Are you ready for Jokowi-Prabowo 2024?

[pantaiema]

... what I call, a mental illness. A lot of experts say it doesn't help them, while others say it can help.
Personally I see a lot of the stuff that's happening in and around that whole LGBTQ (and whatever letters they add in the next years) circle as very problematic and straight mentally ill.

Well, many people, including myself, believe that it is better for individuals to invest in themselves to improve their appearance, like the models in the video linked in post #56 in this thread. In another example, in post #221, I shared photos of David Beckham and Cristiano Ronaldo posing for Armani. Those who cannot appreciate this artwork might need eye surgery.

How Indonesian resort island Bali became a refuge for Ukrainians and Russians

The history of Islam in Java is enough to fill several books. The short version is that the original Javanese Islam is positively different from Arabic Islam. Of course the Arabs call it the ‘wrong’ kind of Islam, just like Catholics call Protestants the wrong kind of Christians. Was it you...

www.expatindo.org

Look at how confident the models in the magazines, videos, and other content on the channel are. It's also worth noting that the host, "Peter," is often praised for having one of the best jobs in the world.

Despite my and your personal preference, I believe that it is absurd to use the term ".. mental illness..", .. A lot of experts say ...without saying but it is also confronted by other experts " to describe protected attributes or characteristics, especially if you have not personally experienced discrimination based on those attributes.

Protected characteristics are guaranteed by law in many developed countries. This means that it is illegal to discriminate against people based on these characteristics. Before enacting these laws, governments would have thoroughly considered the matter and debated it extensively, with input from experts from both sides.

 

[Hawk256]

Despite my and your personal preference, I believe that it is absurd to use the term ".. mental illness..", .. A lot of experts say ...without saying but it is also confronted by other experts " to describe protected attributes or characteristics, especially if you have not personally experienced discrimination based on those attributes.

Sometimes you call a spade a spade. If a man went to doctor and wanted them cut of his arm because he didn't like or want it, how would they react? How is not wanting your penis or wanting breasts any different? Why am I forced to say that is normal mental health?

 

[Balifrog]

Before enacting these laws, governments would have thoroughly considered the matter and debated it extensively, with input from experts from both sides

I doubt that very much. More likely they acted under the pressure of various lobbies, like the LGBTXXX !

 

[Balifrog]

Transformation succeeded.....

 

[fastpitch17]

Sometimes you call a spade a spade. If a man went to doctor and wanted them cut of his arm because he didn't like or want it, how would they react? How is not wanting your penis or wanting breasts any different? Why am I forced to say that is normal mental health?

Is it an issue when women, in fear of cancer, have their breast or ovaries removed before any of the disease is present? That would be a mental health issue prior to becoming a physical health issue.

 

[Hawk256]

Is it an issue when women, in fear of cancer, have their breast or ovaries removed before any of the disease is present? That would be a mental health issue prior to becoming a physical health issue.

And we start down that slippery slope but the cases we have been discussing are a far cry from that reality.

 

[El_Goretto]

So in the end it looks like we will not see a Jokowi-Prabowo ticket but a Prabowo-Widodo ticket! Jokowi's own son has been nominated as Prabowo's running partner.

Curious about everyone's take here.

BTW, his son is only 36yo and normally not eligible to run in a presidential election for being less than 40. Luckily, his father's brother in law is the leading the constitutional court and amended the rules to accommodate the family.

"you either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain".

 

[Hawk256]

So in the end it looks like we will not see a Jokowi-Prabowo ticket but a Prabowo-Widodo ticket! Jokowi's own son has been nominated as Prabowo's running partner.

Curious about everyone's take here.

BTW, his son is only 36yo and normally not eligible to run in a presidential election for being less than 40. Luckily, his father's brother in law is the leading the constitutional court and amended the rules to accommodate the family.

"you either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain".

Politicians are just like pro wrestlers. They claim to hate each other until everyone looks away and they laugh togehter at all the sucker's money they just made putting on a show.

 

[fastpitch17]

So in the end it looks like we will not see a Jokowi-Prabowo ticket but a Prabowo-Widodo ticket! Jokowi's own son has been nominated as Prabowo's running partner.

Curious about everyone's take here.

