DON'T PANIC.... well, maybe a little bit.

[atlantis]

To comment on it, being it agreing or disagreing but in a balanced, constructed argumentation.
Calling "trash" everything that does not match YOUR point of view, is not really a balanced, well constructed argumentation...

Do you want me to paste you links to YOUR posts where you answered a poster that his answer was idiotic or posts of yours being insulting to fellow forum members ? Please, as we say in french... balayes devant ta porte....etc

Vaccine effectiveness and Herd Immunity

I played cops and robbers as a kid. Also dressed up as a Stormtrooper from Star Wars for Halloween. Does that count? Oh and damn the man! Yeah your probably still playing the cop.

www.expatindo.org

Vaccine effectiveness and Herd Immunity

I played cops and robbers as a kid. Also dressed up as a Stormtrooper from Star Wars for Halloween. Does that count? Oh and damn the man! Yeah your probably still playing the cop.

www.expatindo.org

DON'T PANIC.... well, maybe a little bit.

Discrimination based on behavior is acceptable, and if it’s based on performance it is usually justifiable. Vaccination record has always been a requirement here in USA for public schools, at least in all the states I know. If your kid is not vaccinated, she’s not mingling with a class full of...

www.expatindo.org

https://www.expatindo.org/community...ness-and-herd-immunity.6234/page-4#post-79440

DON'T PANIC.... well, maybe a little bit.

Similarly, I have been putting off going to the dentist since this all kicked off. I have 2 bridges and they had gone a bit dodgy and needed replacing. Last night one of them fell out in my bathroom when I was brushing my teeth (not pain whatsoever - they are maryland bridges so they have...

www.expatindo.org

NB: The five links above are just excerpts showing your abuses and why it is pretty rich to read your quoted comment.

 

[Hawk256]

Back on topic. Interesting take on how the vaccine is affecting possible mutations. Looks like we have to take a whole new approach with Delta. The old rules don't necessarily apply any more.

Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant

As cases of the Delta variant surge, vaccinated people who don't mask up may increase the risk that vaccine-resistant variants develop, a study says.

www.yahoo.com

 

[R Cameron]

Back on topic. Interesting take on how the vaccine is affecting possible mutations. Looks like we have to take a whole new approach with Delta. The old rules don't necessarily apply any more.

Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant

As cases of the Delta variant surge, vaccinated people who don't mask up may increase the risk that vaccine-resistant variants develop, a study says.

www.yahoo.com

The only way vaccines are affecting possible mutations is to reduce the liklihood. Mutations are random, they have no will or desire to evade vaccination or medication. Since they are random, they increase in direct proportion to number of viral replications.

There are vastly more viral replications in the unvaccinated population (even with Delta, even with breakthrough cases) than in the vaccinated population, so if you compare a large number of vaccinated people with the same number of unvaccinated people, it is far more likely for a new variant to emerge in the unvaccinated group.

One of those mutations may have the ability to infect vaccinated people as easily as unvaccinated people, but it is far more likely to first emerge in an unvaccinated person, and the best way to prevent this from happening is minimizing (ideally eradicating) Covid19 replication globally as fast as possible.

The vaccines are best tool for that job, and time is of the essence. It's also a global problem, no country with high vaccination should be feeling safe and comfortable, they should be working rapidly to distribute their excess doses to the globe.

 

[Hawk256]

The only way vaccines are affecting possible mutations is to reduce the liklihood. Mutations are random, they have no will or desire to evade vaccination or medication. Since they are random, they increase in direct proportion to number of viral replications.

Did you read the article? It doesn't sound like it because it says exactly the opposite. If you are more of an expert than CDC director Rochelle Walensky or published research from the journal Scientific Reports who were cited in the article, then you should take your objections up with them. But yes vaccinations are the tool to help but we can't keep up with the virus so far.

 

[Nimbus]

To comment on it, being it agreing or disagreing but in a balanced, constructed argumentation.
Calling "trash" everything that does not match YOUR point of view, is not really a balanced, well constructed argumentation...

