Cryptocurrencies

[Anglian]

Diamonds, reminds of a mate of mine bought his then girl friend an engagement ring for the princely sum of £14, four weeks wages then, anyway it didn’t work out, she returned the ring, so he took it down to the pawn shop, the Jewish owner offered him 30 shillings, he said this ring cost me 14 quid, the Jewish gent said Look in my shop vindow my boy, full of diamond rings.
So that tells you about diamonds,

 

[Bad_azz]

@harryopal... oh we have to meet up some time- my hubby is so into opals it is almost pathetic. He cuts and polishes them ever in the hope of finding that rainbow. As for knowing someone who used to cut & polish Australian ones: here's the response
He was just dozing off & not interested in what I was just saying until I mentioned the opal- Bang, wide awake!
"huh? really?tell him I want him to send to me"
As for diamonds- I do believe there is now a bitcoin diamond out there.

 

[Daniel50]

I don't believe anyone has a definitive answer on where Cryptocurrencies are headed or the future monetary systems, okay maybe a few people, and of course there are huge vested interests involved.

 

[R Cameron]

It's mathematics...if 10 people put 1$ in a pot and there is no investment to make the pot value grow......
1. If all take 1$ out then it's a zero-sum result.
2. If one takes 2$ out nine will get less than what they put in....i.e. one winner and nine losers.

If they all convince other people that the pot will grow and they put in 2$ then more$ on the promise it will grow....... then its a ponzi scheme.

No one is taking out more than they have put in, it's simply that the purchasing power (or exchange rate) of the 1$ has grown.

 

[Davita]

No one is taking out more than they have put in, it's simply that the purchasing power (or exchange rate) of the 1$ has grown.

I agree....but how does it grow....other than by inflation....or bullshit?
Purchasing power does grow in a community where even debt has value.

 

[harryopal1]

@harryopal... oh we have to meet up some time- my hubby is so into opals it is almost pathetic. He cuts and polishes them ever in the hope of finding that rainbow. As for knowing someone who used to cut & polish Australian ones: here's the response
He was just dozing off & not interested in what I was just saying until I mentioned the opal- Bang, wide awake!
"huh? really?tell him I want him to send to me"
As for diamonds- I do believe there is now a bitcoin diamond out there.

"If you ever go across the sea to Ireland,
Then maybe at the closin' of your day
You will sit and watch the moon rise over Claddagh
And see the sun go down on Galway Bay."

Oops! I mean across the sea to Bali and see the sun go down at Jimbaran beach.

If you are ever heading this way do let me know. A man who loves opal can't be all bad.

 

[Anglian]

I was stunned to see on Sky News this morning that the starting price for the bit coin was only$2, it still doesn’t make sense, but good luck, wish I had bought at least one at the start

 

[Bad_azz]

Anglian:
The pizza story
http://uk.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-pizza-day-passes-2000-20-million-2017-5/?IR=T

It is still the start, really. Or the end of the beginning

 

[R Cameron]

I agree....but how does it grow....other than by inflation....or bullshit?
Purchasing power does grow in a community where even debt has value.

It legitimately grows with trust and utility. Those are the same factors that have kept the USD as the worldwide standard.

It also grows illegitimately through speculation.

I think the major growth we have seen in 2017 is probably 60% speculation, 20% trust and 20% utility. So I speculate (hah!) that most the growth is illegitimate and has potential to collapse, however, trust and utility could outpace speculation in the future and still see the dust settle and prices stabilize at 1BTC=100,000USD+

 

[Davita]

It legitimately grows with trust and utility. Those are the same factors that have kept the USD as the worldwide standard.

It also grows illegitimately through speculation.

I think the major growth we have seen in 2017 is probably 60% speculation, 20% trust and 20% utility. So I speculate (hah!) that most the growth is illegitimate and has potential to collapse, however, trust and utility could outpace speculation in the future and still see the dust settle and prices stabilize at 1BTC=100,000USD+

I copy what I said and you quoted.....
"I agree....but how does it grow....other than by inflation....or bullshit?"
Apparently you agree with me...you just say it more eloquently.

The USD has world status because it has intrinsic value as the currency of trust in its promise to pay and the value and stability of the country... although its future may be in decline. Much like, prior to two world wars, the GBP had the same status.
The Greek Drachma also had value at one time in history......from wiki....
"An ancient Greek currency unit issued by many Greek city states during a period of ten centuries, from the Archaic period throughout the Classical period, the Hellenistic period up to the Roman period under Greek Imperial Coinage."

 

[R Cameron]

I copy what I said and you quoted.....
"I agree....but how does it grow....other than by inflation....or bullshit?"
Apparently you agree with me...you just say it more eloquently.

