Long overstay, wanting to exit. Best course of action?

[Shadrach]

If your passport is lost or stolen, it is no longer something "owned" (dimilikinya) and this law doesn't apply.

Yes, it's a good idea to have your passport with you, or a copy. If you're traveling about around the country, then of course a person would have it on them, but if you are just traveling around the Island and not leaving, I recommend carrying just a copy. You don't want to accidentally ruin, or lose it.

 

[fastpitch17]

A few years back there was a discussion here concerning sone foreigners who were stopped and PP and Visas checked. They did not have them on them and were detained. By the end of the discussion I went away thinking that you should always have your visa with you and you have 1 day to produce your passport. There certainly are visa and PP checks here and I don't believe Immigration are the only ones who can demand you producing them.

 

[André]

Hi guys!
An update on my misery. I have not yet left Indonesia, but I have myself to blame with that. It has been all about timing.
Here is a short resumé so far.

Took a taxi to Kualanamu airport on a Friday (March 21st), hoping I could leave from there on the following Monday or Tuesday, buying a ticket from there.
However, going to immigration at the airport with my length of overstay, was the wrong move. They told me I had to go to the main immigration office in Medan to sort this out, a two hours drive (incl. traffic). I asked if it had made any difference if I had already bought my ticket, they said absolutely not. They can't process any overstay there with this length. That would have been a loss of money, so I'm glad I didn't buy the tickets beforehand.

So off I went, took a Grab back to the city. Turned up at the immigration a short hour before closing time, and was questioned for about 30 min. Turned out this was far from as bad as I feared or thought, they were in fact quite friendly. They just wondered why, and how I financed myself during these years. No problems answering that.

However, their boss wasn't there, it was Friday, so I needed to come back on Monday. I was free to go, and was told that I was cleared in the sense that if I had any encounters with authorities, I should just say that I had already turned myself in, just give immigration a call if they needed to.

Found an accommodation for the weekend, and showed up again at their office on Monday afternoon, as told.
However, and here is the twist, the timing was awful. They said they needed a week to process my case, I was okey with that of course (I've waited 5 years, what's another week..). But, as said, my timing was horrible. Immigration has closed from the 28th, to the 8th.. 10 days. National holidays, Eid al-Fitr..

So unfortunately, since Jakarta has to go through this as well, the time was too short to get me out of Indonesia before mid day the 28th. That gave them only 3-4 days.
Again, after chatting with them for an hour or so, they just let me go, and told me to come back April 8th. Now I could buy a ticket with that timeframe ahead (it's a lot to save if you buy a week or two ahead).

Found a cheap accommodation again, for another 3 weeks.. So I'm currently just waiting for them to process my case after they open from the 8th.

So this will now have taken 3 weeks before I'm out of Indonesia. But no worries for me. I'm just happy, and a bit surprised, this is going so smooth. No tough interrogations, just friendly faces everywhere. We had quite a good tone in the end, before I left. I commend these employees at Medan Immigration, for being so humane and friendly in a difficult situation for me. I must admit I was touched by that.

For the record, there is no fee to be paid, as I thought. Only my ticket. I was never asked to give up my passport. They have trusted me to come back and solve this issue. I expect them to keep my passport from the 8th, giving it the correct stamps, and I suppose I will be getting it back a week later, at the gate.

Never was detention mentioned. I asked about it, and they said they have no one detained in Medan at the moment, and I was much better off finding accomodations of my own.

I will be officially deported, and escorted to the gate when that day comes. The ban may be lifted later on, they said, but I needed to contact the Indonesian embassy in my country for that.

All in all, this was nothing to worry about. They said I should have come much sooner, and then at least had the papers done. Then they would have just waited (no detention), and I could have traveled as soon as I could afford it. Can't disagree with that.

Well, happy Eid, or (soon) happy Easter, guys. Take care, and do not overstay. For me, never again.

André

 

[harryopal1]

Hi guys!
An update on my misery. I have not yet left Indonesia, but I have myself to blame with that. It has been all about timing.
Here is a short resumé so far.