You often call other arguments idiotic, so you don’t get to complain when others do the same to you.

You want others to speak politely to you? You need to start by being polite to people.

 

[Nimbus]

Did you read the article? It doesn't sound like it because it says exactly the opposite. If you are more of an expert than CDC director Rochelle Walensky or published research from the journal Scientific Reports who were cited in the article, then you should take your objections up with them.

I read the article, and this is the exact quote of a paragraph in it.

“The researchers concluded that, in an environment where Delta is spreading among all people - regardless of vaccination status - it is imperative to get more people vaccinated immediately to prevent the emergence of a new vaccine-resistant variant.”

 

[Hawk256]

I read the article, and this is the exact quote of a paragraph in it.

“The researchers concluded that, in an environment where Delta is spreading among all people - regardless of vaccination status - it is imperative to get more people vaccinated immediately to prevent the emergence of a new vaccine-resistant variant.”

I never said that vaccines were not important. I posted an article and commented that it was interesting. That was all I said. The title of the article is "Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant". You read the same article as me. If you don't think it's interesting, then you are free to disagree with me. However, if you don't like the title or content, your beef is not with me.

 

[ChrisTex]

The only way vaccines are affecting possible mutations is to reduce the liklihood. Mutations are random, they have no will or desire to evade vaccination or medication. Since they are random, they increase in direct proportion to number of viral replications.

Damn it, I wanted to choose which mutant power I got.

 

[R Cameron]

I never said that vaccines were not important. I posted an article and commented that it was interesting. That was all I said.

No, that's not all you said:

Interesting take on how the vaccine is affecting possible mutations. Looks like we have to take a whole new approach with Delta. The old rules don't necessarily apply any more.

Vaccines don't "affect possible mutations", they simply don't. Yes, new information about viral replication of Delta in vaccinated people makes the liklihood of additional variants arising greater. But the same rules absolutely apply.

"Don't argue with me, that's what the experts said" doesn't work when you totally misunderstand or misrepresent what the experts actually said.

 

[Hawk256]

No, that's not all you said:


Vaccines don't "affect possible mutations", they simply don't. Yes, new information about viral replication of Delta in vaccinated people makes the liklihood of additional variants arising greater. But the same rules absolutely apply.

"Don't argue with me, that's what the experts said" doesn't work when you totally misunderstand or misrepresent what the experts actually said.

I read the same article as you. The title says it all and the article backs up the title. Maybe we understand the article differently. I can assure you my goal is not to misrepresent anything. I will tell you like I was told. It's not my responsibility to make sure you understand the article. You are on your own. My original comment was basically "here is an interesting article about how the vaccine is affecting possible mutations." If you have a problem with that statement then feel free to disagree all day long. Do you not think we need a different approach to Delta, the article seem to think so. The rest is up to you. But the title "Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant" clearly states the intent of the article and is backed up by the article. I don't really have any thing else to add to it at this point. Other than the title should give you a clue. Read it out loud to yourself.

 

[HappyMan]

I read the same article as you. The title says it all and the article backs up the title. Maybe we understand the article differently. I can assure you my goal is not to misrepresent anything. I will tell you like I was told. It's not my responsibility to make sure you understand the article. You are on your own. My original comment was basically "here is an interesting article about how the vaccine is affecting possible mutations." If you have a problem with that statement then feel free to disagree all day long. Do you not think we need a different approach to Delta, the article seem to think so. The rest is up to you. But the title "Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant" clearly states the intent of the article and is backed up by the article. I don't really have any thing else to add to it at this point. Other than the title should give you a clue. Read it out loud to yourself.

The article does not in any way imply that "the vaccine is affecting possible mutations." The article says that Delta is increasing the possibility of new mutations, by infecting even the vaccinated. This is not an effect from from the vaccine, it is an effect from Delta, in spite of the vaccine.
To say that the vaccine is affecting mutations seems to imply that the vaccine is increasing the chance of mutation, which is a direct contradiction of what the article says, as quoted above by R Cameron... Unless your intention was to imply that the vaccine is affecting the chance of mutations by reducing it?
If you feel misunderstood, you could write less "click bait" style posts that make your views a bit clearer.

