Low-Cost Locations: Where Expat Incomes Go Further

[Vanhelsing]

Vietnam appears to be a great place for expats if Expat Insider's survey of 65 countries is any guide. Indonesia sits at 18 for cost of living, which I thought surprising, and 20 in regard to personal finance.

Another list for the list lovers.

In the Expat Insider 2017 survey, 65 countries are listed in the Personal Finance Index. The minimum sample size for a country to be featured is 75 respondents, but nearly 50 countries have a sample size of more than 100 participants.

To give a more rounded picture of the respondents’ financial situation abroad, insights from the Cost of Living Index are included in this summary. Due to its similarity with the Personal Finance Index, however, the Cost of Living Index is not included in the overall country ranking; this prevents the financial aspects of life abroad from being overrepresented in the survey results.

Full article https://www.internations.org/expat-insider/2017/personal-finance-and-cost-of-living-indices-39193

 

[Smallworld]

Lost of living
Czech Rep. no 5 vs Romania 11? Not other way around?

 

[Davita]

Co-incidentally, I was in my local pub a week or so ago and met this single guy, aged around 58. He lives in Vietnam but in a beach city somewhere. He is an avid kite-surfer and that's why he went there. Now he's been to Bali a couple of times he's going to re-locate as he said Bali is more fun and he can still do his sport. I asked about cost of living and he said it's about the same. He also said getting visas for Vietnam was troubling but I didn't pursue this line.
If we meet again I'll ask more and post back.

 

[Vanhelsing]

With Thailand and now Cambodia's long term visas becoming increasingly difficult to maintain or manoeuvre around, quite a few expats (particularly retirees) are considering making the move to Vietnam. From what I've seen just this morning on another expat forum suggests a 12 month multiple entry business visa to Vietnam may not necessarily require a letter from an employer which makes it inviting to a particular expat demographic.

 

[steveandpenny]

Sorry but I call bullshit on that list.
Cost of living is higher in Costa Rica than the United States? And cost of living in Mexico is #2 while Indonesia is #18 bullshit unless they only count the cost of tequlia.

 

[waarmstrong]

Sorry but I call bullshit on that list.
Cost of living is higher in Costa Rica than the United States? And cost of living in Mexico is #2 while Indonesia is #18 bullshit unless they only count the cost of tequlia.

I was thinking the same thing as I read through the list. There is a rather large ghetto of retired Americans residing in Costa Rica to escape the high cost of living in their northern homeland. What is more, the cost of living range in the USA is huge; boiling it down to a single number, makes the result essentially meaningless.

Keep in mind that results based on self-selecting respondents to subjective questions are notoriously unreliable. Expats, as a group, are not too bright, as well.

 

[steveandpenny]

Expats, as a group, are not too bright, as well.

That is true for me but I was smart enough to get the hell out of the states before the last presidential elections. I may be as dumb as a rock but I still rock on.

 

[Puspawarna]

Sorry but I call bullshit on that list.
Cost of living is higher in Costa Rica than the United States? And cost of living in Mexico is #2 while Indonesia is #18 bullshit unless they only count the cost of tequlia.

Agreed. My parents lived in Mexico for a decade or so and were pretty happy with everything about the cost of living except for the legally required severance pay for household staff (which was just as ridiculous as the laws in Indonesia, and enforced to the last peso). Other than that, costs were pretty reasonable.

 

[steveandpenny]

Here is kilo of fresh off the boat yellow tail tuna cut into sushi and tuna steaks. Above is a 3 lbs of Jack tuna. That with a kilo of tomatoes , 6 eggs, a bunch of bananas cost me 10 dollars almost . 120,000 rupees. So fuck that list ! The sushi would have cost me 75 bucks for that much and wouldn't be as good.
True though the beer I will drink with it isn't cheap.

 

[Bad_azz]

I have to agree with you S&P, the lists only tend to calculate what the sheep buy/spend.

What I save in fuel bills & insurance bills alone would keep a family of 4 for a year

Last time I was in my own house in the UK, I was there for 6 weeks in winter. I had to pay the "normal" rate for electricity & gas as I wasn't on any special money saving package... for six weeks £450+ I kid you not, and that was with a log fire burning driftwood in the main living area. (in US terms almost $100 dollars a week!)
Here I have no A/C , I pay around 500,000IDR a month (a tenth of my UK fuel bills)
Then there is the council tax - or whatever they call it- here mine is about 75,000IDR A YEAR!
In UK it was well over £100 a month.
Ciggies- yep, I smoke- I can buy a carton here for the cost of 1 pack in the UK.
Beer & booze, not things I spend much on anywhere as I prefer a cuppa tea/ coffee.
My biggest expenditure here is paying the household help, & paying for visas & permits.

 

[Jaime C]

I own property in Costa Rica. I went there this summer. Not very cheap. If you own property, you can keep expenses down, but for me, a much better quality of life, dollar for dollar in Indonesia.

 

[Puspawarna]

Here is kilo of fresh off the boat yellow tail tuna cut into sushi and tuna steaks. Above is a 3 lbs of Jack tuna.

MMmmmmmmmMMmmMm....that makes my mouth water.

