KITAS to KITAP conversion in the new evisa system

[Shadrach]

My former agent was charging 8jt (in 2022) , and asked 45jt for the KITAP (the agent himself suggested me to continue with the KITAS) .

But maybe now with the online system procedures this distortion had been corrected , as my former agent implied that it was more difficult to get the KITAP (compared with the KITAS) from Immigration .

The US$5000 per month proof is the requirement to be eligible for the Retirement KITAS & KITAP .

PerMen no.11 Year 2024
Article 61
(1) Application for a temporary stay visa for elderly aged 55 years or over ... (must include) :
c. proof of having living expenses for himself/herself and/or his/her family while in Indonesia; (now US$2000 per month)
(2) ... proof of income or allowances with a value of US$3,000 per month.
Poster's Note : The above refers to the Visa , but also applicable to KITAS & KITAP

Example : If you have only a monthly pension of US$1'500 , you need US$3'500 per month more in the bank to cover the total $5k per month, meaning :
a) For an one year KITAS you would need a bank proof of US$42'000 ($3'500 x 12) ;
b) For a 5 years KITAP it would be a bank proof of US$210'000 ($3'500 x 60) .
Note : This is how I interprete the rule (because when I had the Retirement KITAS I did not have any monthly income , so I presented a bank proof only , at that time it was required only US$1'500 per month, meaning a $18'000 bank proof for the KITAS) .

This all very confusing. Above you say a person needs $2000 a month. Then you add on $3000 in your bank. Isn't the $2000 a month the same as if that's what your bank statement says? Where do you get the $3000 extra?
Where does it say you need $5000, It says you need $2000 a month in my eyes?
And where does it say you have show proof of income for Five years 60 months?
This math has my head spinning!
Where do you get the $5000 a year, when everyone is only having to show $2000 or $3000 for the yearly Kitas permit?

 

[marcus]

... Above you say a person needs $2000 a month. Then you add on $3000 in your bank ...

Please focus more on the official rule , what I said is my interpretation of the rule .

So before I showed the rule on PerMen 11 Year 2024 :
Retirement Visa requirements :
(1)c. proof of having living expenses for himself/herself and/or his/her family while in Indonesia; (now US$2000 per month)
(2) ... proof of income or allowances with a value of US$3,000 per month.

Now see below what Immigration says at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/web/visa-selection :
Retirement Visa (E33F) requirements :
b. Personal bank statement with minimum amount USD $2000 or equivalent the last 3 months period (including name, date of period, and balance account).
g. Bank account proving income or allowance with a value of US$3,000 per month.
.....

So , to me it means US$2k (per month) + US$3k (per month) , isn't it ?

To support this interpretation : If we remember the old rule that required : the "proof of having living expenses" (but it was $1.5k instead of the present $2k) + health & life insurances + hiring 2 Indonesians + a minimal house rental + ... Now it is basically only $2k + $3k , coherent with the "simplification" of the process applied also to few other types of visas/KITAS .

And where does it say you have show proof of income for 5 years or 60 months ?

Nowhere , it is my interpretation . But read it carefully , I said IF you don't have the proof for the full $5k monthly income .

Where do you get the $5000 a year, when everyone is only having to show $2000 or $3000 for the yearly Kitas permit?

Well , maybe Immigration is applying the old rule for foreigners (like you) who started their Retirement KITAS before the issuance of this new rule . By the way , if this is the case , you have a new reason for getting the KITAP (if also under the old rule) , otherwise after your 6th KITAS you will need to start a totally new Retirement KITAS certainly with this new rule .

 

[Nicho]

Ok, as I understand this 10,200,000Rp is for 1 year right? So I assume multiply that by 5 is 51,000,000 for the five year permit? If I did it myself through immigration. Are you saying my agent might charge me 25Rp for 1 year Kitap, thus for 5 years he would ask 125,000,000Rp for the five year Stay permit? Sorry if my math is wrong. These numbers rattle my brain!
Why would the Kitap be so much more expensive .

Ok, as I understand this 10,200,000Rp is for 1 year right? So I assume multiply that by 5 is 51,000,000 for the five year permit? If I did it myself through immigration. Are you saying my agent might charge me 25Rp for 1 year Kitap, thus for 5 years he would ask 125,000,000Rp for the five year Stay permit? Sorry if my math is wrong. These numbers rattle my brain!
Why would the Kitap be so much more expensive?

