Visa indeks 318 Repatriasi - Eks. Wni, unmarried, sponsor orang tua - Apa harus jadi Wni di akhir itap 5 tahun?

Sine

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You sure that's 2 years? It was five last time I read the UU, unless I've forgotten. Has been a couple of years.
If I remember correctly, I read it somewhere in UU, it says 2 years, and the officer also says 2 years. Try google “Perhukumham no. 43 Tahun 2015, Article / Pasal 53 Verse / Ayat 2”. Probably this one. Or unless they revised it or annulled it it should be still in effect. But you know the govt keep changing the laws, can’t keep up with it.

Given that spouse-sponsored has its own challenges, but I’m kind of envy you guys, your KITAS/KITAP appears more secure and more straight forward than the ex Wni one. Less room for the officers to have their own interpretations (less bs / random local rules for applying).
 

HappyMan

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Sine, I don't know how far you want to push it, but this is what the PermenKuHam says the KanIm guys should do when they don't accept your papers, “
Dalam hal permohonan sebagaimanakembali dimaksud pada ayat (1) belum lengkap, Kepala Kantor Imigrasi atau Pejabat Imigrasi yang ditunjuk mengembalikan permohonan kepada pemohon disertai dengan bukti tanda pengembalian yang memuat alasan pengembalian dan pernyataan yang menyatakan bahwa permohonan ditarik kembali."

Passport must be longer lived than KITAS. “
Jangka waktu Izin Tinggal Terbatas diberikan tidak dapat melampaui masa berlaku Paspor Kebangsaannya“ Pasal 34, same document.
 

Sine

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This one. But it’s in Indo tho. Can’t find English version. Probably spouse / friends can translate it.
 

Sine

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Sine, I don't know how far you want to push it, but this is what the PermenKuHam says the KanIm guys should do when they don't accept your papers, “
Dalam hal permohonan sebagaimanakembali dimaksud pada ayat (1) belum lengkap, Kepala Kantor Imigrasi atau Pejabat Imigrasi yang ditunjuk mengembalikan permohonan kepada pemohon disertai dengan bukti tanda pengembalian yang memuat alasan pengembalian dan pernyataan yang menyatakan bahwa permohonan ditarik kembali."

Passport must be longer lived than KITAS. “
Jangka waktu Izin Tinggal Terbatas diberikan tidak dapat melampaui masa berlaku Paspor Kebangsaannya“ Pasal 34, same document.
You are right. I’m not gonna fight them on this one. I’m planning to just renew my passport when I get my passport back (Update: my KITAS renewal is approved. Tomorrow gonna pick it up). Seems not worth it to fight them on this one. Not planning to get on their bad side bc of this one. Probably I’m too cupu hahahaa
 

HappyMan

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If I remember correctly, I read it somewhere in UU, it says 2 years, and the officer also says 2 years. Try google “Perhukumham no. 43 Tahun 2015, Article / Pasal 53 Verse / Ayat 2”. Probably this one. Or unless they revised it or annulled it it should be still in effect. But you know the govt keep changing the laws, can’t keep up with it.

Given that spouse-sponsored has its own challenges, but I’m kind of envy you guys, your KITAS/KITAP appears more secure and more straight forward than the ex Wni one. Less room for the officers to have their own interpretations (less bs / random local rules for applying).
You are right. Probably more than five years ago at this point... Time flies.
kutipan akta perkawinan yang telah diterjemahkan
dalam bahasa Indonesia oleh penerjemah
tersumpah, kecuali bahasa Inggris dengan usia
perkawinan paling singkat 2 (dua) tahun terhitung
sejak tanggal perkawinan dilangsungkan secara sah
di dalam atau luar negeri;
 

Sine

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You are right. Probably more than five years ago at this point... Time flies.
kutipan akta perkawinan yang telah diterjemahkan
dalam bahasa Indonesia oleh penerjemah
tersumpah, kecuali bahasa Inggris dengan usia
perkawinan paling singkat 2 (dua) tahun terhitung
sejak tanggal perkawinan dilangsungkan secara sah
di dalam atau luar negeri;
Yes, this part. It seems more reasonable and humane than the previous req’t for spousal KITAP. Let’s hope the gov’t / MPR becomes more humane in handling our visas. I agree that laws should be firm and fair, but also it need to be humane, because we are humans after all. No one wants to go through all the papers work and at times bs requirement if not for our family
 