Took a taxi to Kualanamu airport on a Friday (March 21st), hoping I could leave from there on the following Monday or Tuesday, buying a ticket from there.
However, going to immigration at the airport with my length of overstay, was the wrong move. They told me I had to go to the main immigration office in Medan to sort this out, a two hours drive (incl. traffic). I asked if it had made any difference if I had already bought my ticket, they said absolutely not. They can't process any overstay there with this length. That would have been a loss of money, so I'm glad I didn't buy the tickets beforehand.

So off I went, took a Grab back to the city. Turned up at the immigration a short hour before closing time, and was questioned for about 30 min. Turned out this was far from as bad as I feared or thought, they were in fact quite friendly. They just wondered why, and how I financed myself during these years. No problems answering that.

However, their boss wasn't there, it was Friday, so I needed to come back on Monday. I was free to go, and was told that I was cleared in the sense that if I had any encounters with authorities, I should just say that I had already turned myself in, just give immigration a call if they needed to.

Found an accommodation for the weekend, and showed up again at their office on Monday afternoon, as told.
However, and here is the twist, the timing was awful. They said they needed a week to process my case, I was okey with that of course (I've waited 5 years, what's another week..). But, as said, my timing was horrible. Immigration has closed from the 28th, to the 8th.. 10 days. National holidays, Eid al-Fitr..

So unfortunately, since Jakarta has to go through this as well, the time was too short to get me out of Indonesia before mid day the 28th. That gave them only 3-4 days.
Again, after chatting with them for an hour or so, they just let me go, and told me to come back April 8th. Now I could buy a ticket with that timeframe ahead (it's a lot to save if you buy a week or two ahead).

Found a cheap accommodation again, for another 3 weeks.. So I'm currently just waiting for them to process my case after they open from the 8th.

So this will now have taken 3 weeks before I'm out of Indonesia. But no worries for me. I'm just happy, and a bit surprised, this is going so smooth. No tough interrogations, just friendly faces everywhere. We had quite a good tone in the end, before I left. I commend these employees at Medan Immigration, for being so humane and friendly in a difficult situation for me. I must admit I was touched by that.

For the record, there is no fee to be paid, as I thought. Only my ticket. I was never asked to give up my passport. They have trusted me to come back and solve this issue. I expect them to keep my passport from the 8th, giving it the correct stamps, and I suppose I will be getting it back a week later, at the gate.

Never was detention mentioned. I asked about it, and they said they have no one detained in Medan at the moment, and I was much better off finding accomodations of my own.

I will be officially deported, and escorted to the gate when that day comes. The ban may be lifted later on, they said, but I needed to contact the Indonesian embassy in my country for that.

All in all, this was nothing to worry about. They said I should have come much sooner, and then at least had the papers done. Then they would have just waited (no detention), and I could have traveled as soon as I could afford it. Can't disagree with that.

Well, happy Eid, or (soon) happy Easter, guys. Take care, and do not overstay. For me, never again.

André

Thanks for the update. Glad to that has turned out okay for you without anything like the ominous fate that might have seemed in store. Happy travels.

 

[André]

Thanks for the update. Glad to that has turned out okay for you without anything like the ominous fate that might have seemed in store. Happy travels.

Thank you Yes, it could definitely have been a lot worse.

 

[pantaiema]

Thank you Yes, it could definitely have been a lot worse.

In my personal opinion, living in Denmark would be a much better choice for you. Scandinavian countries are well known for their excellent welfare systems, ensuring that the government takes care of its citizens. On the other hand, consider how many illegal immigrants try to stay in Denmark, some are using human rights as a shield while benefiting from the system without ever contributing. The only downside is the weather, freezing cold.

Hopefully, things will soon be a happy ending.

