very longterm overstay in Indonesia(help)

[kanmaro]

hello guys, I've been very frustrated lately due to my complicated condition. when I was 6 years old my mom brought me back from Taiwan and that was the year 2000. and now I wanted to just go back to Taiwan for good.
at the moment I don't have any travel documents its all expired.

in here I would like to ask for some advice on what I can do?
should I just go to the immigration? I've seen a lot of cases from the other threads. but it seems that in my case the overstaying period is much more worst than anyone which is almost 20 years.
if I turn myself into the TPI, how worst will it be? please help me! i do really need some advice~

 

[jstar]

I would definitely go to the Taiwanese embassy first. See what they say and what is possible there. Btw, in many countries you lose the citizenship if you never return over a long period of time and have all ID's expire.

 

[dafluff]

hello guys, I've been very frustrated lately due to my complicated condition. when I was 6 years old my mom brought me back from Taiwan and that was the year 2000. and now I wanted to just go back to Taiwan for good.
at the moment I don't have any travel documents its all expired.

in here I would like to ask for some advice on what I can do?
should I just go to the immigration? I've seen a lot of cases from the other threads. but it seems that in my case the overstaying period is much more worst than anyone which is almost 20 years.
if I turn myself into the TPI, how worst will it be? please help me! i do really need some advice~

Agree with @jstar above. First ensure that you have Taiwanese citizenship and the ability to go back to Taiwan. Contact the embassy, to also obtain new travel documents. Since your overstaying in Indonesia is not your fault (ie. moved here as a minor), the embassy may also be more willing to help, compared to cases where overstay is due to own neglect.

 

[atlantis]

I concur with the above posts. Albeit I am not sure there is a Taiwanese embassy per se in Jakarta, which would certainly piss off Beijing, the Taipei Economic & Trade office has a division for the Taiwanese Expatriate Community in Indonesia. Below is their address if you don't have it:

Gedung Artha Graha, Lt. 17
Jl. Jend. Sudirman Kav. 52-53
Jakarta 12190, Indonesia

Tel：021-5153939
Fax：021-5154228
E-mail：[email protected]

First thing to do before going to Imigrasi is to get you a taiwanese travel document. Without a valid passport Imigrasi should have no other choice than detaining you till they can deport you, which is certainly not something you want.

As it has been hinted before, in many countries you lose the citizenship if you never return over a long period of time however rare are these countries which would strip a citizen from his/her citienship if it is known that it would make him/her stateless.

I know little about the citizenship code of Taiwan but a Taiwanese friend of mine told me that if any of your parents were Taiwanese at the time of your birth, you should be granted the Taiwanese citizenship.

 

[jstar]

Yeah, you can't really call it an embassy but it gets close. Quite some (female) TKI* in Taiwanese factories on three year contracts. (A former maid now makes 8 Juta there. but agents' costs are high. Her friend even got married there.)

Btw, there's also one of those 'trade offices' in Surabaya. Depending where the OP resides.

首頁 - 駐泗水臺北經濟貿易辦事處 Taipei Economic and Trade Office in Surabaya

www.roc-taiwan.org

* TKW (for glossary @BPNBound : female Indonesian working abroad)

 

[kanmaro]

I would definitely go to the Taiwanese embassy first. See what they say and what is possible there. Btw, in many countries you lose the citizenship if you never return over a long period of time and have all ID's expire.

Agree with @jstar above. First ensure that you have Taiwanese citizenship and the ability to go back to Taiwan. Contact the embassy, to also obtain new travel documents. Since your overstaying in Indonesia is not your fault (ie. moved here as a minor), the embassy may also be more willing to help, compared to cases where overstay is due to own neglect.

I have called my dad and he said that my data is still in the KK in Taiwan (kartu keluarga). and he said that it will not be a problem for me to get the citizenship once I step in the Taiwan soil.