HappyMan

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Yes, this part. It seems more reasonable and humane than the previous req’t for spousal KITAP. Let’s hope the gov’t / MPR becomes more humane in handling our visas. I agree that laws should be firm and fair, but also it need to be humane, because we are humans after all. No one wants to go through all the papers work and at times bs requirement if not for our family
I'd love to see dual nationality become possible. I'd immediately start preparations to become a citizen. I just don't see what upside there is for the MPR... Nationalism is speaking loudly all over the world these days, and it isn't the "our country is so great, everyone should come and join us in our rush towards progress" type, either.
Were you following the news a while back (year or two) when all those stories misrepresenting the number of TKA China went viral? Seems like it is easy to convince some part of the population that masses and masses of foreigners stand ready to invade.
 

Helpful Herbert

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I heard a story of a friend of a friend. Every time they argue the wife always threaten to not sponsoring him anymore or whenever he need to renew visa or whatever surat2, the wife always acting up and kind of black mailing him (emotionally and financially).

So she's somewhere between wife and agent!
 

SamR

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Hi SamR

Sorry for the long reply. Let’s hope it turn out well for all of us. From what I heard from the petugas here, they say spouse sponsor is easier, but of course it has its own challenges too. Let’s hope the petugas that help us not making things difficult.

How’s your experience as ex.wni? Do you mind I’m asking if you planning to become Wni again?

Man I can’t wait the day the govt allows dual citizenship. It’s been almost 10 years since Jokowi says they gonna review the citizenship UU. Do think it will become reality in the next 10 years? Or perhaps it’s just a pipe dream and empty promise to appeases the diaspora?

1. Yeah I think it shouldn’t be a big deal if our passport still have like at least more than 6 months validity. But I just don’t want to argue with them. Also I don’t want them to use my passport expiration(Aug 22) as an excuse for rejecting my ITAP application in the future. What you are saying is right. They can just mutasi the stamp into the new passport, but hell they got the last word. I’m just gonna give in on this one, renewing my passport it’s not a bad idea too.

So true, yearly KITAS brings more revenue. But it’s kind of F’up (sorry if we can’t say it in this forum. In my defense, it’s a proper Queens, NY English :) ) to play with people emotions and lives just to earn more. Probably I’m just too naive.

2&3. Yeah down side of not living in Java is having not many or perhaps none good agent. All infos are either from online or from the local immigration office. Even if we quote the UU or whatever resources online, at most they say it’s not the way no more or new regulation came out even though we can’t find it anywhere online. It seems each office have their own sets of rules and ways doing things. When I just moved here, I’m really having hard time holding my tongue and not arguing with the petugas. I guess we used to say whatever in our mind outside of Indo hahaha.

Yeah the officers also say it’s easier if it’s spouse sponsored. I know I’m not perfect, nor I’m not a supermodel material. No one is perfect. Perhaps I’m too picky, but I’m not asking for supermodel wife either. Appearance aside it seems I haven’t been able to find some one that I can really click with. Hahahaha just my luck. I heard a story of a friend of a friend. Every time they argue the wife always threaten to not sponsoring him anymore or whenever he need to renew visa or whatever surat2, the wife always acting up and kind of black mailing him (emotionally and financially). Given not all women like that, men too can be like that. But I just don’t want to be in that position, given if I’m just marrying some one for visa. Hahahaha idk I just overthink it probably.


Yeah the dilemma, I’m still thinking/debating too. Let’s hope we can find the best solution soon, a solution that fits for us, the worry and stress are killing me. Let’s hope and I’m sure good days are on the way. At least what I’m telling my self to keep me sane. I’m glad we all can share infos and experiences here.

Cheers to all of us!!

