'Hizbut Tahrir Indonesia' Rallies for Its Caliphate

Please , All of you. Stop this intellectual babble about nothing! You have gotten so far off track of the original subject matter, where are you taking this? Comparing Bob, Sam or Joe to Galileo really is irrelevant! No one now really know anything about Someone that lived 500 years ago!
Come back to Earth and discuss topics relevant to Today! Just because you can use High level words or University Scholars words, doesn't make you sound any more intelligent! It's becoming Psychobabble! 😵‍💫🤪🫵🤮
 
Please , All of you. Stop this intellectual babble about nothing! You have gotten so far off track of the original subject matter, where are you taking this? Comparing Bob, Sam or Joe to Galileo really is irrelevant! No one now really know anything about Someone that lived 500 years ago!
Come back to Earth and discuss topics relevant to Today! Just because you can use High level words or University Scholars words, doesn't make you sound any more intelligent! It's becoming Psychobabble! 😵‍💫🤪🫵🤮
It's too late, I've already ordered my 'Bob but you can call me Galileo' name cards.
It's not at all off topic.
Actually we know much about very many people who lived hundreds of years ago. Was Henry VIII a nice guy or not?
If you're bored you can be excused.
 
You like to hear yourself talk don't you?. You have went off on another strange tangent just to make yourself fell like you are accomplishing something.
Well, someone who just enjoys hearing themselves talk might not be thinking clearly, while I believe I’m still able to write sensibly to this thread and forum.

And who first went off-topic ? see Post #70, #72 and now Post #78. And what sort of accomplishment do you think someone needs to achieve to be proven to someone like @Hawk256 and @Bob, no financial gain. But If you come across a post in this thread that you find misleading or insulting to your intelligence, it's important to challenge it and explain why. We can also continue discussing the value of credible sources and reliable witnesses in forming beliefs in a separate thread. If you start a new thread on that topic, I’d be glad to contribute to the discussion

If a person witnessed a crime but the media didn't cover it, and their IQ was below genius level, should they be believed? Or if something happened but wasn't published, did it really happen? You put so much strength in publishing. If you want to continue this ridiculous argument, at least keep it on track and honest.
Do you watch the news on TV or read newspapers? If so, ask yourself why do you do that? When you follow news about events happening in parts of the world you can’t personally witness, you rely on credible sources, reputable journalists and media outlets, as your eyes and ears. That’s one of the core functions of journalism: to report on events so the public doesn’t need to be physically present to understand and believe what’s happening

Or if something happened but wasn't published, did it really happen?
A simple answer is: maybe yes, maybe no, you just don't know for sure. But what's the likelihood that it's true, especially when it's something controversial or hard to believe and the claim comes from an unknown person with no reputation on the subject. Hoaxes and scams do happen, don’t they? That’s exactly why probability theory exists in science to assess such uncertainties.

For example, if someone claims they can compound your money by 60%pa consistently over the long term by trading forex or stocks, but their track record doesn’t even come close to that of world-renowned traders like Jim Simons, would you really trust them to manage your money, or to learn their method?

You put so much strength in publishing. If you want to continue this ridiculous argument, at least keep it on track and honest.
I'm not sure if you're familiar with how referencing works in scientific, academic journals, books. Scientists, including Nobel laureates, support their theses and theories by citing, referencing to credible sources and previously published scientific work.

Rational individuals tend to place more trust in research, news, reports published by reputable sources, rather than in claims made by random, unknown individuals on the internet
Use your own method and prove to me that @Bob isn't as smart as Galileo.
Well, since you're asking, here we go. Most senior high school students know about the law of energy conservation. Noone on this earth can GENERATE or destroy energy, you could only CONVERT energy from one form to another. This could also be applied when you want to make hydrogen fuel cell from water, thin air (water vapour) e.g by separating H2 and O2. But you will still need energy to separate them. If a person is unfamiliar with this basic concept, then he is likely not as informed as the average high school students. And clearly, no one sensible would consider someone like Galileo to be just an average person. 😁😁😁


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trader
 
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Well, someone who just enjoys hearing themselves talk might not be thinking clearly, while I believe I’m still able to write sensibly to this thread and forum.

