Low-Cost Locations: Where Expat Incomes Go Further

[Chiron]

Here is an example of the kind of thing we were shown. This is a bit less than 7 Jt/month.

 

[Vanhelsing]

Are you in Solo now, Chiron?

It seems to be a nice place. However if there's no great urgency to rent right now, I'd perhaps give your self a little time to get a handle on rental and other prices in Solo. Also, in my limited experience, I've found renting privately from locals always seemed to offer better value with housing rather than using estate agents.

Local word of mouth is very effective when it comes to these types of things, I've found. Once it's known you're looking for a property to rent, there will be a neighbor's friend who has an auntie twice removed living next to a man whose brother is looking after a relative's house who wishes to rent out their home as they're now living in Jakarta.

 

[Chiron]

Are you in Solo now, Chiron?

Not at the moment, but will be there for a quick trip after next week.

 

[Puspawarna]

Sure, that would be great! I'm open to all input, and like hearing other viewpoints.

Okay, email sent. She's always busy so I don't know how fast she'll answer. I will see her on November 2 but hopefully you won't have to wait that long.

On your list, I realize that the "other misc items" may be intended to cover a lot of things. But my advice would be that if you know that certain expenses will occur, and you can quantify them up front, you should do so. It will avoid rude surprises later on. Some items won't occur monthly, but you either do an annual budget, or just amortize the annual costs over a 12 month period. The thing is, there will ALWAYS be "other" expenses that you couldn't predict or imagine; I'd leave the other category for those alone, and predict/imagine everything possible.

Things I would consider putting into a budget (which may or may not apply to you):

• Visa costs (including the agent's fee if you use one, and airfares if you need to do visa runs out of the country)
• Recreational travel: will you want to pop over to Bali or Lombok from time to time, or just make a shopping trip to the Big Durian?
• Medical insurance. Or if you plan to self-insure, see the next bullet and take it extra seriously.
• Out of pocket costs for medical/dental care (including medications): like your friend, I think you should include this as a line item. Or, if you don't think you'll particularly have expenses in this area, at least consider having a reserve fund that is enough to be sure you will be able to manage if you or your partner are in an accident or unexpectedly become seriously ill.
• Gifts and celebrations: have you included the cost of a Lebaran bonus for your household staff, plus all the local trash pick-up/security/RT costs you will face at Ramadan? What about birthdays, anniversaries, Christmas, or other holidays you might want to celebrate with a little something special?
• Annual or biannual trip back to the US - do you have elderly parents, beloved siblings, offspring, anyone else you'd like to see once in a while?
• Household repairs - I have yet to meet the landlord who will cover costs for AC maintenance, fixing the odd plumbing problem, etc.
• Entertainment - I don't know about you, but unless I'm close to a good library I need to budget a fair sum for books/Kindle purchases every month. If that's not your thing, do any of your hobbies cost money?
• Clothes/shoes - if you are like me you can keep this one low; I'm happy wearing clothes I bought 20 years ago. But even I wear out my running shoes and need to get new ones two or three times a year.

I'm sure there is more stuff, but that's what occurs to me off the top of my head.

 

[Puspawarna]

Just got an answer from my friend, sort of ... at any rate, it is a data point. She and her husband just built a gorgeous house (I've seen it, it's quite nice) with a full gamelan in the pendopo, and lots of room for visiting musicians/students, and the plan is to rent the guest areas to foreigners coming to Solo for gamelan study and the like. So her answer was a bit self-interested, but here it is:

Have him stay at our place! We charge Rp 3,000,000/month for a bedroom and private bathroom that has:

• AC
  
• wifi
  
• hot water
  
• new furniture/new walls/no holes no leaking no critters
  
• a kitchenette, furnished that is shared between only 2-3 rooms
  
• a pembantu that cleans the spaces daily
  
• access to a washing machine OR can pay the pembantu a small fee for laundry
  
• 2 local Javanese always on site (male and female pembantu) for advice and assistance that WE pay
  
• a pavillion full of instruments
• beautiful, clean sky, rice fields

The only drawback is that our place, is about 20 minutes by taxi from the center of Solo.

I said I thought you wanted your own house, but on the off chance you are interested I'll put you in touch.

 

[Puspawarna]

Well, this is interesting (and surprising). When I said you'd want your own house, she said:

Their own house? Then for 7 million they could get a leaky and run down small house MAYBE, but usually not. We paid 20 million for our last crappy, small, ugly house with no hot water and no AC!