BTW, his son is only 36yo and normally not eligible to run in a presidential election for being less than 40. Luckily, his father's brother in law is the leading the constitutional court and amended the rules to accommodate the family.

"you either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain".

Just NAME politics that the KPU kept stating shouldn't happen. Jokowi's son has a name only. Sure, he us mayor of Solo but has no accomplishments he can claim for himself. Everything that has been accomplished in Solo since he took over as mayor has been instigated, designed, put in place, and paid for by the Central Government. In other words, by pappa.

As for the exception to the legibility rules being changed by the supreme court, there is a lot of discussion taking place about that move. As with everything in Indonesia, it will depend in how many and how loud the opposition is. They will un all likelyhood change back to the previous requirements but not until after the election.

I have watched him interacting with those from other parties that he is now aligning himself with. He seems rather immature and starstruck when around party leaders. Rather submissive.

Let's not forget he and his brother have not formally left the PPI-D and Megawati will have much to say. She is still a power to never ignore. The one good thing about the VP choices is that it pretty much ensured Anies is out of the game. Out of all 6 candidates, the one with the mist presidential qualifications would be Mafud MD.

 

[serious_fun]

The youthful rise of dynasty politics in Indonesia

 

[fastpitch17]

The youthful rise of dynasty politics in Indonesia

Besides the Widodo brothers, what youth is there in the youth movement? AHY is getting shot down everywhere at least while SBY remains head of the Dems and is calling the shots. Looking at youth movements it would seem that many organizations with the word youth in them or a group belonging to them has numerous 50 some year olds spearheading them. Are we to consider a youth movement if they are in their late 30s to early 40s?

Please, no one mention Puan. Where are the youth to create these dynasties?

 

[Helpful Herbert]

Gibran is a seriously unimpressive VP candidate. Look at his CV:

• went to a local school, probably no better than average results (no info available), followed by high school in Singapore
• went to some kind of vocational college in Singapore (Management Development Institute of Singapore) - this is very low ranked, in fact the only two famous ex-students they have according to Wiki are Gibran himself and the son of Robert Mugabe!!
• aged 23 he set up a catering business to cater for events for his father in his role as Mayor of Solo. It didn't seem to last long
• later in about 2016 he set up a business selling snacks (martabak) which went bankrupt at the start of Covid and now there is no trace of it.
• according to his wealth declaration he seems to have magically accumulated around 23B rp. And he declared that he earned it all himself [yeah right]. This includes 7 plots of land, 5 cars and 2 motorbikes.

What was his next move in his early 30s after such an unremarkable career so far? YES - he became Mayor of Solo. And now VP candidate.

Prabowo hasn't really put a foot wrong in the last 3 or so years, but this will I think turn out to be a mistake as people generally don't like nepotism where the child shows no positive qualities at all (see also Puan and AHY) and Gibran has achieved far less than either of those 2. His VP debate is likely to be embarrassing too.

So I'd say that Ganjar, who has chosen a good VP candidate, is now favourite.

 

[harryopal1]

Will Prabowo's health become an issue? He has a serious limp that seems to be getting more noticeable and his weight might readily lead to diabetes and related problems. Then of course there was Franklin D Roosevelt who was president for 12 years despite being confined to a wheelchair.

 

[pantaiema]

The issue with Indonesian voters is that many of them are individuals living in isolated communities, particularly those attending religious boarding schools and listening to religious leaders, some of whom promote hate without contributing to any constructive change. These individuals often lack exposure to the evolving world.

Anies Baswedan one of the current presidential candidate used to hold the position of Governor of Jakarta beating Ahok, winning the election by garnering support from many radical Muslims. During his tenure, he allocated a significant portion of the government budget to support radical Muslim groups. Here is a summary of his promises and manifesto when he was Jakarta governor:

https://www.infoindonesia.id/info-polhukam/pr-9617027504/Deretan-Janji-Anies-Baswedan-yang-Cuma-Manis-di-Bibir-

Account Ini Telah Disuspend Sementara

• 0% Down Payment affordable Houses: 2,332 units from the target of 232,214 (Result: 1%).
• Safe houses for women and children victims of violence, four units from the target of 267 (Result: 1.5%).
• The Construction of "Science Park": Result: 0%
• Development of the Jakarta LRT by regional Jakarta Governmental enterprises, BUMD PT Jakpro: Result: 0%
• Construction of LRT in other part of Indonesia in Collaboration between Regional Government and Business Entities (PDBU): Result: 0%
• River normalization: Result: 0%.
• Intermediate Treatment Facility (ITF) in the city to reduce waste: Result: 0%., etc

Please be aware that the provided links may not be the most dependable sources, but they can serve as a starting point for cross-referencing with multiple credible sources. I can confirm from my own knowledge that many of these manifestos were announced.

