PLN bill doubled for no feasible reason...

R Cameron

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I haven’t been able to add more than 1 juta credit to our prepaid system. I think we have 2.3kw system.
1 juta is the most I have been able to make in a single purchase, but can you purchase 1 juta twice and add both?
 

Jaime C

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1 juta is the most I have been able to make in a single purchase, but can you purchase 1 juta twice and add both?
I have tried, but not able to add it twice. Only weeks later, could I add more pulsa.
 

Banana72

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Not our PLN but our PAM went up from 200rb to 700rb/mth for the past three months...after numerous visits and stalling from the company (ibu tolong foto selama sebulan), we went directly to the office to complain...the response "wah pas lagi murah nggak complain, pas lagi mahal baru dateng". *facepalm* Wife's sister knows 'a guy' who helped replacing her broken meter promised to come by this afternoon to check on things (after asking us to widen/demolish part of the concrete area where the meter is located...) we'll see..sometimes they just guestimate your number with the excuse that nobody's home, etc and who knows the meter can have errors too.
 

make_batik_great_again

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Why not? If you're not using a lot of electricity, a 2kW system is about US$3000. It will produce about 7kWh/day, which is about $0.77 per day. which is about $281/year. So around 11 year payback IF PLN rates don't go up. If it keeps going up at the same annual rate since 2004 then:
1st year - $281
2nd year - $300
3rd year - $322
4th year - $344
5th year - $368
6th year - $394
7th year - $422
8th year - $451
9th year - $482

So about 8.5 years payback if PLN rates continue going up like it has been the last 13 years.

Another way to look at it is how much it will cost you to produce electricity from the system over its lifetime. Assuming the lifetime is only 20 years and you have to put in $2000 in that time for maintenance, inverter replacement, etc, then the system will produce electricity at a cost of: $5000/51,100kWh = around 9.8 cents. For the whole of 20 years.

Now these are very simplified calculations of course. There are things like Levelized Cost of Electricity, IRR, etc that can be done to look at the economics.

Once again, I am surprised in a positive way of how many different topics there have been already discussed in this forum. Really great that, in this community, there are so many people who are interested in several and very different subjects (y)

My wife and I also begin to get information about solar panels now since we plan to buy land and build a house. I would definitely suggest anyone who is doing a financial calculation about this topic to consider not only the amount of money but also the time when the money is spent (as always when you think about investment)...since today´s money is worth more than money in the future (at least, in times of inflation and positive rates of interest - like still the case in Indonesia :) ). The mentioned IRR, for example, is one of the instruments I would consider using.

I personally would prefer solar penals even if it was, in a purely financial view, disadvantegeous. But I like the idea of knowing where the power for my devices comes from and that is from a renewable energy source. Of course, it depends on the amount of the additional costs that we would have to pay compared to conventional energy sources. But hopefully, we will know about that after talking to some suppliers of solar panels in our location in the nearer future so that we have a clearer picture then.

Subsidization by the government would be great of course and it would faciliate the step of choosing solar energy, but I assume the situation is the same like in 2017 when this topic was discussed in this thread...still no subsidization of solar energy in RI?
 

rabbit_39

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No there is no subsidy. But there is a new rooftop PV regulation that just came out a few months ago. Will write more if there is an interest. I wrote a policy review covering the regulation paragraph by paragraph. Will need someone to remind me if anyone is interested. I have 6 papers due by January 1st!
 

make_batik_great_again

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No there is no subsidy. But there is a new rooftop PV regulation that just came out a few months ago. Will write more if there is an interest. I wrote a policy review covering the regulation paragraph by paragraph. Will need someone to remind me if anyone is interested. I have 6 papers due by January 1st!

I hope you were successful finishing your papers :) Would be very interested in your policy review :)
 

make_batik_great_again

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Thank you Rabbit_39 for your posts in this thread, they answer my questions about why solar panels are still not very popular here in Indonesia. What a shame.
Since this thread is over a year old, I'm wondering if since then there are any forum users who have installed solar panels on their house. My sister in law wants to install solar panels on her roof and she asked me for advise. Back home many people have them, but here?

Did your sister in law install solar panels in the meantime? And if so, good experience so far?
 

Pak Tani

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Did your sister in law install solar panels in the meantime? And if so, good experience so far?
Unfortunately PLN in her area was unable to help her with questions about an EXIM-meter, let alone install one. Same as here where we live, they didn't have clue what I was talking about.
But that's two years ago. Hopefully things have changed for the better since then.
 

jstar

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Also our PLN tells a lot of BS when we asked. (Just like on prepaid meters.) And I know the PLN directives on solar installations providing back to the grid etc. were already written in 2013/14.

For those who wonder; here they call it Ekspor/Impor, and thus the meter is called EXIM. This is an example:




The power wall solution, which I love, would have a payback of 15-20 years and I don't plan to keep the house that long.

