DON'T PANIC.... well, maybe a little bit.

dafluff

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A cratering economy can also have severe health impacts - especially in a country without a generous social safety net. There is no guarantee that imposing draconian lockdown measures would even work in a country like Indonesia. We get to a point where one has to analyze in terms of "acceptable risk". In a country where the poorest residents are not too far removed from starvation, the moral calculus is different from that of a fully developed western country.
I'm not even saying anything about lock down. At this point it is likely to be ineffective anyway. But what about more simple stuff? There is not a single law about mask wearing for example, never mind what standards those masks should be. There is no serious grass root socialization on Covid-19 prevention.

I see a lot of slogans, such as GERMAS - Gerakan masyarakat hidup sehat, or perilaku hidup bersih sehat or Pola Hidup Bersih dan Sehat, but I couldn't tell you what that means in practice. This is a big failure on the part of educating the public.
 

Helpful Herbert

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The only thing is to hope people are intelligent enough to realise what the health risk is, and protect themselves accordingly. The fact that when the malls reopened footfall was down by 80% means that may be happening. The people flocking to mosques may give the opposite impression. Here in the kampung no-one seems to be aware of it yet, let's just hope it doesn't make it this far.
 

fastpitch17

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The only thing is to hope people are intelligent enough to realise what the health risk is, and protect themselves accordingly. The fact that when the malls reopened footfall was down by 80% means that may be happening. The people flocking to mosques may give the opposite impression. Here in the kampung no-one seems to be aware of it yet, let's just hope it doesn't make it this far.
You probably wouldn't know if it made it there or not. Many have applied stigmas to the virus and when they get sick it is kept secret. from others. Too many fear being outcast or that their relative can not be buried where or how they wish. If they are intelligent enough to realize the risk, there sure are many that deliberately ignore those risk then.
 

fastpitch17

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A cratering economy can also have severe health impacts - especially in a country without a generous social safety net. There is no guarantee that imposing draconian lock down measures would even work in a country like Indonesia. We get to a point where one has to analyze in terms of "acceptable risk". In a country where the poorest residents are not too far removed from starvation, the moral calculus is different from that of a fully developed western country.
You do not need a lock down unless things are completely out of hand. What you need is policies put in place for mandatory masking, social distancing, and limiting public gatherings. Then, those policies need to be strongly enforced and not by some written warning you agree with and say you won't do it again. Look around, how many that are not wearing mask do you see? How many lingering in a group shoulder to shoulder? Indonesia has reported that 70% of those tested have been A symptomatic. They are spreading it and don't know it. It is also easy to agree with those that say the numbers for Indonesia are 10 to 20 times greater than what is being reported.

The president has reason to be pissed but should include himself in there. Addressing the public health first brings an earlier chance of economic recovery. Keying on the economy first will get you nothing but more sick people where it will force an economic shutdown like you can not imagine. The Health Minister has a fat budget to deal with the Covid-19 threat but to this day has only spent 1.5% of the billions of Rupiah allotted to it. The same guy who said pray it away. He should have been gone months ago. While it may be rather late for the president to put some feet down, still better now that later but the Science needs to be listened to first and foremost. I have my doubts it will be though.

If only the government could come to it's senses and look globally as to what has worked and what has not. Simple thing to do. Many good examples to look at and implement some of the same stratifies. He seems to be looking at the US and Brazil and following the economic recovery plans at all cost to the welfare of the nation. Like has been said many times, one may talk the talk but can they walk the walk. This government seems to be sounding good but trip over themselves when trying to walk.
 

Helpful Herbert

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The numbers who would voluntarily go to hospital or for a test if they have symptoms are tiny. They would just stay home, or keep working if they can. Costs of swab tests in hospitals are 1.5 - 6jt depending on the turn around time, who can afford that here? So yes, 100 new cases in Jakarta yesterday means 1000-2000 new cases in Jakarta yesterday. 2805 deaths in Indonesia so far means over 30,000, and we're only just beginning because the R number is definitely above 1.
 
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yantiharun1

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No mention of Bali in that article, which obviously is the primary tourist destination, and appears to be keeping more strict borders these past couple months. I wonder if Bali and the national government will agree on the same timeline and procedures?
If all goes according to plan, on July 9 Bali will start the first stage of reopening several sectors except education and tourism, the Governor has reported.

The island will begin welcoming domestic tourists in the second stage beginning August. This would be subject to the successful execution of the first stage."

According to the Governor the third stage, anticipated for September, would see the return of international tourists.
 

Dave70

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In Sulawesi, mourners forcefully opened the coffin and layers of cloth / plastic wrapped around the corpse of a suspected COVID-19 patient.

 

Dave70

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Airborne transmission of COVID-19 probable


TIP: Riding taxi, it makes absolute sense to roll down the windows (even if it's hot).
 

Nimbus

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The latest conclusion by the CDC is that the virus mainly transmits through respiratory droplets. Transmission through surface contact and food is considered very low. This is why masks are vitally important.

 

macvert

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….... & to think I have joked that if we got Covid 19 it would most likely come over the side wall from our neighbour from hell whom we have nicknamed “The Human Insinkerator”or just “Drainpipe” for short, it doesn't seem quite so unrealistic now.
This animal clears his throat incredibly loudly & spits in his front yard about 79 times per day coupled with multiple, loud, open mouthed spray sneezing all starting around 6am, I imagine his front yard must look like it's full of shelled oysters, absolutely disgusting :sick:, we'll be moving house when our lease expires in September.
 

Dave70

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Dave70

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Just bits and pieces of what I'm hearing...

1. The price of Rapid Testing is now fixed at 150k.
2. Indonesia seems to have a lot of them (glut due to dumping?) so they are pushing its usage recently.
3. Rapid Testing is mostly not accurate no matter where it is made, you may get false negative or worse a false positive.
4. It can be observed that some medical staff don't replace their surgical gloves (or disinfect them?) per WHO guidelines, and who knows how many persons they have touched before your turn.
5. Hospitals get reimbursed for the expenses of COVID-19 patients, so some become "trigger-happy" to identify anyone with or without symptoms as a suspected case.
6. Many new cases are actually upper-middle class, got it from their household staff. Who can stop their drivers, gardeners, security, maid, cook from going to malls or mosques (or church?)? So they are the ones infecting their employers' families.
 
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Helpful Herbert

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Another point of view is that it is the middle class who have started going out again, to Ancol, malls, car free day, offices, riding bicycles and meeting together in groups (kumpul2), whereas those without much money are staying at home.
Edit: infection rate today 2657 (yesterday 1853, 2 days ago 1268)
 
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