 

[André]

In my personal opinion, living in Denmark would be a much better choice for you. Scandinavian countries are well known for their excellent welfare systems, ensuring that the government takes care of its citizens. On the other hand, consider how many illegal immigrants try to stay in Denmark, some are using human rights as a shield while benefiting from the system without ever contributing. The only downside is the weather, freezing cold.

Hopefully, things will soon be a happy ending.

Thanks, but I suppose you mean Norway. Yes, I love my country, but the winters are just too much for me. I was a snow bird for many years, before I moved to Thailand. I will retire in Thailand, for the following reasons. The climate and weather, beaches, infrastructure, the cost of living, and the diversity, where everyone is equal. It's been my choice as a pensioner for a long time.

 

[Bad_azz]

I am glad it all went reasonably well for you.
Yes, your timing was off but that could have also gone in your favour re your treatment because Ramadan is a month of peaceful good feelings and self reflection for many Muslims. So, they may well have been in their kindest mindset towards you
Anyway, a few weeks delay not locked up is preferable to several (extra) days locked in a cell I would think. I hope you get the rest of your process completed with kindness and dignity and enjoy your time ahead, in Thailand- avoid rooftop swimming pools though

 

[André]

I am glad it all went reasonably well for you.
Yes, your timing was off but that could have also gone in your favour re your treatment because Ramadan is a month of peaceful good feelings and self reflection for many Muslims. So, they may well have been in their kindest mindset towards you
Anyway, a few weeks delay not locked up is preferable to several (extra) days locked in a cell I would think. I hope you get the rest of your process completed with kindness and dignity and enjoy your time ahead, in Thailand- avoid rooftop swimming pools though

Thank you Yes, I definitely needed some good news, and some kind faces. Good thinking about Ramadan, I didn't think of it that way. I also met a Grab taxi driver, a Muslim, who has become a good friend, so something good came out of all this misery.
Yes, rooftop pools seem like a hazard these days, I'll do my best to avoid them, 555

 

[Helpful Herbert]

So you don't have to pay any overstay fine at all?

 

[André]

So you don't have to pay any overstay fine at all?

No. No overstay fine after 60 days. Deportation instead, with the consequences that means (a ban from entering Indonesia a certain period of time). Confirmed by immigration.

 

[Balifrog]

Thanks, but I suppose you mean Norway. Yes, I love my country, but the winters are just too much for me. I was a snow bird for many years, before I moved to Thailand. I will retire in Thailand, for the following reasons. The climate and weather, beaches, infrastructure, the cost of living, and the diversity, where everyone is equal. It's been my choice as a pensioner for a long time.

Be carefull with immigration and visa rules in Thailand.
Much stricter than here !

 

[André]

Be carefull with immigration and visa rules in Thailand.
Much stricter than here !

Yes, true. The first 60 days have a 6 times higher overstay fee in Indonesia than in Thailand though (max. 20.000 baht), but apart from that, Thailand is known for its horrible conditions if you are caught overstaying, with its overcrowded detention centre in Bangkok.
But they do have a better solution when you have a ticket in hand, and show up at the airport though. A 20.000 baht fee, with a ban, and you will go through without deportation or detention, or being questioned, regardless of the length of your overstay. That process takes 10-15 minutes.

For me that won't be a problem. I will enter on a 60 days visa exemption, and apply for a visa based on retirement straight away, with yearly extensions.

Thailand does have a better and larger variety of visa solutions though. Especially for longer stay expats, digital nomads and retirement visas.

 

[Balifrog]

Yes, true. The first 60 days have a 6 times higher overstay fee in Indonesia than in Thailand though (max. 20.000 baht), but apart from that, Thailand is known for its horrible conditions if you are caught overstaying, with its overcrowded detention centre in Bangkok.
But they do have a better solution when you have a ticket in hand, and show up at the airport though. A 20.000 baht fee, with a ban, and you will go through without deportation or detention, or being questioned, regardless of the length of your overstay. That process takes 10-15 minutes.

For me that won't be a problem. I will enter on a 60 days visa exemption, and apply for a visa based on retirement straight away, with yearly extensions.