And who first went off-topic ? see Post #72 and now Post #78. And what sort of accomplishment do you think someone needs to achieve to be proven to someone like @Hawk256 and @Bob, no financial gain. But If you come across a post in this thread that you find misleading or insulting to your intelligence, it's important to challenge it and explain why. We can also continue discussing the value of credible sources and reliable witnesses in forming beliefs in a separate thread. If you start a new thread on that topic, I’d be glad to contribute to the discussion


Do you watch the news on TV or read newspapers? If so, ask yourself why do you do that? When you follow news about events happening in parts of the world you can’t personally witness, you rely on credible sources, reputable journalists and media outlets, as your eyes and ears. That’s one of the core functions of journalism: to report on events so the public doesn’t need to be physically present to understand and believe what’s happening


A simple answer is: maybe yes, maybe no, you just don't know for sure. But what's the likelihood that it's true, especially when it's something controversial or hard to believe and the claim comes from an unknown person with no reputation on the subject. Hoaxes and scams do happen, don’t they? That’s exactly why probability theory exists in science to assess such uncertainties.

For example, if someone claims they can compound your money by 60%pa consistently over the long term by trading forex or stocks, but their track record doesn’t even come close to that of world-renowned traders like Jim Simons, would you really trust them to manage your money, or to learn their method?


I'm not sure if you're familiar with how referencing works in scientific, academic journals, books. Scientists, including Nobel laureates, support their theses and theories by citing, referencing to credible sources and previously published scientific work.

Rational individuals tend to place more trust in research, news, reports published by reputable sources, rather than in claims made by random, unknown individuals on the internet

Well, since you're asking, here we go. Most senior high school students know about the law of energy conservation. Noone on this earth could GENERATE or destroy energy, you could only CONVERT energy from one form to another. This could also be applied when you want to make hydrogen fuel cell from water, thin air (water vapour) e.g by separating H2 and O2. But you will still need energy to separate them. If a person is unfamiliar with this basic concept, then he is likely not as informed as the average high school students. And clearly, no one sensible would consider someone like Galileo to be just an average person. 😁😁😁


View attachment 5003
trader
I bet you're great at parties.
 
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I bet you're great at parties.
I'm sure at any party this person goes to, everyone is quickly heading for the Punch bowl and the door to get out of there, before he/she wants to !have a conversation! Boring to the Max! This is what Drugs were made for! Get this guy Stoned! 🥳🤪😵‍💫💃🕺
 
I'm sure at any party this person goes to, everyone is quickly heading for the Punch bowl and the door to get out of there, before he/she wants to !have a conversation! Boring to the Max! This is what Drugs were made for! Get this guy Stoned! 🥳🤪😵‍💫💃🕺
Finally something we can agree upon.
 
Finally something we can agree upon.
Did you realise who first went off-topic ? see Post #70, #72, #78, and now post #84 another unrelated topic about the party !! 😁 😁

If you start a new thread that went off topic on this thread, I’d be glad to contribute to the discussion
 
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I'll try again. Yes a law was passed. But no the law doesn't really criminalize premarital sex and cohabitation because of the restrictions on reporting and enforcement written into the law. So the result is that there is effectively no law criminalizing said behavior. It's not a matter of whether it's enforced, it's a matter of the law's wording.
I’ve seen a few stories about this in the past, but I couldn’t track down the link. But this one is a pretty recent example. As a general rule, don’t be too sure about something just because you have heard or seen it. Whether or not these laws are actively enforced is a separate issue; but the fact remains that the laws now exist and could be used by those who disapprove this behavior for various reasons.

Parents in Bekasi Report Their Daughter to the Police After Being After Seeing Her Naked with a Man.

They know each other through Instagram and had met on several occasions. Both were discovered naked in the boarding house. They are both consenting adults (not minors) but the girl’s mother reported them to the police anyway because she disapproved of them having sex before marriage.
 
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I’ve seen a few stories about this in the past, but I couldn’t track down the link. But this one is a pretty recent example. As a general rule, don’t be too sure about something just because you have heard or seen it. Whether or not these laws are actively enforced is a separate issue; but the fact remains that the laws now exist and could be used by those who disapprove this behavior for various reasons.

Parents in Bekasi Report Their Daughter to the Police After Being After Seeing Her Naked with a Man.

They know each other through Instagram and had met on several occasions. Both were discovered naked in the boarding house. They are both consenting adults (not minors) but the girl’s mother reported them to the police anyway because she disapproved of them having sex before marriage.
Even the Law is not effective yet.
 
I’ve seen a few stories about this in the past, but I couldn’t track down the link. But this one is a pretty recent example. As a general rule, don’t be too sure about something just because you have heard or seen it. Whether or not these laws are actively enforced is a separate issue; but the fact remains that the laws now exist and could be used by those who disapprove this behavior for various reasons.