I concur with the above posts. Albeit I am not sure there is a Taiwanese embassy per se in Jakarta, which would certainly piss off Beijing, the Taipei Economic & Trade office has a division for the Taiwanese Expatriate Community in Indonesia. Below is their address if you don't have it:

Gedung Artha Graha, Lt. 17
Jl. Jend. Sudirman Kav. 52-53
Jakarta 12190, Indonesia

Tel：021-5153939
Fax：021-5154228
E-mail：[email protected]

First thing to do before going to Imigrasi is to get you a taiwanese travel document. Without a valid passport Imigrasi should have no other choice than detaining you till they can deport you, which is certainly not something you want.

As it has been hinted before, in many countries you lose the citizenship if you never return over a long period of time however rare are these countries which would strip a citizen from his/her citienship if it is known that it would make him/her stateless.

I know little about the citizenship code of Taiwan but a Taiwanese friend of mine told me that if any of your parents were Taiwanese at the time of your birth, you should be granted the Taiwanese citizenship.

thanks for the helpful information atlantis.

the problem now is that how am I going to explain to the immigration of how I live in Indonesia for this long ? because thing is that my mom gave me a totally different identity here in Indonesia. and if i tell the truth, I'm afraid that I would involve my mom and her siblings who have helped her in making my identity here.

and plus with this kind of condition im afraid that immigration will fine me a lot of money.

 

[Dave70]

I have called my dad and he said that my data is still in the KK in Taiwan (kartu keluarga). and he said that it will not be a problem for me to get the citizenship once I step in the Taiwan soil.



thanks for the helpful information atlantis.

the problem now is that how am I going to explain to the immigration of how I live in Indonesia for this long ? because thing is that my mom gave me a totally different identity here in Indonesia. and if i tell the truth, I'm afraid that I would involve my mom and her siblings who have helped her in making my identity here.

and plus with this kind of condition im afraid that immigration will fine me a lot of money.

Aha! If you have Indonesian citizenship, get Indonesian passport and apply for Taiwan tourist visa. Once you arrive in Taiwan, your dad can get you residency permit while processing your Taiwan citizenship. The problem could be involving your mom to get Indonesian passport, but I'm not sure because you are already an adult person.

 

[kanmaro]

Aha! If you have Indonesian citizenship, get Indonesian passport and apply for Taiwan tourist visa. Once you arrive in Taiwan, your dad can get you residency permit while processing your Taiwan citizenship. The problem could be involving your mom to get Indonesian passport, but I'm not sure because you are already an adult person.

the thing is that the passport im holding now and my taiwanese identity is not the same.
or maybe you meant that i just sneak in to taiwan and just turn myself into the police? and just try to explain my condition?

 

[jstar]

Well, if you have an Indonesian passport etc. it's not an overstay situation at all.

Just go there and let your family take action...perhaps with help from a Taiwanese lawyer if they encounter difficulties.

In the worst case scenario you can always come back.

 

[atlantis]

Aha! If you have Indonesian citizenship, get Indonesian passport

It seems that it would be difficult for him to have an Indonesian passport, at least legally. He came for the first time in Indonesia in 2000 and is born from a foreign father. Back in year 2000, the citizenship law of Indonesia (UU 52/1958 was the relevant statute at the time) was denying him Indonesian citizenship because citizenship was transmitted by the father and the father only.

As a consequence, it is very probable that his mother made an "arrangement" with either his birth certificate or any other document so that he can stay here without too many question being asked. This is in this case an important notion to grasp because Kanmaro may suffer the consequences of it now, eventhough he has no guilt in what has probably happened.

Unfortunately quite a few kids have been in similar situation, some having their birth certificate rewritten or modified so that a different father or no father appear on it. I know a couple of case in my circle and I suspect that there are much, much more than just a few if we consider that I am personally aware of two just in a small city than the one I live in. Detailing here these two cases would probably stunned most foreigners who are used to a different type of Administration that we got here.

This kind of "arrangement" has had a consequence on these kids when in 2006 the Citizenship Law of Indonesia has changed. It has simply bared those kids to access dual citizenship. Difficult for the mother to go the Kanwil and say "I would like my son/daughter to have dual citizenship as per the law but here is what I did..."

I understand that Kanmaro may not want to go into too much details and want to be cautious. If he does have an Indonesian passport, expired or not, the legality of said passport may be seriously questioned considering what I said in my paragraph 1 and if, as I suspect, the mother has never applied for dual citizenship for him.