No it is a once only fee for the 5 year Kitap and 5 year Merp , it is not a yearly fee like the Kitas ! I just rechecked the Director Generals web page , the fee is actually 10,500,000Rp , my mistake sorry. 7juta for the Kitap and 3.5juta for the Merp , both are valid for 5 years after which you will have the option of extending for either another 5 or 10 years or applying for the lifetime/unlimited Kitap and Merp .The new fee schedule as of December 2024 is available on the Director Generals web page . * I have seen reports/post on other sites of agents charging up to 45juta for the Kitas to Kitap conversion/Alhi Status . Your local Immigration Office should be able to provide a list of the requirements and the procedure for the Conversion/Alhi Status Kitas to Kitap .

 

[Shadrach]

No it is a once only fee for the 5 year Kitap and 5 year Merp , it is not a yearly fee like the Kitas ! I just rechecked the Director Generals web page , the fee is actually 10,500,000Rp , my mistake sorry. 7juta for the Kitap and 3.5juta for the Merp , both are valid for 5 years after which you will have the option of extending for either another 5 or 10 years or applying for the lifetime/unlimited Kitap and Merp .The new fee schedule as of December 2024 is available on the Director Generals web page . * I have seen reports/post on other sites of agents charging up to 45juta for the Kitas to Kitap conversion/Alhi Status . Your local Immigration Office should be able to provide a list of the requirements and the procedure for the Conversion/Alhi Status Kitas to Kitap .

Wow if it's only 10,500,000Rp. directly at immigration. Then how can Agents charge 50,000.000? If they all do it, and they are your sponsor, what can people do? Just take it up the Wazoo?

 

[AhhSamboi]

Holy shnikies... I'm going in next week to apply for Alih status in Bandung from Kitas to Kitap. We have yet to do anything online and just go through the office.

1. Thank goodness we never used an agent. Kitas renewal is too easy to do on your own if you have a few days off. It was only like 2 juta if I remember correctly per year.

2. Kinda wondering where the monthly income thing comes into play as they just asked that we show a bank account with 20 juta in it. (This is a spouse sponsored Kitap)

3. Is the MERP now 5 years as well? Last I checked the board in Bandung it was only every 2 years and you had to come back and renew it.

 

[marcus]

Wow if it's only 10,500,000Rp. directly at immigration. Then how can Agents charge 50,000.000? ...

In your case agents charge more because it is a sponsored KITAS/KITAP (sponsorship is not free as he/she will be your guarantor) .

 

[marcus]

... I'm going in next week to apply for Alih status in Bandung from Kitas to Kitap. We have yet to do anything online and just go through the office.

Probably Immigration will tell you to do it online . Anyway , it would be good to do online , it is probably easier than doing face-to-face .

2. Kinda wondering where the monthly income thing comes into play as they just asked that we show a bank account with 20 juta in it. (This is a spouse sponsored Kitap)

Those requirements are for Retirement KITAS/KITAP , not applicable to you .

3. Is the MERP now 5 years as well? ...

Probably yes .

 

[Nicho]

Holy shnikies... I'm going in next week to apply for Alih status in Bandung from Kitas to Kitap. We have yet to do anything online and just go through the office.

1. Thank goodness we never used an agent. Kitas renewal is too easy to do on your own if you have a few days off. It was only like 2 juta if I remember correctly per year.

2. Kinda wondering where the monthly income thing comes into play as they just asked that we show a bank account with 20 juta in it. (This is a spouse sponsored Kitap)

3. Is the MERP now 5 years as well? Last I checked the board in Bandung it was only every 2 years and you had to come back and renew it.

Holy shnikies... I'm going in next week to apply for Alih status in Bandung from Kitas to Kitap. We have yet to do anything online and just go through the office.

1. Thank goodness we never used an agent. Kitas renewal is too easy to do on your own if you have a few days off. It was only like 2 juta if I remember correctly per year.

2. Kinda wondering where the monthly income thing comes into play as they just asked that we show a bank account with 20 juta in it. (This is a spouse sponsored Kitap)

3. Is the MERP now 5 years as well? Last I checked the board in Bandung it was only every 2 years and you had to come back and renew it.