Parents in Bekasi Report Their Daughter to the Police After Being After Seeing Her Naked with a Man.

They know each other through Instagram and had met on several occasions. Both were discovered naked in the boarding house. They are both consenting adults (not minors) but the girl’s mother reported them to the police anyway because she disapproved of them having sex before marriage.
Have you watched the video? The case above is one where the parents of a 16 year old girl reported a 26 year old man for being naked in a room together with their daughter. If found guilty of doing more than just helping her with her homework, he faces up to 15 years of prison for violating 'child protection laws'.
 
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Have you watched the video? The case above is one where the parents of a 16 year old girl reported a 26 year old man for being naked in a room together with their daughter. If found guilty of doing more than just helping her with her homework, he faces up to 15 years of prison for violating 'child protection laws'.
I am not quite sure whether you are aware that, the age of marriage consent for women in Indonesia is 16 years old.
 
I am not quite sure whether you are aware that, the age of marriage consent for women in Indonesia is 16 years old.
You are not being truthful. You claim to have found an example of a case where an unmarried couple was reported to the police based on a new law that criminalizes premarital sex and cohabitation. What actually happened according to the video is that the parents of a 16 year old girl (not an adult as you claim) reported a 26 year old man (and not their own daughter as you claim) for 'being naked' in a room with their under age daughter. This is an offence against 'child protection laws' and this is a different set of laws than the one Bob was talking about.
 
Have you watched the video? The case above is one where the parents of a 16 year old girl reported a 26 year old man for being naked in a room together with their daughter. If found guilty of doing more than just helping her with her homework, he faces up to 15 years of prison for violating 'child protection laws'.
Maybe he was the biology teacher?
 
You are not being truthful. You claim to have found an example of a case where an unmarried couple was reported to the police based on a new law that criminalizes premarital sex and cohabitation. What actually happened according to the video is that the parents of a 16 year old girl (not an adult as you claim) reported a 26 year old man (and not their own daughter as you claim) for 'being naked' in a room with their under age daughter. This is an offence against 'child protection laws' and this is a different set of laws than the one Bob was talking about.
The Law is not effective yet. It has 3 years time to become effective.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Bob
You are not being truthful. You claim to have found an example of a case where an unmarried couple was reported to the police based on a new law that criminalizes premarital sex and cohabitation. What actually happened according to the video is that the parents of a 16 year old girl (not an adult as you claim) reported a 26 year old man (and not their own daughter as you claim) for 'being naked' in a room with their under age daughter. This is an offence against 'child protection laws' and this is a different set of laws than the one Bob was talking about.
Under the Indonesian Penal Code, 16yo is already above the age of concern to commit adultery, to have sex with mutual concern. Having sex with 16yo girl is not a criminal offense in Indonesia. There were many cases like this in the past, especially among the students in senior high schools at different ages. Unlike in other countries, in Indonesia people can not be prosecuted solely because they have sex with 16yo girl. But there are prostitution laws, pornography laws where people might get caught. But the above case is not a prostitution or pornography case.
Read this.

But with the new law in place, having sex outside marriage at any age is illegal.
Very few countries in the world allow adultery with a 16yo, and now Indonesia has shifted drastically in the opposite direction; sex outside of marriage has been made illegal. This kind of sweeping change suggests a powerful push behind it, likely from extremist groups determined to see it happen. That’s the problem with extremism: if they disapprove of something, they don’t just reject it for themselves, but they push for a blanket ban on everyone. Never underestimate the influence extremism can wield.
 
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Under the Indonesian Penal Code, 16yo is already above the age of concern to commit adultery, to have sex with mutual concern. Having sex with 16yo girl is not a criminal offense in Indonesia. There were many cases like this in the past, especially among the students in senior high schools at different ages. Unlike in other countries, people can not be prosecuted solely because they have sex with 16yo girl. But there is prostitution law, pornography law where people might get caught. But the above case is not a prostitution or pornography case.
Read this.

But with the new law in place, having sex outside marriage at any age is illegal.
Very few countries in the world allow adultery with a 16yo, and now Indonesia has shifted drastically in the opposite direction; sex outside of marriage has been made illegal. This kind of sweeping change suggests a powerful push behind it, likely from extremist groups determined to see it happen. That’s the problem with extremism: if they disapprove of something, they don’t just reject it for themselves, but they push for a blanket ban on everyone. Never underestimate the influence extremism can wield.
And never underestimate the mental gymnastics the will to believe something to be true will put a person through.
 

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