I have been proposed a KTP WNI in the past, and so did a couple of foreign friends of mine. If I would have accepted it, it wouldn''t have made me Indonesian legally despite having a KTP WNI to show. A friend accepted a KTP WNI and I hope he is not foolish enough to believe that he is Indonesian legally just because he has a KTP WNI. The fact that Kanmaro may (or may not) have an Indonesian passport does NOT make him a LEGAL Indonesian citizen. This is where the trick is.

Whatever Kanmaro decides, flashing Indonesian documents to officials is perhaps not wise and may have his mother in trouble. It all depends on what she has done for him to come and stay in Indonesia while he was obviously not entitled to Indonesian citizenship being born in 1994 (arrived in 2000 at the age of 6 y.o as per the OP's post) from a foreign father.,

To answer one of Kanmaro's question: Imigrasi can not fine you at all. If you are legally considered a foreigner, your overstay is far too long for you to be liable of a fine.

 

[kanmaro]

It seems that it would be difficult for him to have an Indonesian passport, at least legally. He came for the first time in Indonesia in 2000 and is born from a foreign father. Back in year 2000, the citizenship law of Indonesia (UU 52/1958 was the relevant statute at the time) was denying him Indonesian citizenship because citizenship was transmitted by the father and the father only.

As a consequence, it is very probable that his mother made an "arrangement" with either his birth certificate or any other document so that he can stay here without too many question being asked. This is in this case an important notion to grasp because Kanmaro may suffer the consequences of it now, eventhough he has no guilt in what has probably happened.

Unfortunately quite a few kids have been in similar situation, some having their birth certificate rewritten or modified so that a different father or no father appear on it. I know a couple of case in my circle and I suspect that there are much, much more than just a few if we consider that I am personally aware of two just in a small city than the one I live in. Detailing here these two cases would probably stunned most foreigners who are used to a different type of Administration that we got here.

This kind of "arrangement" has had a consequence on these kids when in 2006 the Citizenship Law of Indonesia has changed. It has simply bared those kids to access dual citizenship. Difficult for the mother to go the Kanwil and say "I would like my son/daughter to have dual citizenship as per the law but here is what I did..."

I understand that Kanmaro may not want to go into too much details and want to be cautious. If he does have an Indonesian passport, expired or not, the legality of said passport may be seriously questioned considering what I said in my paragraph 1 and if, as I suspect, the mother has never applied for dual citizenship for him.

I have been proposed a KTP WNI in the past, and so did a couple of foreign friends of mine. If I would have accepted it, it wouldn''t have made me Indonesian legally despite having a KTP WNI to show. A friend accepted a KTP WNI and I hope he is not foolish enough to believe that he is Indonesian legally just because he has a KTP WNI. The fact that Kanmaro may (or may not) have an Indonesian passport does NOT make him a LEGAL Indonesian citizen. This is where the trick is.

Whatever Kanmaro decides, flashing Indonesian documents to officials is perhaps not wise and may have his mother in trouble. It all depends on what she has done for him to come and stay in Indonesia while he was obviously not entitled to Indonesian citizenship being born in 1994 (arrived in 2000 at the age of 6 y.o as per the OP's post) from a foreign father.,

To answer one of Kanmaro's question: Imigrasi can not fine you at all. If you are legally considered a foreigner, your overstay is far too long for you to be liable of a fine.

Thank you Atlantis for trying to study about my case and giving this info to me.
my case is very complicated so i really need to find the best solution so my mom wouldnt be in trouble for her. and im also kind of afraid if im not able to come back here to visit my mom anymore.

 

[dafluff]

the problem now is that how am I going to explain to the immigration of how I live in Indonesia for this long ? because thing is that my mom gave me a totally different identity here in Indonesia. and if i tell the truth, I'm afraid that I would involve my mom and her siblings who have helped her in making my identity here.

and plus with this kind of condition im afraid that immigration will fine me a lot of money.

The legal way of doing this in your situation would be to get the Taiwan mission in Indonesia to issue you new travel documents, then surrender to immigration and have them deport you. It is very likely you will not be allowed back into Indonesia for sometime after that.