FWIW, I did not think their rented house was all that bad, but it certainly wasn't upscale. Anyway, sounds like the 7 juta/month townhouse might be a good deal after all!

 

[Vanhelsing]

Puspawarna's friends reply also surprises me..I maintain everyone is paying too much

I urge Chiron to view the following link https://www.lamudi.co.id/central-java/surakarta-solo/house/rent/?setLang=en and others so as to perhaps develop some kind of idea of what rental property prices are in Solo.

Gated 3 bed 2 bath for 3.75 Jt a month or 45Jt per year in solo..

3 bed 2 bath 2 Jt permonth or 24 Jt a year.

3 bed 2 bath 25 Jt a year.

 

[R Cameron]

Puspa, was it totally clear you were saying 7jt per month? I've never been to Solo, but that reply sounds like they are referencing getting a poor place for 20jt per year and doubtful anything could be found for 7jt per year. Certainly if they were paying 20jt per month (240jt per year!) they would be getting hot water and AC.

 

[Jaime C]

In Bandung, I’ve figured expenses for when we rented a house, with normal expenses for a family of 4-5. Including car expenses, gas, etc. 10-15 juta monthly for living comfortably. You could shave 20-30% off if you needed.

 

[scouser59]

seems to me solo is expensive , 2 to 3 mil a month will get you something decent in bali , without the din at 5am , they would have to pay me to suffer that !

 

[Puspawarna]

Puspa, was it totally clear you were saying 7jt per month? I've never been to Solo, but that reply sounds like they are referencing getting a poor place for 20jt per year and doubtful anything could be found for 7jt per year. Certainly if they were paying 20jt per month (240jt per year!) they would be getting hot water and AC.

I know, right? But I checked our emails, and yep ... it was clear they were paying 20 juta/month (to be fair their place was very centrally located by a lot of palace stuff).

I agree that the whole thing seems really bizarre - however my friend is an old Solo hand, married to a Solo native, speaks fluent Javanese ... so I trust what she says. On the other hand, I also trust the examples in this thread of townhouses available for much cheaper. Maybe it's to do with location and the attractive, affordable townhouses are out of town a bit? I have no idea.

Chiron, you'll have to update this thread with what you find on your Solo trip!

 

[scouser59]

20 mil a month to live in solo , jeez , more radicals than you can shake a stick at , for sure no sleep at night !
I dunno why people wanna live in a place like that, must be something in the water,.

 

[Puspawarna]

20 mil a month to live in solo , jeez , more radicals than you can shake a stick at , for sure no sleep at night !
I dunno why people wanna live in a place like that, must be something in the water,.

Solo is the cultural heart of Java; it is home to the main campus of ISI, which is the premier university for studying Javanese gamelan, wayang, etc. Serious students of Javanese music flock to Solo, and have been doing so for decades, to steep themselves in an experience that is available no where else in the world.

Now, I know that doesn't explain why someone uninterested in the arts would choose Solo as a home, and I recognize that 99.99% of the world could give a rat's ass about gamelan. That's fine - to each his own and all that. But, there are certainly exceptional reasons why "people wanna live in a place like that."

 

[scouser59]

Not my cuppa tea for sure, I dont wanna live in a place where people see me as an infidel, which of course I am . I prefer to live in the nature surrounded by trees , no pollution , sea breezes , and be woken in the morning by the birds , with the occasional troublesome monkey disturbing my peace , but ya thats just my idea of a life , strange though it is .

 

[Chiron]

Now, I know that doesn't explain why someone uninterested in the arts would choose Solo as a home, and I recognize that 9.99% of the world could give a rat's ass about gamelan. That's fine - to each his own and all that. But, there are certainly exceptional reasons why "people wanna live in a place like that."

For me, the reason for Solo is that's where my wife was born and raised. All of her family, and even her inseparable high school friends are there. She never acclimated to the US very well, and has wanted to go back for more than a decade. There's a lot of other places that I've considered. I have been looking at Bali, Lombok, and Malang to name a few. But it always comes back to Solo - because that's home. Since I subscribe to the "happy wife, happy life" philosophy, it's bound to be a very wise decision in the end.

 

[Chiron]

Some items won't occur monthly, but you either do an annual budget, or just amortize the annual costs over a 12 month period. The thing is, there will ALWAYS be "other" expenses that you couldn't predict or imagine; I'd leave the other category for those alone, and predict/imagine everything possible.

