War

[atlantis]

by Thierry Meyssan

Do you genuinely ignore who Thierry Meyssan is? Do you ignore his ties with Russia and Bashar el Assad? Do you know that he has declared that the Mastermind of the Charlie Hebdo shooting are... Washington? Do you know that he said in multiple occasions (and wrote at length about it) that no plane crashed on the Pentagone on September 11th? Do you know that he was a supporter of Gadafi?

If you speak french please research this: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Effroyables_Imposteurs

I told you just a few posts above that this forum has not been created to be a tribune for any type of propaganda but definitely there is no place here for conspiracy theory authors. I've asked you to make sure to use reliable sources and Thierry Meyssan is definitively not one of them.

 

[ChrisTex]

A Guide to Mainstream Media ‘Fake News’ War Propaganda

As mainstream media pundits, government officials and Silicon Valley technocrats continue the alarmist crusade over the perceived scourge of ‘fake news’ circulating on social media, their misplaced obsession belies the fact that the government-media complex has long been waging its own private disinformation war, against the global public.

As the establishment continues its attempt to discredit alternative sources of information through its fake news faux crisis, it’s clear that some corporate media moguls would like to turn back the clock – back to the days when a handful of powerful institutions enjoyed a complete monopoly over the production of news and dissemination of information. For at least the last century and half, this tightly-controlled information syndicate has been able to manufacture a type of consensus reality. By channeling public opinion in this way, the establishment has used the mainstream press to facilitate a number of engineered outcomes – including war.

More than ever, it’s important to highlight how for many decades, these same media organizations, including the most respected brands in western mainstream media, have been the driving force behind some of most deceptive reporting and militaristic propaganda campaigns which have enabled the conditions for violent conflict worldwide. These acts of media malice have contributed to the unnecessary deaths of countless innocent people.

Undoubtedly, many who work in the media will not see it that way, but history speaks for itself.

Here are but a few of the greatest war propaganda deceptions of all-time – brought to you by the establishment’s own mainstream media. Here are the real consequences of fake news…

A Guide to Mainstream Media 'Fake News' War Propaganda - 21st Century Wire

Patrick Henningsen | This practice of collusion between the government and corporate media has enabled most major global conflicts which the US and its allies participated in over the century.

21stcenturywire.com

And Palpatine went right over your head.

 

[fastpitch17]

Dave 70. Do you ever, and I mean ever actually pay any attention to or do a bit if searching as to just who you read and follow and worse yet, believe?

21st Century Wire is a conspiracy and conjecture site run by Patrick Henningsen. Henningsen has ties to both Infowars and Alex Jones, also known for fake news and broad conspiracies. They also seem to have ties to, or at least to be pro-Russian in much of their content. Specifically Russian Today (RT) the state-run Russian news outlet

21st Century Wire - Bias and Credibility

CONSPIRACY-PSEUDOSCIENCE Sources in the Conspiracy-Pseudoscience category may publish unverifiable information that is not always supported by evidence.

mediabiasfactcheck.com

 

[fastpitch17]

Jokowi is really weak on foreign policy and for the most part stays away from most things regarding it unless there is something that directly involved Indonesia. His only comments on Ukraine war is that he hopes it becomes peaceful. With the G20 he wanted to avoid the Russian invasion of Ukraine but I think he won't be able to avoid it.

Russian tourist come to Indonesia, hey, gotta have that money. There is some russian investment in Indonesia but not like china. There lies Jokowi's directorate. China has not openly chosen a side so Indonesia will not. Indonesia puts a lot of weight into what china does and says.

I can't locate it right now since I forgot where I seen it but an article a couple days ago talks of around 14,000 Indonesians from NU and MUI have received scholarships in china. NU has opened and office in china. The students educated in china that have returned are proclaiming china is great. That there is no problems with the muslims and the china loves muslims. Any muslim in detainment is only because they attacked the government in an uprising. China is sponsoring High School trips showing the students how nice they are and showing them hiw great china is. Basically, to me it looks like an education of how to be easily influanced. China fills their heads with propaganda and they bring it back to Indonesia.

I find this so ironic. Indonesia who's muslim population is always speaking out against communism within Indonesia's boarders are in fact having their own sons indroctinated to communistic ways by a communist nation. Plus, Indonesia sucks up to china for investments ignoring how china has dealt losing hands to other nations and walking away with state owned businesses.