Being an ex-WNI, aside from your documents, you can blend in pretty well. I’m still uncomfortable producing personal documents unless the person I’m producing it to is someone who I’ll be dealing with on a regular basis and who I relatively trust (Ie. HR at the office, Ketua RT) the reaction is varied. I’ve had all kinds of reaction from awe, indifference, confusion, and yes, even hostility.

Yes, my endgame is to eventually become a WNI (again). I’ve gathered enough info to know the steps but I know there’s a whole lot of loopholes to jump. My focus is mostly how to get to a Spouse-Sponsored Kitap.

About the Citizenship Law, can’t rely on something happening soon. There’s probably a whole lot of other issues that require attention in this country.

1. Yes, I think that what for us is our lives and our existence in this country is something that doesn't mean a lot to them. You'll never be disappointed if you adopt this attitude.

2&3. Keep looking around for information because what you're asking is "advanced stuff". In my experience asking around, most agents don't know much beyond work-sponsored Kitas. Even so, it's important to crosscheck. Can't rely solely on the information of an immigration officer.
 

Sine

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I'd love to see dual nationality become possible. I'd immediately start preparations to become a citizen. I just don't see what upside there is for the MPR... Nationalism is speaking loudly all over the world these days, and it isn't the "our country is so great, everyone should come and join us in our rush towards progress" type, either.
Were you following the news a while back (year or two) when all those stories misrepresenting the number of TKA China went viral? Seems like it is easy to convince some part of the population that masses and masses of foreigners stand ready to invade.
Yeah it’s sad that so many people have false sense of nationalism, and certain groups of people exploit that emotion. Not saying nationalism is bad, but too much of it will spoils everything. It’s like salt, a right amount makes food good, too much or too little makes the food uneatable.



I just saw it in passing, but I didn’t really follow the news. I don’t have a strong preference about globalization, but it’s inevitable. Sooner or later, or perhaps already is. Unfortunately some people in charge instead of treat the root causes like income gap, opportunity for basic + higher, social inequality, and many more that I’m not even aware of, they keep fanning the flames. Taking shortcuts blaming / pitting one group against another. Tka or local labor forces are both good, one can’t replace the other. There are skills that we can learn from TKA, and at the same times there are our local skills that can be shared with Tka. Let’s hope all good will prevail.
 

Sine

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Being an ex-WNI, aside from your documents, you can blend in pretty well. I’m still uncomfortable producing personal documents unless the person I’m producing it to is someone who I’ll be dealing with on a regular basis and who I relatively trust (Ie. HR at the office, Ketua RT) the reaction is varied. I’ve had all kinds of reaction from awe, indifference, confusion, and yes, even hostility.

Yes, my endgame is to eventually become a WNI (again). I’ve gathered enough info to know the steps but I know there’s a whole lot of loopholes to jump. My focus is mostly how to get to a Spouse-Sponsored Kitap.

About the Citizenship Law, can’t rely on something happening soon. There’s probably a whole lot of other issues that require attention in this country.

1. Yes, I think that what for us is our lives and our existence in this country is something that doesn't mean a lot to them. You'll never be disappointed if you adopt this attitude.

2&3. Keep looking around for information because what you're asking is "advanced stuff". In my experience asking around, most agents don't know much beyond work-sponsored Kitas. Even so, it's important to crosscheck. Can't rely solely on the information of an immigration officer.
Agree, as an ex Wni, it’s easier for us to blend in, and no one will try to charge us “bule rate”. Same here, I’m still uncomfortable to let people know that I’m an ex. Yes, me too! All kinds of reaction, the one I most dreaded of is hostility. Some time I wonder why the flying flamingo non Wnis / even foreigners in other countries tend to get blames for all the bs things tha’s not even remotely

Even though I’m still on the fence about becoming wni, and on the paper not Wni. I still consider my self as Indo and, it’s in my blood, heritage, and perhaps even soul. Proud and love to be Indo. At the same time I love my current citizenship, it’s a part of me too, all the good and bad times spent there made me who I am today. Both indo and my current nationality are who I am. As an illustration, both my parents are Wni, but choosing between indo and my other nationalities are akin to choosing between mom and dad. To some people, they are closer to one of the parents, but of course it is difficult to choose one over the other.