 

[R Cameron]

Do you not think we need a different approach to Delta, the article seem to think so.

No, neither I, nor the article, nor the CDC think we need a different approach to vaccine escape because of Delta. The solution is the same, reduce replication, primarily through vaccinating as many as possible as quickly as possible. Delta has made that more urgent and less hopeful, but the strategy is entirely the same.

You should also start ignoring the titles of articles in formulating any meaningful thoughts. They typically aren't written by the journalist who wrote the article, they are written by an "editor" focused on picking the one piece our that will get the most clicks, even if it's irrelevant to the main point of the article.

 

[Nimbus]

I never said that vaccines were not important. I posted an article and commented that it was interesting. That was all I said. The title of the article is "Coronavirus transmission among vaccinated people could raise the risk of an even more dangerous variant". You read the same article as me. If you don't think it's interesting, then you are free to disagree with me. However, if you don't like the title or content, your beef is not with me.

You posted an article with a provocative headline, yet when you’re called on it you said “it’s just interesting”.

I was born at night, but I wasn’t born last night. There are quack doctors on Facebook employing precisely this method. They never say outright that vaccines are bad, but they go out of their way to find any article doubting the effectiveness of vaccines. This method is not new, it even has a name: FUD (fear, uncertainty, and doubt).

If you’re an honest skeptic, your quotes won’t exclusively be on the side that questions the vaccine.

I still remember when you questioned the long term side effects of vaccines, yet conveniently ignored the potential long term side effects of HCQ and Ivermectin at high doses.

I still remember your insistence on the wrong reading of VAERS data, suggesting that vaccines kill people while conveniently ignoring that Covid is thousands of times deadlier.

Now you toss an article with a clickbait headline suggesting vaccines may create deadlier Coronavirus variants.

There is a pattern here. You may be slightly smarter than that guy from Bali, but not as smart as you think.

 

[Bad_azz]

The article does not in any way imply that "the vaccine is affecting possible mutations." The article says that Delta is increasing the possibility of new mutations, by infecting even the vaccinated. This is not an effect from from the vaccine, it is an effect from Delta, in spite of the vaccine.
To say that the vaccine is affecting mutations seems to imply that the vaccine is increasing the chance of mutation, which is a direct contradiction of what the article says, as quoted above by R Cameron... Unless your intention was to imply that the vaccine is affecting the chance of mutations by reducing it?
If you feel misunderstood, you could write less "click bait" style posts that make your views a bit clearer.

Just felt I had to pop in & say :Nice usage of affect/effect there HM.

 

[Hawk256]

You posted an article with a provocative headline, yet when you’re called on it you said “it’s just interesting”.

I was born at night, but I wasn’t born last night. There are quack doctors on Facebook employing precisely this method. They never say outright that vaccines are bad, but they go out of their way to find any article doubting the effectiveness of vaccines. This method is not new, it even has a name: FUD (fear, uncertainty, and doubt).

If you’re an honest skeptic, your quotes won’t exclusively be on the side that questions the vaccine.

I still remember when you questioned the long term side effects of vaccines, yet conveniently ignored the potential long term side effects of HCQ and Ivermectin at high doses.

I still remember your insistence on the wrong reading of VAERS data, suggesting that vaccines kill people while conveniently ignoring that Covid is thousands of times deadlier.

Now you toss an article with a clickbait headline suggesting vaccines may create deadlier Coronavirus variants.

There is a pattern here. You may be slightly smarter than that guy from Bali, but not as smart as you think.

The article is what it is. I don't question vaccines in general for their usefulness but I will point out facts that seem unpopular. I thought it was an interesting article. It sounds like you know all the answers and don't want to entertain anything that might be different.