Indonesia is buying a bunch of fighter jets primarily from France and some from the US. They had a deal with Russia but it fell apart when Russia didn't hold up their end of the deal. Indonesia canceled. There are news media in Indonesia like ZonaJakarta that constantly put out articles saying first off, the russian deal is not dead even though Indonesia has said it was. They promote the purchasing of chinese fighters now saying china will give then a sweet deal. Indonesia say these fighters are to protect their China Sea territory from China when in fact, some in the current government are saying they are to protect the new capital area which would align with the timeline if the capital and plane delivery. ZonaJakarta constantly promotes china here. Then there is SINDOnews who republish the russian propaganda. Dave70 probably knows this one well or now has a new source. These are internet news sources that show up on phones throughout Indonesia. On the other hand, I met a Grab driver the other day that didn't even know there was a war in Europe going on.

As far as I know, ASIAN has not come out with anything on the russian invasion. Again I think the fear of china. If china comes to russia's aid and sanctions are then placed on china, where then will ASIAN stand? That will be a telling tale. In the mean time, G20 and Jokowi better be prepared or he will look the fool. Ukraine will come up for sure.

 

[Dave70]

My husband (a few weeks ago) was parroting Rus propaganda, I decided to educate him (cheaper than divorce).
I was more curious as to where he was getting his info, "online" he said. *Edit- yes hubby did bring Palestine up too.
So now I make a point of making him watch video clips of hospitals being bombed, of children being rushed to medical aid and the animals in the zoos... (he is a sucker for animals & anyone bombing a zoo is beyond outrageous to him- that is the one that got the point across I think).

Suami takut istri

 

[Dave70]

I told you just a few posts above that this forum has not been created to be a tribune for any type of propaganda

Sorry, but that particular article I don’t see as propaganda, to me its news or opinion based on facts.

Anyway, I understand now. For you and this forum, there is no credibility or truth in whatever the following types of people are saying; the pro-Trumpers, the anti-vaxxers, opponents of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, sympathizers of Russia/China/Assad/Gaddafi, and of course, those who have written conspiracy theories before.

I hope George Galloway is exempted from any of the above categories as he is a seasoned and wise politician. He may be crazy sometimes like what you saw in Celebrity Big Brother. But the other side of him is someone full of wisdom, common sense, and raw courage. The following videos of him left a deep impression on me.

 

[Bad_azz]

That will be a telling tale. In the mean time, G20 and Jokowi better be prepared or he will look the fool. Ukraine will come up for sure.

Thanks for all that FP - it helped fill in some gaps I had.
Re G20, Poland is already calling for Russian expulsion, I think somebody (not looked into details yet) agreed, I read something yesterday - so Jokowi's hand will be forced on this.

 

[fastpitch17]

Thanks for all that FP - it helped fill in some gaps I had.
Re G20, Poland is already calling for Russian expulsion, I think somebody (not looked into details yet) agreed, I read something yesterday - so Jokowi's hand will be forced on this.

Problem is, it will be vetoed by India, SA, or a few others. Will be diffecult to remove. Maybe the world will get lucky and before the G20 his people will remove him. Problem is, many potential replacements went to the same oligarch school as him and served in the KGB at the same time. The only thing that may keep them out is their advanced age.

Jokowi only looks at domestic policy and frankly, he doesn't have many around him that know that much about domestic or international. Ever see a oresident if any nation so wrapped up in one single sporting event? Sure, we know, he likes motocycles but he was mainly looking at the income generated. He put so much of his presidential dury time in Mandalika he was probably licking the new asphalt. Now, with it over he can concentrate more in the new capital where he will never be president.

 

[ChrisTex]

Sorry, but that particular article I don’t see as propaganda, to me its news or opinion based on facts.

Anyway, I understand now. For you and this forum, there is no credibility or truth in whatever the following types of people are saying; the pro-Trumpers, the anti-vaxxers, opponents of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, sympathizers of Russia/China/Assad/Gaddafi, and of course, those who have written conspiracy theories before.

I hope George Galloway is exempted from any of the above categories as he is a seasoned and wise politician. He may be crazy sometimes like what you saw in Celebrity Big Brother. But the other side of him is someone full of wisdom, common sense, and raw courage. The following videos of him left a deep impression on me.

 

[Nimbus]

Sorry, but that particular article I don’t see as propaganda, to me its news or opinion based on facts.

Anyway, I understand now. For you and this forum, there is no credibility or truth in whatever the following types of people are saying; the pro-Trumpers, the anti-vaxxers, opponents of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, sympathizers of Russia/China/Assad/Gaddafi, and of course, those who have written conspiracy theories before.