Do you mind me asking what is the final factor that made you decide to become Wni again? If it’s too personal, I’m sorry for intruding and if you don’t feel like answering it, no hard feeling.
I’m still undecided. For me I’m thinking about later in the future if my kids want to go to school overseas and God forbids my parents need some medical attention, I can become their sponsor to visits. Also who knows when I have some blessings, I would like to visits without worry about visa. At the same time, I already decided to live in Indo permanently, both my parents are here and they are no longer young. Even though I can be much help to them, I still want to help out at home as much as I can. Hence the dilemma.
True, there are lots of our Indo brothers and sisters still against the idea of dual citizenship. But I’m still hoping for miracles. Who knows perhaps there are gonna be some events that change their perceptions, and hopefully in our life time we can see it happens.


Hahaha true, sometimes I’m speechless with their apathy and even full on hates toward us. Hahaha I’m starting to adjusting my expectation, it helps.

You are right, always cross checking and have lots of sources. Most agents only know the surface stuff, once the case deviates from the usual they start pulling the info up their sweet divine behinds. Some officers are sincere and genuine want to help, but some are downright spiteful and borderline psychotic. The hardest part for me to recognize them, usually I realize after I went around chasing ghost. Let’s hope we meet good officers and agents.
 

SamR

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Jul 7, 2020
Messages
11
Agree, as an ex Wni, it’s easier for us to blend in, and no one will try to charge us “bule rate”. Same here, I’m still uncomfortable to let people know that I’m an ex. Yes, me too! All kinds of reaction, the one I most dreaded of is hostility. Some time I wonder why the flying flamingo non Wnis / even foreigners in other countries tend to get blames for all the bs things tha’s not even remotely

Even though I’m still on the fence about becoming wni, and on the paper not Wni. I still consider my self as Indo and, it’s in my blood, heritage, and perhaps even soul. Proud and love to be Indo. At the same time I love my current citizenship, it’s a part of me too, all the good and bad times spent there made me who I am today. Both indo and my current nationality are who I am. As an illustration, both my parents are Wni, but choosing between indo and my other nationalities are akin to choosing between mom and dad. To some people, they are closer to one of the parents, but of course it is difficult to choose one over the other.

Do you mind me asking what is the final factor that made you decide to become Wni again? If it’s too personal, I’m sorry for intruding and if you don’t feel like answering it, no hard feeling.
I’m still undecided. For me I’m thinking about later in the future if my kids want to go to school overseas and God forbids my parents need some medical attention, I can become their sponsor to visits. Also who knows when I have some blessings, I would like to visits without worry about visa. At the same time, I already decided to live in Indo permanently, both my parents are here and they are no longer young. Even though I can be much help to them, I still want to help out at home as much as I can. Hence the dilemma.
True, there are lots of our Indo brothers and sisters still against the idea of dual citizenship. But I’m still hoping for miracles. Who knows perhaps there are gonna be some events that change their perceptions, and hopefully in our life time we can see it happens.


Hahaha true, sometimes I’m speechless with their apathy and even full on hates toward us. Hahaha I’m starting to adjusting my expectation, it helps.

You are right, always cross checking and have lots of sources. Most agents only know the surface stuff, once the case deviates from the usual they start pulling the info up their sweet divine behinds. Some officers are sincere and genuine want to help, but some are downright spiteful and borderline psychotic. The hardest part for me to recognize them, usually I realize after I went around chasing ghost. Let’s hope we meet good officers and agents.

Not intruding, but it just would be too long a story and another long post. My interest in the WNI fluctuates from time to time but right now it's 70-30 in favor of WNI so that's why I'm in favor of it. But regardless what my end decision would be, one thing's sure, it would be good to get the Kitap.

If I can ask, how did you decide on the Kitas Repatriasi route? Were there any other Kitas choices you considered? Picking a choice and then being told that you "must" apply for a citizenship especially when the citizenship application is not guaranteed and you have to leave is a bit scary.
 

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