Yes the Merp is now for 5 years . A lot of new options were included in the new fee schedule . I did my Alhi Status (Spouse Sponsored) in 2021 , the rules regarding income /living expenses have possibly changed . Only time I had to provide income/living expense details/proof was for the initial Vitas from the Director General when i first moved here . Never asked again during 5 years of kitas renewal or when I did the Alhi Status . Was asked about living expenses during the home interview for Alhi Status but didn't have to provide actual documents , they must have been happy with what I told them , the Kitap was approved !

 

[AhhSamboi]

Yes the Merp is now for 5 years . A lot of new options were included in the new fee schedule . I did my Alhi Status (Spouse Sponsored) in 2021 , the rules regarding income /living expenses have possibly changed . Only time I had to provide income/living expense details/proof was for the initial Vitas from the Director General when i first moved here . Never asked again during 5 years of kitas renewal or when I did the Alhi Status . Was asked about living expenses during the home interview for Alhi Status but didn't have to provide actual documents , they must have been happy with what I told them , the Kitap was approved !

The rules and everything seem to change so often and so quickly. We went in December to get the letter saying we are still married(it wasn't on the list of documents needed but they needed it) and most to of the offices sent us to other offices.

Everyone who actually knew what the document was was on leave or retired.

Then when we got to the police station for their part of it they had to call all the other offices to inform them that they weren't part of the whole situation for the letter for the past 5 or so years.

So it's been a mass confusion.

Probably Immigration will tell you to do it online . Anyway , it would be good to do online , it is probably easier than doing face-to-face .

Those requirements are for Retirement KITAS/KITAP , not applicable to you .

Probably yes .

We had tried to do it online originally with the old system, but it has always error'd out and couldn't be accessed so we have always just done it through the office.

If it all gets done online I'm not sure what the people on the second floor would be doing anymore even before the online thing the office was usually pretty empty except when the Chinese workers need to renew their visas.

 

[El_Goretto]

Mod note:

We have deleted a post by @Shadrach which was off-topic and not adding to the conversation. As a reminder, we are stricter with staying on-topic in the law and regulations channel.

 

[Shadrach]

I am in the process of converting the 1 year Kitas to the 5 year Kitap. If I go ahead and pay for 5 years. Does this mean, I don't have to deal with immigration for 5 years from now? Or do I have to go back in 1or 2 or 3 years and have to do something, even though I payed for 5 years? This is a lot of money to pay up front! Is it possible to just pay for a 1 year Kitap, and pay every year later?

 

[Nicho]

The rules and everything seem to change so often and so quickly. We went in December to get the letter saying we are still married(it wasn't on the list of documents needed but they needed it) and most to of the offices sent us to other offices.

Everyone who actually knew what the document was was on leave or retired.

Then when we got to the police station for their part of it they had to call all the other offices to inform them that they weren't part of the whole situation for the letter for the past 5 or so years.

So it's been a mass confusion.

We had tried to do it online originally with the old system, but it has always error'd out and couldn't be accessed so we have always just done it through the office.

If it all gets done online I'm not sure what the people on the second floor would be doing anymore even before the online thing the office was usually pretty empty except when the Chinese workers need to renew their visa

I am in the process of converting the 1 year Kitas to the 5 year Kitap. If I go ahead and pay for 5 years. Does this mean, I don't have to deal with immigration for 5 years from now? Or do I have to go back in 1or 2 or 3 years and have to do something, even though I payed for 5 years? This is a lot of money to pay up front! Is it possible to just pay for a 1 year Kitap, and pay every year later?

That's correct . No more trips back and forth for 5 years . You then have the option after it expires to either extend for another 5 or 10 years or apply for the unlimited /lifetime Kitap .

 

[marcus]

I am in the process of converting the 1 year Kitas to the 5 year Kitap. If I go ahead and pay for 5 years. Does this mean, I don't have to deal with immigration for 5 years from now?

Nothing more related to the KITAP , but you may have to deal with Immigration for change of : passport , address , ...

This is a lot of money to pay up front! Is it possible to just pay for a 1 year Kitap, and pay every year later?

Your visa agent will have to pay all Immigration fees before the KITAP's issuance . Anything related to your payment is dependent on your agent .