I hope George Galloway is exempted from any of the above categories as he is a seasoned and wise politician. He may be crazy sometimes like what you saw in Celebrity Big Brother. But the other side of him is someone full of wisdom, common sense, and raw courage. The following videos of him left a deep impression on me.

No, it is you who said that we think there’s no credibility or truth whatsoever with trumpers etc.

There’s a saying that even a broken clock is right twice a day. Nobody is 100% wrong all the time and nobody is 100% right all the time, but that does not mean there’s no difference between 99% wrong and 1% wrong.

Just because trumpers and flat earthers can be 1% right doesn’t oblige us to entertain and rebuke every single garbage that they spew. When there are so many other credible sources out there, it is safe to ignore the worst ones. We all have only 24 hours a day, and a minute spent on their stupidity is a minute lost.

But don’t worry, the CCP and Kremlin are quite successful in controlling the narrative internally. Inside Russia and China they simply block or jail any dissent. Over here you’re still free to peddle trash with no legal consequence, you just have to deal with better informed people.

 

[atlantis]

Anyway, I understand now. For you and this forum, there is no credibility or truth in whatever the following types of people are saying; the pro-Trumpers, the anti-vaxxers, opponents of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, sympathizers of Russia/China/Assad/Gaddafi, and of course, those who have written conspiracy theories before.

You are correct on one point: for me there is indeed no credibility or truth in whatever anti vaxxers may say on the topic of vaccination and I do not want to give any of them a tribune in the time we go through.
Same for those who have written conspiracy theories. I just have no time for them and definitely don't want to contribute supporting them.

I can live with the rest of your categories, particularly those having opposed the 2003 invasion of Iraq. In my native country the majority of the people were against the 2003 invasion, and I believe that it was similar in many other European countries such as Germany, Belgium, Italy or Spain to name a few. In fact, back in 2003 I was the head of the student board of my university and I was pretty vocal against the 2003 invasion.

But it seems you don't understand the underlying issues;
Expatindo doesn't want to be used, even indirectly, to promote apologists, revisionists, racists, anti vaxxers, adept of conspiracy theories..etc.
I don't have problem if YOU, @Dave70 elaborate your opinion in a post, even if I disagree with your point of view, as long as it respects our posting guidelines.
However, we (the Moderation Team) are concerned by your abuse of link posting. Each time you post a link on Expatindo, as one of us mod put it, it "has a consequence on the SEO performance of the linked content. As you know, the more links point to a page, the better that page will rank. As such, by allowing links to these contents on Expatindo, we are indirectly supporting them"...

I don't want to support in any way with my money (maintaining a website and forum is not free as you probably know) people like Thierry Meyssan or, for example, any crackpot who use Staline or Hitler infamous rhetoric in a speech. I am reasonably certain that any of the co owners and mod of this forum have the same feeling.

We are discussing the link issue at the moment and will come up with a more complete and official answer but here is what I can already tell you:
Far too often, you just paste a link with zero personal elaboration. If you take the time to read our Posting Guidelines you would find out that it is clearly indicated that it is not authorized. Yet you do it and I have tried patiently, in at least 2 posts to suggest you to stop doing it which you have ignored.

 

[Dave70]

You are correct on one point: for me there is indeed no credibility or truth in whatever anti vaxxers may say on the topic of vaccination

This is the reason why I disagree with @Nimbus regarding my post #353 “A Guide to Mainstream Media ‘Fake News’ War Propaganda” when he replied “Why do you keep dragging in garbage like this? You should know better than relying on an antivaxxer”. You see, the article is NOT about vaccination.

I can live with the rest of your categories, particularly those having opposed the 2003 invasion of Iraq.

Thank you.

However, we (the Moderation Team) are concerned by your abuse of link posting. Each time you post a link on Expatindo, as one of us mod put it, it "has a consequence on the SEO performance of the linked content. As you know, the more links point to a page, the better that page will rank. As such, by allowing links to these contents on Expatindo, we are indirectly supporting them"...

No, I don’t know that. My computer knowhow is much lesser than you, I was already working as company director when you were head of the student board in 2003.

Far too often, you just paste a link with zero personal elaboration. If you take the time to read our Posting Guidelines you would find out that it is clearly indicated that it is not authorized. Yet you do it and I have tried patiently, in at least 2 posts to suggest you to stop doing it which you have ignored.