In addition to his association with radical organizations, he has a tendency to say everything what people would want to hear in order to secure election victories. Here's another set of sweet promises from his current presidential campaign:

https://www.cnbcindonesia.com/news/...ji-manis-kalau-terpilih-jadi-presiden-ini-dia Anies makes a sweet manifesto if he is elected president, here it is

His Vice presidential candidate make this promise

Viral Janji BBM Gratis Jika Cak Imin Menang, PKB: Kita Sudah Kaji

Beredar video Wakil Sekretaris Jenderal (Wasekjen) PKB Syaiful Huda sedang berorasi apabila Ketum Muhaimin Iskandar (Cak Imin) menang di Pemilu 2024 maka BBm akan disubsidi untuk pengendara sepeda motor.

www.tvonenews.com

"Free fuel for Motorbike owners"

 

[pantaiema]

Will Prabowo's health become an issue? He has a serious limp that seems to be getting more noticeable and his weight might readily lead to diabetes and related problems. Then of course there was Franklin D Roosevelt who was president for 12 years despite being confined to a wheelchair.

In my opinion, typically, this should not be the case for someone who used to be part of a special forces. Special forces members become accustomed to rigorous training that pushes the limits of human boundaries. This is reflected to their body shape and fitness. But did he really do the same training like anyone else in special force, considering he was Suharto's son in law at that time and was prepared to protect Suharto's empire.

Consider the life of individuals like the former SAS, Navy Seals, Sayeret Matkal, and Spetsnaz members who are in their 60s. The exception would be if they became disabled while serving in combat mission.

As mentioned earlier, this guy's journey to becoming an army general is remarkable, considering there's no record of him serving on the frontline battle involving gunfire exchange.

 

[centurion]

The one good thing about the VP choices is that it pretty much ensured Anies is out of the game.

Woud not bet on this 100%. Many voters inclined to Prabowo because he was alternative to Jokowi before, which is not the case anymore with nepo baby in the game. There would be probably a shitshow at some moment between PDIP and Jokowi, increasing rice prices, declining rupiah etc.

From the other side, Anies is polished, educated, speaks English, promissing change (for worse, but who cares). His incompetence is not so important, as all candidates have mediocre or no results. His campaign is good, and sometimes government cancells his rallies, allowing him to play a victim card and giving him free marketing. Anies is a serious and verry talented demagogue.

 

[serious_fun]

Will Prabowo's health become an issue? He has a serious limp that seems to be getting more noticeable and his weight might readily lead to diabetes and related problems. Then of course there was Franklin D Roosevelt who was president for 12 years despite being confined to a wheelchair.

I was under the impression that he only need to have one healthy hand so that he could accept gift envelopes.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

I was just thinking about the fact that jokowi's son did his high school (age 15-18) in Singapore not in Indonesia.
I thought Jokowi was all about nationalism in terms of buying Indonesian products and not importing foreign goods\services.
Why would he tell everybody else to do that, but when it comes to his own family he sends them to get better quality education in Singapore?

 

[harryopal1]

I was under the impression that he only need to have one healthy hand so that he could accept gift envelopes.

Now your name has just been added to Prabowo's list.

 

[fastpitch17]

Woud not bet on this 100%. Many voters inclined to Prabowo because he was alternative to Jokowi before, which is not the case anymore with nepo baby in the game. There would be probably a shitshow at some moment between PDIP and Jokowi, increasing rice prices, declining rupiah etc.

From the other side, Anies is polished, educated, speaks English, promissing change (for worse, but who cares). His incompetence is not so important, as all candidates have mediocre or no results. His campaign is good, and sometimes government cancells his rallies, allowing him to play a victim card and giving him free marketing. Anies is a serious and verry talented demagogue.

Anies doesn't have either of the largest Muslim organizations. Without them, you have little chance.