Thailand does have a better and larger variety of visa solutions though. Especially for longer stay expats, digital nomads and retirement visas.

I lived / worked in BKK from 89 till 99, and yes I remember we used and abused the "reasonable overstay" with payment at the airport. No ban applied.

Requirements the retirement visa :
You must meet one of the following financial requirements:

• Security Deposit: Hold a security deposit of at least 800,000 THB in a Thai bank account for at least 2 months before applying for the visa.
• Monthly Income: Have a monthly income (including pension) of at least 65,000 THB.
• Combination: A combination of a Thai bank deposit and yearly income totaling at least 800,000 THB.
  • Proof of Income: If claiming income, you'll need an affidavit from your embassy or consulate in Thailand verifying your income.
  • Bank Statement: If your embassy doesn't issue income letters, you can provide a 12-month bank statement showing regular deposits of 65,000 THB into a Thai bank account.

And proof of that bank deposit need to be shown at each visa extension, but a good agency can "help" you with that (for a fee..).
Don't forget the 90 day reporting. Can be done online nowadays.

 

[André]

I lived / worked in BKK from 89 till 99, and yes I remember we used and abused the "reasonable overstay" with payment at the airport. No ban applied.

Requirements the retirement visa :
You must meet one of the following financial requirements:

• Security Deposit: Hold a security deposit of at least 800,000 THB in a Thai bank account for at least 2 months before applying for the visa.
• Monthly Income: Have a monthly income (including pension) of at least 65,000 THB.
• Combination:A combination of a Thai bank deposit and yearly income totaling at least 800,000 THB.
  • Proof of Income: If claiming income, you'll need an affidavit from your embassy or consulate in Thailand verifying your income.
  • Bank Statement: If your embassy doesn't issue income letters, you can provide a 12-month bank statement showing regular deposits of 65,000 THB into a Thai bank account.

And proof of that bank deposit need to be shown at each visa extension, but a good agency can "help" you with that (for a fee..).
Don't forget the 90 day reporting. Can be done online nowadays.

All true and correct. Living in Thailand for almost 15 years myself, married to a Thai woman for most of them. Back then it was routine to do as many border runs as you wanted, but times have changed since then. They won't allow more than a few now. I remember those terrible trips by vans to the Cambodian border, where the drivers always tried to set a new speed record.. I guess I'm lucky to still be alive.

Yes, a 90 days Non Immigrant O visa based on retirement will be my next visa. With yearly extensions. I think I will use a visa agent (approximately 25k baht for the first 15 months, cut to 12.5k for the yearly extensions) to cover the financial requirement. I think that's a good deal. I don't have to, but I will be careful with the "new" tax law in Thailand, and I'll be prepared to pay taxes there, for what I bring into the country.

 

[André]

Hi good people, just to wrap up this thread. A little late update, but everything went according to plan on my return to my country. Exactly one week after my original and complete interview, I boarded my plane April 15th. Escorted by two immigration officers. During this process, they said this normally takes longer time, but they were very helpful to find a solution so I could leave before Easter.

I must add that I was treated very well, and my total experience with the immigration in Medan, is a ten out of ten.

No fine was paid, as previously stated. The only fee paid, which has been added to their policy recently, is that I had to pay for the transport to the airport. In my case, a few hundred thousand rupiah, paid to the drivers (immigration officers).

However, a very interesting change in rules made recently as well, is this (I think it's worth noting for future cases):
Everyone deported for overstay, may be able to re-enter Indonesia, if he/she pays a fine of 60 million rupiah. This procedure must be done at the Indonesian embassy in their home country. Then their ban is lifted.

If so, they are back at square one, and can move forward as if they did pay this fine within the first 60 days of overstay in the first place.

Enjoy your summer, guys, I know I will, after these years of a personal nightmare.
Be safe, and don't overstay!

André

 

[Shadrach]

I lived / worked in BKK from 89 till 99, and yes I remember we used and abused the "reasonable overstay" with payment at the airport. No ban applied.