I never ignored the long term effects of HCG and Ivermectin. My statement was that there are people against HCG and Ivermectin because we haven't done long term high dose studies but they don't have a problem with not having long term studies on the vaccines.

I didn't insist on the wrong reading of VAERS. I mentioned it and when I was told it was wrong I didn't use it again. I did say that's all we have for now but I still dropped it.

Clickbait? I guess if you want to think it is but it's still a valid article. If it's not then all you have to do is say so and move on. Maybe it's more fun to attack me.

I never claimed to be smart. It seems to me that anyone that doesn't share the same opinion is treated differently than everyone else. Doesn't bother me. Don't read my posts and certainly don't respond if you don't want to.

Some people have no problem hearing opposing viewpoints but I guess some do. I have the vaccine and have never told anyone not to take it. What I have done is post things that seem to get under peoples skin because they personally don't like what it says.

 

[Hawk256]

Mutations are random, they have no will or desire to evade vaccination or medication.

Another article that seems to at least entertain the fact that it doesn't always seem to be the case.

Virus used world’s longest Covid sufferer as ‘gym’ to get fitter, say scientists

The world's longest Covid sufferer had the virus for nearly 11 months during which time it mutated 40 times, using her as a "gym" to get fitter, scientists have discovered.

www.yahoo.com

 

[R Cameron]

It seems to me that anyone that doesn't share the same opinion is treated differently than everyone else. Doesn't bother me. Don't read my posts and certainly don't respond if you don't want to.

Some people have no problem hearing opposing viewpoints but I guess some do. I have the vaccine and have never told anyone not to take it. What I have done is post things that seem to get under peoples skin because they personally don't like what it says.

No, it's not personal or dislike of your ideas, it's your pattern of fundamentally misunderstanding or misusing your sources and presenting your own commentary as an accurate summary of a serious source.

Go back several pages, you will see Nimbus speak negatively of Ivermectin, I disagreed and we have a cordial exchange including some opinion and some peer reviewed studies, and I think Nimbus was very accepting of an opposing viewpoint.

You can't post commentary presented as fact on an important topic and then be upset when others show you the faults in your sources or your understanding.

 

[Hawk256]

No, it's not personal or dislike of your ideas, it's your pattern of fundamentally misunderstanding or misusing your sources and presenting your own commentary as an accurate summary of a serious source.

Go back several pages, you will see Nimbus speak negatively of Ivermectin, I disagreed and we have a cordial exchange including some opinion and some peer reviewed studies, and I think Nimbus was very accepting of an opposing viewpoint.

You can't post commentary presented as fact on an important topic and then be upset when others show you the faults in your sources or your understanding.

I'm not upset if someone finds faults in facts or my understanding and I don't think I have ever claimed that my commentary was fact. I guess accuracy is up for debate. Feel free to call me out anytime you think so. The purpose of this post was for responding to Nimbus and clearing the air.

 

[harryopal1]

Just watching an Indonesian TV news report about zoo animals in Jakarta catching the Covid virus... at least a tiger... followed by an "epidemiologist" reassuring viewers that the animals could not transmit the disease to humans. I am easily confused but I thought the whole pandemic related to the Covid virus passing from bats or pigs to humans. The Ebola virus supposedly came from monkeys and the Hendra virus passed from bats to horses and resulted in an number of horse owners dying in Australia. So why would zoo animals not pass the virus to visitors at the zoo?

 

[Dharma Police]

Just watching an Indonesian TV news report about zoo animals in Jakarta catching the Covid virus... at least a tiger... followed by an "epidemiologist" reassuring viewers that the animals could not transmit the disease to humans. I am easily confused but I thought the whole pandemic related to the Covid virus passing from bats or pigs to humans. The Ebola virus supposedly came from monkeys and the Hendra virus passed from bats to horses and resulted in an number of horse owners dying in Australia. So why would zoo animals not pass the virus to visitors at the zoo?

Possibly can't be passed, should not be able to infect, research suggests humans cannot, is all I notice in these reports.