Yes, indeed I do have an annual budget planned as well. This is just a discretionary savings. It all depends on what comes up, in how that gets spent. If I don't need to fix a leaky roof, then maybe I can take that diving trip in Manado I've been thinking about. I'm up in the air about health insurance versus self insuring for medical and dental. I may just get a high deductible plan, to deal with a major issue - should that occur.

• Visa costs (including the agent's fee if you use one, and airfares if you need to do visa runs out of the country)
• Recreational travel: will you want to pop over to Bali or Lombok from time to time, or just make a shopping trip to the Big Durian?
• Medical insurance. Or if you plan to self-insure, see the next bullet and take it extra seriously.
• Out of pocket costs for medical/dental care (including medications): like your friend, I think you should include this as a line item. Or, if you don't think you'll particularly have expenses in this area, at least consider having a reserve fund that is enough to be sure you will be able to manage if you or your partner are in an accident or unexpectedly become seriously ill.
• Gifts and celebrations: have you included the cost of a Lebaran bonus for your household staff, plus all the local trash pick-up/security/RT costs you will face at Ramadan? What about birthdays, anniversaries, Christmas, or other holidays you might want to celebrate with a little something special?
• Annual or biannual trip back to the US - do you have elderly parents, beloved siblings, offspring, anyone else you'd like to see once in a while?
• Household repairs - I have yet to meet the landlord who will cover costs for AC maintenance, fixing the odd plumbing problem, etc.
• Entertainment - I don't know about you, but unless I'm close to a good library I need to budget a fair sum for books/Kindle purchases every month. If that's not your thing, do any of your hobbies cost money?
• Clothes/shoes - if you are like me you can keep this one low; I'm happy wearing clothes I bought 20 years ago. But even I wear out my running shoes and need to get new ones two or three times a year.

This is a good list of considerations. I know I've thought about a few of these. I'm planning to take a couple quick trips to Perth, and at least one back to the US each year. These will mostly be to visit various family, and pick up a bunch of difficult to find items in Indonesia.

 

[Chiron]

I urge Chiron to view the following link https://www.lamudi.co.id/central-java/surakarta-solo/house/rent/?setLang=en and others so as to perhaps develop some kind of idea of what rental property prices are in Solo.

Hi Vanhelsing - Thanks for this link, I'll save it for reference. Just a few extra thoughts on this very interesting thread started here...

With regards, to living in places around the world, we can say from the discussion about a place like Solo that it's kind of subjective, and personal preferences always play a role. Everything can be broken down into needs versus wants (or like-to-haves). My original budget items were the monthly estimation of basic ongoing needs (except for the housekeeper). However, my estimations reflect a number of not necessary, but like-to-haves in those various needs. For example, I need a house to live in, but for me to be happy and agree to Solo, I really want 2-3 AC units, a washing machine, screens on all the windows, an area that's not likely to flood, within a 10 minute drive to my wife's family home, gated/security guard setup, and in a relatively quiet residential neighborhood. Yes this all costs extra money, which will require me to count the costs and plan carefully.

The other thing I'm sure will happen, is that I'll change over time. I'll start questioning unnecessary expenses, and start optimizing the arrangement. I'm certain just from reading some reactions here on this thread, and also from observations of a couple expats I know in Solo.

 

[scouser59]

yap happy wife happy life , no choice in the matter , good hunting .

 

[Smallworld]

For me, the reason for Solo is that's where my wife was born and raised. All of her family, and even her inseparable high school friends are there. She never acclimated to the US very well, and has wanted to go back for more than a decade. There's a lot of other places that I've considered. I have been looking at Bali, Lombok, and Malang to name a few. But it always comes back to Solo - because that's home. Since I subscribe to the "happy wife, happy life" philosophy, it's bound to be a very wise decision in the end.

Sound like a story I went through with my wife. She came back because of family, friends ect... fast forward 5 years and you will see that wife's friends (from childhood, school, university) will be more busy with their life/business/work/home/marriage/kids and finding spare time to meet will become very rare. Your wife will wake up one day and say that life's and people changed since the last x years.

 

[Puspawarna]

I prefer to live in the nature surrounded by trees , no pollution , sea breezes , and be woken in the morning by the birds , with the occasional troublesome monkey disturbing my peace , but ya thats just my idea of a life , strange though it is .

Me too!!! (Well, I don't care about the monkeys particularly, but having various sorts of wildlife around is nice). That's why I can't wait to retire permanently to Hawaii; it is the opposite of living in Jakarta.