I honestly don’t know pasting a link with zero personal elaboration is not allowed, nobody said to me that it is prohibited as per Posting Guidelines before. What I remember was suggestion to write my opinion instead of just pasting the link. If someone told me it is prohibited, I would have stopped already.

Just curious, if I remove the https:// and start with www for the link, will it affect the SEO performance?

 

[atlantis]

I was already working as company director when you were head of the student board in 2003.

Have you ever considered initiating an arisan for bule with (long) "life experience"? I have a candidate who may be interested to join.
Just pulling legs here.

 

[atlantis]

I honestly don’t know pasting a link with zero personal elaboration is not allowed, nobody said to me that it is prohibited as per Posting Guidelines before. What I remember was suggestion to write my opinion instead of just pasting the link. If someone told me it is prohibited, I would have stopped already.

When you registered you have ticked a box asking you to confirm that you fully agree with our posting guidelines. We are all different and I understand that. Personally when I am asked to confirm that I agree to something I tend to inform myself before answering. I know it's old school but that's the way I am. Perhaps you should consider it.
The prohibition is clearly indicated in our PG.

 

[Nimbus]

This is the reason why I disagree with @Nimbus regarding my post #353 “A Guide to Mainstream Media ‘Fake News’ War Propaganda” when he replied “Why do you keep dragging in garbage like this? You should know better than relying on an antivaxxer”. You see, the article is NOT about vaccination.

The guy’s stance on vaccination, among others, is a good indication of his credibility. There are so many more intelligent sources, yet you picked a crackpot to quote. Why? Because you can’t find a reasonable person to support your points.

It’s not hard to find a random tukang becak on the street who agrees with Putin and Russian propaganda, but quoting him doesn’t bolster your argument.

 

[Nimbus]

Just to be perfectly clear, I’m not incapable of seeing nuances. I’m bothered by the lack of outrage when Syrian opposition is getting bombed by Assad with help from Russia, and their refugees are getting rejected and limited all over Europe. Meanwhile EU members trip all over themselves to arm Ukraine and throw the border wide open for millions of Ukrainian refugees.

However, this issue doesn’t mean that Ukraine and Europe is wrong while Putin is right. The Soviet Union is history, and Putin has as much claim on Ukraine as China on Vietnam, which is none.

 

[fastpitch17]

Just to be perfectly clear, I’m not incapable of seeing nuances. I’m bothered by the lack of outrage when Syrian opposition is getting bombed by Assad with help from Russia, and their refugees are getting rejected and limited all over Europe. Meanwhile EU members trip all over themselves to arm Ukraine and throw the border wide open for millions of Ukrainian refugees.

However, this issue doesn’t mean that Ukraine and Europe is wrong while Putin is right. The Soviet Union is history, and Putin has as much claim on Ukraine as China on Vietnam, which is none.

Give it a few years and China will probably proclaim all of Asia is theirs because they found this map with some marks on it.

Putin if he lives long enough or one of his deciples will proclaim an even bigger portion of Europe is rightfully theirs because putting a P at the beginning of Prussia was a sign that putin would appear in the future.

OK Dave, you can run with those. Nothing sharp to poke an eye out with.

 

[Nimbus]

This is a very interesting story from the front lines. Ukrainians are able to hold off the numerically and mechanically superior Russians because they are highly motivated in defending their homeland, their military adopted western command doctrine, and they have a decent amount of modern antitank missiles.

Ukraine’s Three-to-One Advantage

It’s not technology or tactics that has given Ukrainian fighters their greatest edge.

www.theatlantic.com

 

[R Cameron]

Give it a few years and China will probably proclaim all of Asia is theirs because they found this map with some marks on it.

Russia certainly isn't giving them a fresh idea, they have been doing it for years in the South China Sea:

Nine-dash line - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[harryopal1]

There is evidence of an early Chinese settlement in the upper reaches of the Rajang River in Sarawak which may well serve some future claim on much of Borneo as part of China.

The Nimbus post highlights the problems Russia will have in subduing Ukraine with its large population. If the Russians can identify an area where Zelesnky is lodged the temptation would be massive bombing followed by a large insertion of paratroopers. The loss of life would be enormous.

A face saving way out would be an unequivocal agreement for Ukraine not to join Nato and I seem to recall Zelesnky was prepared to offer this as a means for a truce.

With talk of war crimes the dreadful reality is that terrible things are done during wars. It could be argued that any leader declaring war might be charged with war crimes as they well know the probability of war crimes occurring. And what then for leaders of countries like Australia which joined the fray in Afghanistan, for example, even when there was no direct threat to their own country?