! Helping each other and letting people grow gardens on unused land is not happening! For a spiritual Island this is something not allowed. Where's the love?

 

[harryopal1]

"....Where's the love?...."

The love is with Winnie the Pooh, Piglet. Tigger and Christopher Robin. It is otherwise in rather short supply everywhere. ... Forgot to mention Eyore. And the original AA Milne version not the bowdlerized Disney version.
I see back in 2018, five 5 of the original EH Shepard sketches sold for $1.2 million at auction.

 

[Shadrach]

The love is with Winnie the Pooh, Piglet. Tigger and Christopher Robin. It is otherwise in rather short supply everywhere. ... Forgot to mention Eyore. And the original AA Milne version not the bowdlerized Disney version.
I see back in 2018, five 5 of the original EH Shepard sketches sold for $1.2 million at auction.
View attachment 3844

You completely went off track of what the subject was! Big developments and people not sharing, and people here going hungry!

 

[harryopal1]

You asked, "where is the love?" Obviously not with the developers. Just answering your question.

 

[pantaiema]

Many years ago My friend went there and bought a lot of herbs that didn't help her and were making her feel sick. When she went back and tried to exchange them she was refused with no replacement herbs or refund! It's a shame this is happening, but it is only happening because of Bali locals and investors. If the people grew small gardens wherever they could, they would not be starving. I have seen plenty of land not being used for anything, when the Neighbors next door are hungry! Helping each other and letting people grow gardens on unused land is not happening! For a spiritual Island this is something not allowed. Where's the love?

In developed countries, individuals lacking land ownership can still cultivate their own herbs, vegetables, and fruits through renting land from local councils with an arrangement the so called "allotment".

The rental fees are typically just a token price, sometimes as low as £7.50 annually per 25m² plot.
Despite this opportunity, there's limited interest in such arrangements. Even those with no income often opt out, preferring urban living where they're not required to engage in farming. They rely on taxpayer-funded benefit systems to cover their basic living expenses.

Rather than growing their own food, they could choose to watch "Eat Pray Love" on platforms such as Netflix or Amazon Prime. They could watch the seasonal immigrant fruit pickers making a living from the comfort of their living rooms. They then conveniently purchase fruits and vegetables from local farmer's markets or supermarkets instead of cultivating them themselves. For a daily body work out, no need to do a daily hard work in the allotment as they could simply go to a local gym located in not-for-profit leisure centres.

Wealthy individuals, including millionaires, often prefer to opt beautifying their own gardens and finance them independently. They choose to participate in the annual event such as the "Chelsea Flower Show." This preference for horticultural activities and body work out are preferred activities for the wealthy people rather than engaging in the cultivation of fruits and vegetables that they could easily purchase them from the supermarkets.

 

[john madden]

Pantaeima says "as little as 7.50" quid pa. Typically about ten times that. And "there's little interest" - most seem to be fully subscribed with lengthy waiting lists. AI inaccuracy or right wing agenda?

 

[Shadrach]

Again someone post something completely off track of the original post! It was about land being leased by wealthy locals, people exploiting the Eat,Pray, Love book and making lots of money even to this day, complaining about land next them getting developed! Some locals had to allow this. For money in their pocket! Western welfare systems have nothing to do with the topic at hand. I brought up about neighbors here not helping neighbors and allowing them a little amount of land to grow food. Everyone I talked to was too afraid to ask a neighbor for this. It's not in the tradition so it just can't happen. What a sad situation! So much for the land of the Gods!

 

[Pak Tani]

The love is with Winnie the Pooh, Piglet. Tigger and Christopher Robin. It is otherwise in rather short supply everywhere. ... Forgot to mention Eyore. And the original AA Milne version not the bowdlerized Disney version.
I see back in 2018, five 5 of the original EH Shepard sketches sold for $1.2 million at auction.
View attachment 3844

It always amazed me what attracted people to Winnie the Pooh. I liked a lot of Disney as a child, but Winnie and his henchmen? A strange group of friends.
I only recently learned that it was actually a group of psychiatric patients. Winnie with his eating disorder, a depressed donkey, a piglet with an anxiety disorder, a tiger with ADHD, a rabbit with OCD, a kangaroo with autism.
It is not a standard heroic story with heroes and villains. Oh well, to each their own.