You could say that you receive help from your family in Taiwan, and that you no longer have contact with your family here in Indonesia and that they have abandoned you. If you go down this path I would absolutely not mention any Indonesian fake documents you may have.

 

[kanmaro]

The legal way of doing this in your situation would be to get the Taiwan mission in Indonesia to issue you new travel documents, then surrender to immigration and have them deport you. It is very likely you will not be allowed back into Indonesia for sometime after that.

You could say that you receive help from your family in Taiwan, and that you no longer have contact with your family here in Indonesia and that they have abandoned you. If you go down this path I would absolutely not mention any Indonesian fake documents you may have.

it is do-able but than I don't have anything to prove to them that I receive help from my family in Taiwan. and i bet that they will be very interested to make it hard for me to be deported.

 

[kanmaro]

got my Taiwanese citizenship guys, so long story short went to the embassy to get my passport, they are very helpful to me because before going there I've already ask them, what are documents i have to provide in order to prove myself, so brought them there show them some photos of me growing up from baby to an adult. after I got my passport, so how I did it is I used Indo passport to exit Indonesia and then enter with my Taiwan passport.
not gonna lie this whole journey is crazy, because i really thought that it would be very difficult and i might go to the jail, and have to deal with the indo officials which they would probably try to milk me, i bet that for sure. but im very blessed, everything went very smoothly.
Im very sorry guys to take this long to post this update. cheers~
and also thanks to the members in this community for helping me solve my case back then ~
@atlantis
@jstar

 

[Vulgarian]

Congratulations! Love an update, especially from so long ago. Glad everything worked out and welcome back.

 

[Hawk256]

Nice to hear a story with a good ending. They are getting harder and harder to find.

 

[snpark]

Hopefully it didn't take you 4 years though

 

[pantaiema]

got my Taiwanese citizenship guys, so long story short went to the embassy to get my passport, they are very helpful to me because before going there I've already ask them, what are documents i have to provide in order to prove myself, so brought them there show them some photos of me growing up from baby to an adult. after I got my passport, so how I did it is I used Indo passport to exit Indonesia and then enter with my Taiwan passport.
not gonna lie this whole journey is crazy, because i really thought that it would be very difficult and i might go to the jail, and have to deal with the indo officials which they would probably try to milk me, i bet that for sure. but im very blessed, everything went very smoothly.
Im very sorry guys to take this long to post this update. cheers~
and also thanks to the members in this community for helping me solve my case back then ~
@atlantis
@jstar

Good to hear a happy ending. May I ask when you said "how I did it is I used Indo passport to exit Indonesia and then enter with my Taiwan passport." Do you mean you leave Indonesia using your Indonesian Passport and then you Enter Taiwan using your Taiwanese Passport ??

 

[flavus]

Good to hear a happy ending. May I ask when you said "how I did it is I used Indo passport to exit Indonesia and then enter with my Taiwan passport." Do you mean you leave Indonesia using your Indonesian Passport and then you Enter Taiwan using your Taiwan Passport ??

I'm curious too. Indonesian passport holders require e-visa to enter Taiwan as far as I can tell. Did you stop in Singapore or somewhere else and swap passports?

 

[Nimbus]

Good to hear a happy ending. May I ask when you said "how I did it is I used Indo passport to exit Indonesia and then enter with my Taiwan passport." Do you mean you leave Indonesia using your Indonesian Passport and then you Enter Taiwan using your Taiwan Passport ??

That’s exactly how he did it. Indonesian passport holders can apply online for a Taiwan visa, so it doesn’t require a visa sticker in the passport. This means the airline boarding agent at the airport only needs to see the ticket and the Indonesian passport. Indonesian immigration checked that the boarding pass matched the passport, then let him leave. When he arrived in Taiwan, they had to let him in because he got a Taiwanese passport.

This doesn’t work for countries / regions that still use visa stickers for Indonesians, like USA and Schengen Europe. The boarding agent will require a visa sticker from USA or a European country before issuing a boarding pass. Dual passport holders typically fly to a third country, where they will show the second passport to the boarding agent over there.