I agree part of the growth is speculation. Speculation isn't necessarily bullshit, but it is a gamble. Any somewhat educated buyer of BTC at $15k is aware that the current price is driven by speculation. They are gambling that when the dust settles the "stable" price of BTC will be greater than $15k.

I think everyone with a cursory knowledge of cryptocurrency and economics acknowledges CCs have some value (relative to their trust and utility) and that no one really knows right now what that value will be in 5-10 years. There is already utility that can't be matched by traditional currencies (privacy, transaction fees), and the ways the utility is limited (conveinence) could be relatively easily overcome. I think trust will be the big determiner of value going forward, and headlines of stolen wallets and hacked exchanges are not helping the cause.

 

[harryopal1]

Researching cryptocurrencies is just the thing for a rainy day.

Whatever the perils of the rise and fall of cryptocurrencies it seems that the excitement created by the spectacular rises and falls has also excited lots of sharks. Reading reviews it seems there is hardly a trading website that does not have someone crying, "scammers".

Then there are reviews and fake reviews.

And then there are enormous variations in fees and charges many of which are so high as to pretty well soak up whatever profit you thought you might make on a trade.

It all reminds me of the first climb up the pedestrian crossing over the Station Pier bridge at Port Melbourne one summer back in about 1949. The drop was about 50 feet into deep water and even then wondering about the possibility of sharks lurking. Will I or won't I jump? With all your friends urging you on of course you had to jump. Now standing on the high tower over the cryptocurrency sea I haven't got friends shouting, "Jump... jump." Will I jump or won't I jump?

 

[Bad_azz]

I just read an article on coindesk...https://t.co/thBtyA6v60

"You also need to factor in the competitors that haven't emerged yet. Facebook has more than 2-billion active users and is taking over every other sphere of life, what happens if it develops its own? Or Amazon, or Google?"

The author seems to have done what I did but a few months later. She is a financial advisor, I am not.
Near the end of her piece she talks about what if the giants such as facebook/ google etc. start in on the CCs.(as per the quote)
Now as her being a financial person & a journalist I have to question her research.
Google are one of the investors in Ripple.

Ripple is in the top 5 CCs, so it isn't obscure & could easily have been researched by her.
& It is a coin I will most likely buy into- I wanted to buy in earlier (when I first started my "experiment") but my Exodus wallet didn't support it- still doesn't.
So I sit back watching the price go crazy, thinking I really should have bought in when I wanted to... sigh.

 

[harryopal1]

"... what if the giants such as facebook/ google etc. start in on the CCs...?"

That happened some while ago. The site Gemini was started by two of the Facebook founders.

 

[El_Goretto]

"... what if the giants such as facebook/ google etc. start in on the CCs...?"

That happened some while ago. The site Gemini was started by two of the Facebook founders.

Well, that doesn't really count. They've been out of Facebook for a long long time.

 

[harryopal1]

Really? Well if not giants they are biggish. Collected $65 million from Facebook and said to have $1 billion worth of Bitcoins.

 

[El_Goretto]

Really? Well if not giants they are biggish. Collected $65 million from Facebook and said to have $1 billion worth of Bitcoins.

Oh yes, for sure they're rich. They invested their Facebook settlement money into bitcoin and are now considered bitcoin billionaires. They sure are putting their money where their mouths are.

 

[ChrisD]

I remember when studying Economics, we reviewed the South Sea Bubble and the Tulip Mania - both based on speculation and supply & demand frenzy.

We also studied the '29 Wall Street Crash and I remember the comment "when the shoeshine boy gives you stock tips, its time to sell". The 1999 tech crash was in similar pie in the sky territory (stocks being priced 1,000 their turnover, let alone any profit).

One of my UK friends told his son not to buy bitcoins. They are now worth more than a London house. We have both told him to sell (or at least sell half and take the profit even if he wants the rest to run). He refuses (that's Gen Y for you).

My nephew's girlfriend is trading bitcoins and hasn't got much else in assets as she has poured everything into them in the last 2 months.

Is this a bubble? I think so as the fundamentals just don't add up.

Personally I think this will go the same way as Greek Debt - bang and plummet in value.

Perhaps if the Greek Govt had bought bitcoins early instead of just wasting the money they borrowed and cannot repay, they would be ahead

 

[waarmstrong]

Need I repeat the ancient advise, "Beware of Greeks bearing gifts."?

 

[harryopal1]

Need I repeat the ancient advise, "Beware of Greeks bearing gifts."?

Correction: Shouldn't that be, "Beware of Geeks bearing gifts>"