 

[fastpitch17]

What a sad situation! So much for the land of the Gods!

Yes, the land of the Gods who receive an ample daily supply of offerings, praise, and worship. No one ever called it the land of the people. Where in this entire nation do you find, the Fellowship of Man? More like, if you ask, I will help but I know you won't ask of anyone you know because it would appear to tarnish the image you want to project.

The government tries to help the lowest to no income families with 5 to 10 kilos of rice, various produce items, free BPJS, and 300 to 400 rebu per month. Perhaps there would be less starving and the lowest income families if the government would add a mandatory birth control as an elegibility to receive government subsidies.

 

[Shadrach]

Yes, the land of the Gods who receive an ample daily supply of offerings, praise, and worship. No one ever called it the land of the people. Where in this entire nation do you find, the Fellowship of Man? More like, if you ask, I will help but I know you won't ask of anyone you know because it would appear to tarnish the image you want to project.

The government tries to help the lowest to no income families with 5 to 10 kilos of rice, various produce items, free BPJS, and 300 to 400 rebu per month. Perhaps there would be less starving and the lowest income families if the government would add a mandatory birth control as an elegibility to receive government subsidies.

That's ridiculous that people want to create an false image. Everyone needs a helping hand sometimes. From what I've observed they only want to help their own family members, not even the neighbor next door. I have Bali friends above Padang Bai and have such a small piece of land it's only big enough for their house. They have a sister just down the road with a lot of land, but she wont even let them grow a small garden, their neighbor next door has a lot of land but they are afraid to ask if they can grow a small garden. There are many places in their village just growing weeds. I suggest the community get together and talk to the owners about a community garden and grow food for all and give the owners food for free. That idea floated like a lead balloon. Everyone is too shy for this kind of rational thinking, so nothing ever changes. All the places I saw there had enough space to grow small garden, but they only have bushes, trees, or maybe a papaya and banana plant growing. No vegetables. I tried to show them how to grow in pots and along the houses in small plots. They are too lazy to do this and have many excuses not to. They can't think of anything except chasing money or going to non stop ceremonies! I will just grow for myself and share the extra. Maybe one of them will learn and do the same.

The Banjars should teach about stopping throwing the rubbish everywhere and growing more food. Birth control is a good idea, but since there is not much government assistance and people are stuck in traditions, they feel obligated to make children, and more and more until they have a son. Because the son only inherent the land and the daughter has to marry and leave. This is the way it is, and has been for a long time now, but maybe it's time for a change!

 

[fastpitch17]

Yes, let's keep having children so they can care for us when we grow old. Why not have more children we can't feed, can not afford to educate them, so when they grow up and are poor like us, nobody takes care of us.

I look around through various financial capabilities of offspring and find those that are better off have fewer children and those considered poor just keep knocking them out. When the children are grown so many males move away and completely forget they have parents and many parents have to turn to their daughters for help. Sons force parents from their homes to aquire them for themselves or to sell. The old customs of male children taking care of their parents is fading.

 

[centurion]

Yes, let's keep having children so they can care for us when we grow old. Why not have more children we can't feed, can not afford to educate them, so when they grow up and are poor like us, nobody takes care of us.

I look around through various financial capabilities of offspring and find those that are better off have fewer children and those considered poor just keep knocking them out. When the children are grown so many males move away and completely forget they have parents and many parents have to turn to their daughters for help. Sons force parents from their homes to aquire them for themselves or to sell. The old customs of male children taking care of their parents is fading.

Balinese are making many children until they got a male one-sometimes having more daughters. If there is no male heir, the inheritance goes to the deceised husband's brother, and wives and daughters are stripped of everything and kicked out.

 

[Shadrach]

Balinese are making many children until they got a male one-sometimes having more daughters. If there is no male heir, the inheritance goes to the deceised husband's brother, and wives and daughters are stripped of everything and kicked out.

I bet it was a man that came up with that rule! What an archaic tradition. Why are the men so afraid of giving women power? You sure don't see many in the political ads? Why can't Catholic priests have wives? Look at many of them becoming pedophiles! I'm not saying we should change over to a Matriarchal society, that could be just as out of balance. Let's try an equal society of Men and women running the show!
What if the deceased husband doesn't have a brother? This really makes the females look worthless in this society! Why hijabs for women and not for males?