 

[marcus]

... You then have the option after it expires to either extend ...

To be precise , the option has to be chosen before the KITAP expires .

... either extend for another 5 or 10 years or apply for the unlimited /lifetime Kitap .

Are you sure that we can choose a second 5 years KITAP ? Because the Regulation (see below) is not clear about it .

PerMen no.22 Year 2023 - free translation
Article 128
(1) The KITAP may be extended for an unlimited period of time.

 

[AhhSamboi]

Gonna head to imigrasi Bandung in the morning to see if they'll just let me drop my stack of papers with them. They've been prepared since last year except the letter saying I'm still married that didn't used to be required.

Maybe I can get some answers out of them and not get forced to use the online thingy

 

[AhhSamboi]

Gonna head to imigrasi Bandung in the morning to see if they'll just let me drop my stack of papers with them. They've been prepared since last year except the letter saying I'm still married that didn't used to be required.

Maybe I can get some answers out of them and not get forced to use the online thingy

Well…. They helped me review my stack but said my wife needs to make an imigrasi account and do everything from there. But for her account to approve could take 2 weeks which is beyond the point of where I can apply for Kitap so Kitas it is again

 

[marcus]

... But for her account to approve could take 2 weeks which is beyond the point of where I can apply for Kitap ...

I submitted my Indonesian wife's account registration last month and it took only 2 working days (or 4 days including Saturday & Sunday) to be approved . They sent the following email to my wife : "Indonesia Immigration One Platform System - Guarantor Claim Success" .

What I did : at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni I clicked "Tidak" (at the top of the page) and started filling the data in that page .

But the first time I tried I failed because at the right side of the page above mentioned , there is a "Note" saying : "If you do not have a guarantor account in visa online application click here" . So I clicked there and a different registration page appeared (https://visa-online.imigrasi.go.id/register/index.xhtml) , and so I submitted all data there . Later they sent an email saying that I should have registered at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni .

 

[Nicho]

To be precise , the option has to be chosen before the KITAP expires .

Are you sure that we can choose a second 5 years KITAP ? Because the Regulation (see below) is not clear about it .

PerMen no.22 Year 2023 - free translation
Article 128
(1) The KITAP may be extended for an unlimited period of time.

Sorry , before it expires . "May Be " nothing to say you "Have To" apply for the unlimited extension. From my understanding and from other posts it's one of three options . 5 year , 10 year or Unlimited . Your choice .

 

[AhhSamboi]

I submitted my Indonesian wife's account registration last month and it took only 2 working days (or 4 days including Saturday & Sunday) to be approved . They sent the following email to my wife : "Indonesia Immigration One Platform System - Guarantor Claim Success" .

What I did : at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni I clicked "Tidak" (at the top of the page) and started filling the data in that page .

But the first time I tried I failed because at the right side of the page above mentioned , there is a "Note" saying : "If you do not have a guarantor account in visa online application click here" . So I clicked there and a different registration page appeared (https://visa-online.imigrasi.go.id/register/index.xhtml) , and so I submitted all data there . Later they sent an email saying that I should have registered at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni .

Much thanks for your insight. Hopefully ours goes as quickly. We filled it in front of the imigrasi guy to make sure everything was correct. He said it's very random sometimes about usually around 2 weeks.

The timing of everything is a cluster fudge though as it's the same time my wife needs to renew her visa in Malaysia. And they just emailed her to tell her she needs to hand them her passport

 

[AhhSamboi]

I submitted my Indonesian wife's account registration last month and it took only 2 working days (or 4 days including Saturday & Sunday) to be approved . They sent the following email to my wife : "Indonesia Immigration One Platform System - Guarantor Claim Success" .

What I did : at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni I clicked "Tidak" (at the top of the page) and started filling the data in that page .

But the first time I tried I failed because at the right side of the page above mentioned , there is a "Note" saying : "If you do not have a guarantor account in visa online application click here" . So I clicked there and a different registration page appeared (https://visa-online.imigrasi.go.id/register/index.xhtml) , and so I submitted all data there . Later they sent an email saying that I should have registered at https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/register/wni .

Got the approval for her account this morning. Kind a confused how little documents it actually asked for though. Like it only asked for our marriage certificate and a couple little things. Not the giant stack of papers that the local department wanted