Requirements the retirement visa :
You must meet one of the following financial requirements:

• Security Deposit: Hold a security deposit of at least 800,000 THB in a Thai bank account for at least 2 months before applying for the visa.
• Monthly Income: Have a monthly income (including pension) of at least 65,000 THB.
• Combination: A combination of a Thai bank deposit and yearly income totaling at least 800,000 THB.
  • Proof of Income: If claiming income, you'll need an affidavit from your embassy or consulate in Thailand verifying your income.
  • Bank Statement: If your embassy doesn't issue income letters, you can provide a 12-month bank statement showing regular deposits of 65,000 THB into a Thai bank account.

And proof of that bank deposit need to be shown at each visa extension, but a good agency can "help" you with that (for a fee..).
Don't forget the 90 day reporting. Can be done online nowadays.

That's almost $2000. How often is a regular deposit? How many years do you get at first with this retirement visa? Is it like here five years first?

 

[André]

That's almost $2000. How often is a regular deposit? How many years do you get at first with this retirement visa? Is it like here five years first?

Showing 800k baht in a Thai bank, on the day of application within Thailand, gives you a Non-Immigration O visa based on retirement for 90 days. This money needs to be held in your Thai bank for 2 months prior to your application for an extension, which is 12 months, which you can do yearly. No limit on years.
The money is always yours, no need for further deposits.

The rules are that you can spend up to 400k of it, but never go below 400k. You must have 800k in your account minimum two months prior, and three months after your application for further 12 months extensions.
If you are late, or go below the required amount, you won't get your extension approved. They are very strict on that.

You can also apply for an A-O visa in your own country. Then the money can be shown in your own country's account. That gives you one year, which you can extend in Thailand, by transferring money to a Thai bank. That visa has health insurance requirement, which the O visa within Thailand doesn't have.

If using an agent to do this for you within Thailand, you'll get 15 months first time (3+12). But you need to continue with an agent doing so, or else you need to start over again, and cancel your original visa/extension.

If you use the 65k baht a month option, you need to show 12 months regular deposits into a Thai bank account (every month, not below 65k), before your visa is granted That is if your embassy does not issue an income guarantee letter, which most countries now don't (USA, UK, Australia etc.).

 

[pantaiema]

That's almost $2000. How often is a regular deposit? How many years do you get at first with this retirement visa? Is it like here five years first?

Indonesian retirement visa E33E requirement:
Proof of income or benefits with a minimum value of US$3k per month AND
Statement of commitment that the applicant will deposit funds in an account in his/her own name worth at least US$50k in a state-owned bank.

The requirement for other type of retirement Visa E33F, is more lenient no need for Rp50kdeposit in in a state-owned bank, but
you will need a guarantor for this visa
Bank account proving income or allowance with a value of US$3k per month is still required.

 

[Balifrog]

Hi good people, just to wrap up this thread. A little late update, but everything went according to plan on my return to my country. Exactly one week after my original and complete interview, I boarded my plane April 15th. Escorted by two immigration officers. During this process, they said this normally takes longer time, but they were very helpful to find a solution so I could leave before Easter.

I must add that I was treated very well, and my total experience with the immigration in Medan, is a ten out of ten.

No fine was paid, as previously stated. The only fee paid, which has been added to their policy recently, is that I had to pay for the transport to the airport. In my case, a few hundred thousand rupiah, paid to the drivers (immigration officers).

However, a very interesting change in rules made recently as well, is this (I think it's worth noting for future cases):
Everyone deported for overstay, may be able to re-enter Indonesia, if he/she pays a fine of 60 million rupiah. This procedure must be done at the Indonesian embassy in their home country. Then their ban is lifted.

If so, they are back at square one, and can move forward as if they did pay this fine within the first 60 days of overstay in the first place.

Enjoy your summer, guys, I know I will, after these years of a personal nightmare.
Be safe, and don't overstay!

André

Thanks for the update and all the best in Thailand !