Question for you: do you ever find the tuna "too fresh" for sushi? We used to get fresh-caught tuna for sushi all the time in Micronesia (if you caught it yourself you could bring it to the local restaurants and they'd filet it for you), but the generally held opinion was that just-off-the-boat tuna is too mushy. The restaurants would pop it in the freezer for a few hours, then prep and serve it.

Maybe it was just the power of suggestion, but I've always felt this was a gastronomically correct approach.

 

[rabbit_39]

View attachment 381 Here is kilo of fresh off the boat yellow tail tuna cut into sushi...

Where can the rest of us get the same deal?

 

[steveandpenny]

MMmmmmmmmMMmmMm....that makes my mouth water.

Question for you: do you ever find the tuna "too fresh" for sushi? We used to get fresh-caught tuna for sushi all the time in Micronesia (if you caught it yourself you could bring it to the local restaurants and they'd filet it for you), but the generally held opinion was that just-off-the-boat tuna is too mushy. The restaurants would pop it in the freezer for a few hours, then prep and serve it.

Maybe it was just the power of suggestion, but I've always felt this was a gastronomically correct approach.

Well I do cut the sushi a little thicker than at a sushi bar just for that reason. I leave it in the fridge for a couple of hours before serving. We order our wasabi on line (dry powered) and make it a hour or so before . Like the powered because you can make it as strong as you want and only make as much as you want. We cook sticky rice on the side and sometimes some prawns . Than eat till we can't eat anymore. It's great when sitting around with friends drinking a beer , watching a sunset.

 

[Davita]

It appears to me this 'Expat Insiders' review is based on working expats which may look different to reviews more geared to retiring. Working expats are usually compensated for the difference in COL, etc. in the salary offered when working away from home.
I subscribe to 'International Living' which still promotes Panama, Mexico, Ecuador and, to a lesser degree, Costa Rica. This magazine focusses more on retirees and, in particular, Americans and Canadians. I've visited all (excluding Ecuador) and would have been happy to have a holiday or permanent home in Panama or some areas of Mexico...but not all!. Costa Rica I found a bit quiet for our lifestyle but it did offer much for those enjoying nature, which abounds in Costa Rica.
The magazine recently promoted Malaysia, Vietnam and Philippines in their publications but I hardly ever see a mention of Indonesia. There was a reference to Bali but it wasn't highlighted much....due mainly, I think, to the restrictive property-owning laws and immigration requirements.

 

[Chiron]

Last year I attempted to create a total cost of living in Solo, Central Java on a per month basis for two people and one part-time household staff. I made the assumptions that I would be renting a house, and use uber, go-jek, and other public transport instead of buying a car. For food, there would be (at least initially) a fairly westernized diet, with a number of pricey health food and supplement items. I probably would end up eating out (or ordering go-food) much more than I do in the states. The following is the estimate that was tabulated:

Rent (120 sq/m house with security gate)- 7Jt
Transport (Uber, Taxis, etc.) - 3Jt
Food/Restaurants/Supplements - 7Jt
Electric/Gas/Internet/Pulsa (for 2 cells) - 2.5Jt
Other misc items - 2Jt
Housekeeper part-time - 1.5Jt

Total: 23Jt per month. That's about 276Jt per year, or a little over $20K USD at current exchange rates.

I've been told by several friends and family in Indonesia that this is excessive, and at least one that said it was not nearly enough. He thought I should average in medical/dental costs, but I handled that in the other category. In any case, this is much less than what I'm spending in Houston - about 50% less.

 

[Vanhelsing]

Rent (120 sq/m house with security gate)- 7Jt
Transport (Uber, Taxis, etc.) - 3Jt
Food/Restaurants/Supplements - 7Jt
Electric/Gas/Internet/Pulsa (for 2 cells) - 2.5Jt
Other misc items - 2Jt
Housekeeper part-time - 1.5Jt

I've been to Solo a few times and found it to be one of the cheapest places in Indonesia. I could live there comfortably on what you forecast just for rent, which I find quite excessive. I paid 7Jt for a gated two bedroom two bathroom house for a year on Lombok a few years ago.

 

[Puspawarna]

I'm no expert but 7 juta/month sounds high to me as well - how serious are you about this, Chiron? If you want I can ask a friend, who has been renting a house in Solo for a long time and spends as much of her time there as she can, to offer her opinion.

 

[Chiron]

I've been to Solo a few times and found it to be one of the cheapest places in Indonesia. I could live there comfortably on what you forecast just for rent, which I find quite excessive. I paid 7Jt for a gated two bedroom two bathroom house for a year on Lombok a few years ago.

Admittedly, the places our real estate agent was showing us were pretty nice. Brand new, security guard, CCTV, 5 min walk from the nicest mall in Solo, and importantly not in a flood area (when Solo was flooding at the time). Also, priced was the fastest internet possible. I'm sure that over time, my perspective on things would change. You're perspective on these estimates is quite similar to that of my nephew-in-law. He actually used the word "insane".

 

[Chiron]

I'm no expert but 7 juta/month sounds high to me as well - how serious are you about this, Chiron? If you want I can ask a friend, who has been renting a house in Solo for a long time and spends as much of her time there as she can, to offer her opinion.

Sure, that would be great! I'm open to all input, and like hearing other viewpoints.