So solar panels for hot water only, it is. Works well btw.
.
 

rabbit_39

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power wall has batteries, that's why it has a long payback period (given that the cost of electricity is only US$0.10/kWh for the residential consumers). a grid connected solar PV system without battery should have a 6-8 year payback period.
 

jstar

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Yeah, in other countries it probably would be much faster, but combined with the hesitant and even reluctant view of potential buyers here, it doesn't make a lot of sense, financially speaking.
 

make_batik_great_again

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For us, a solar system including batteries could make sense if this provides 100% of the energy we need. At the moment we are planning to buy land which has no access to electricity yet. We have not talked to PLN yet, but I assume we would have to come up for the costs of the electricity access (since we seem to be the first who build in this area)...if they build the poles along the bumpy (but public :) ) road, it would be 1.2 kilometers to the nearest already existing pole...if it is 5 jt per pole and one pole per 100 metres, it would be 60 jt costs for access to (non solar) electricity (eventually plus extra fee).
Probably, this would not be too far away from the costs of a solar system including batteries. And if we build a container house, the solar panel installation would also provide cooling effect for the container.

But we will contact PLN regarding the real costs first, of course. Also we need to clarify if we have to participate in the costs of electricity access of the area if one of the neighbors wants conventional electricity by PLN later. I am not sure how this is usually handled and seen in Indonesia legally. If we were independent from PLN's supply, it would be strange if we had to participate in the costs later...but maybe this is seen as community costs of the people in the area and they could force us!?
 

jstar

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....., it would be 60 jt costs for access to (non solar) electricity (eventually plus extra fee).
Probably, this would not be too far away from the costs of a solar system including batteries.....

Hmm, in my calculation it was times three (3x).

Don't forget genset or so for backup and rainy weeks.
 

make_batik_great_again

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Hmm, in my calculation it was times three (3x).

Don't forget genset or so for backup and rainy weeks.

180 jt? Maybe I underestimated the costs of batteries etc. We will meet someone who offers solar and rain water systems in the next weeks; hopefully, I will have a better knowledge of the costs then :)
 

rabbit_39

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You must know how much your daily energy needs are. Without it you will just get "fooled" by the contractors. When you say "batteries" they see and hear dollar signs (or pink in the case of rupiahs.

You need to list ALL the appliances you will be using and how many hours per day you'll use it. Ideally you'd know what time of day you'll use it.

Then find out how many watts each appliance uses. Multiply hours by watts divided by 1000 and you get kwh.

This is your daily energy use. Divide that number by three and you get how many kwp of solar panels you should install. Multiply that number by two and that's the minimum amount of installed capacity for your batteries.

In my experience, as a VERY loose rule of thumb if you're paying more than $3 per watt peak for a solar system with the amount of battery installed capacity (in kwh) that is more than 4 times the capacity of your solar panels then you MIGHT be overpaying.

Example: you're installing 3kwp of solar panels. The batteries are 15kwh (installed capacity) and you're paying more than 9,000 dollars, I'd shop around first.

Lithium ion batteries will cost more than the above example for the same given installed capacity.
 

make_batik_great_again

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You must know how much your daily energy needs are. Without it you will just get "fooled" by the contractors. When you say "batteries" they see and hear dollar signs (or pink in the case of rupiahs.

You need to list ALL the appliances you will be using and how many hours per day you'll use it. Ideally you'd know what time of day you'll use it.

Then find out how many watts each appliance uses. Multiply hours by watts divided by 1000 and you get kwh.

This is your daily energy use. Divide that number by three and you get how many kwp of solar panels you should install. Multiply that number by two and that's the minimum amount of installed capacity for your batteries.

In my experience, as a VERY loose rule of thumb if you're paying more than $3 per watt peak for a solar system with the amount of battery installed capacity (in kwh) that is more than 4 times the capacity of your solar panels then you MIGHT be overpaying.

Example: you're installing 3kwp of solar panels. The batteries are 15kwh (installed capacity) and you're paying more than 9,000 dollars, I'd shop around first.

Lithium ion batteries will cost more than the above example for the same given installed capacity.

Thank you very much for the detailed information. Very much appreciated...I will incorporate your points into our planning and calculation.
 

make_batik_great_again

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I now heard of so called mini PV solar panels. In Europe also called Guerilla PV. Starting from 150 watt, these panels cover the basic electricity needs so that basic functions (fridge, lights, fans etc.) can be run by solar energy. Installation seems quite simple because the electricity is transmitted by a plug into the socket. And the panels can also be used on balconies so that even people who live in skyscrapers and therefore have no own roof can participate.

Does someone know if these solar panels are allowed and available in Indonesia? I like the idea because 150 watt (or two panels combined approx. 300 watt) is an amount of watt which is probably used 24/7...and therefore, you can use the electricity that the panels produce quite efficiently (without batteries only at daylight of course...but still efficient).

The costs are also quite low, heard of 400 euro (in Europe).
 

Bad_azz

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Just a quick PLN question- has anyone had any issues paying post paid this week?
I couldn't do a bank transfer (my normal MO) so I tried at the local pulsa/token / voucher chappie, he said he couldn't do it due to a system error.
Me being a bit daft never thought to ask if it was his system error or PLN system error. I am unlikely to get out again today or tomorrow to ask elsewhere... hence my question here.
Thanks in advance :*
 

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