Did Hamas use Indonesian Shifa Hospital as a human shield ?

[Bob]

Are we referring to hospital in urban area or Hospital in a well known conflict zone??
I think hospitals in urban areas are more likely to build helipad to be used by Helicopter, eVTOL rather than to build a mesh of underground tunnels.

In urban areas, especially in exclusive areas, hospitals are typically run as businesses, and there are often many private hospitals, making it a competitive industry where people may choose to invest. These hospitals are usually permanent buildings with modern and advanced facilities with the capacity to handle various medical needs and treatments.

In contrast, hospitals in conflict areas, especially in regions affected by ongoing conflicts or wars, may have different structures and characteristics. Due to the unstable nature of conflict zones, you may find semi-permanent or temporary structures such as military barracks, open wards, and military beds serving as medical facilities. These hospitals are designed to provide essential medical care under challenging conditions, and their primary focus is on treating casualties and injured individuals resulting from the conflict.

The two types of hospitals serve distinct purposes and operate in very different environments.

I'll be sorry, but have you considered the possibility of an urban zone prone to conflict?

 

[harryopal1]

In the fifth century B.C., Greek dramatist Aeschylus said, “In war, truth is the first casualty.”

 

[fastpitch17]

In the fifth century B.C., Greek dramatist Aeschylus said, “In war, truth is the first casualty.”

The US GOP adopted that now.

 

[centurion]

Are we referring to hospital in urban area or Hospital in a well known conflict zone??
I think hospitals in urban areas are more likely to build helipad to be used by Helicopter, eVTOL rather than to build a mesh of underground tunnels.

In urban areas, especially in exclusive areas, hospitals are typically run as businesses, and there are often many private hospitals, making it a competitive industry where people may choose to invest. These hospitals are usually permanent buildings with modern and advanced facilities with the capacity to handle various medical needs and treatments.

In contrast, hospitals in conflict areas, especially in regions affected by ongoing conflicts or wars, may have different structures and characteristics. Due to the unstable nature of conflict zones, you may find semi-permanent or temporary structures such as military barracks, open wards, and military beds serving as medical facilities. These hospitals are designed to provide essential medical care under challenging conditions, and their primary focus is on treating casualties and injured individuals resulting from the conflict.

The two types of hospitals serve distinct purposes and operate in very different environments.

As @Bob would say, why did they build the hospital there if they do not like the neighborhood?

 

[nd_eric_77]

The US GOP adopted that now.

If only I could be so naive as to believe that either US political party were more truthful than the other

 

[fastpitch17]

If only I could be so naive as to believe that either US political party were more truthful than the other

Simple, one is led by trump

 

[snpark]

Reminds me of the American tourist visiting Windsor Castle directly under Heathrow Airport flight path as Concorde flew over noisily.

Why on earth did they build this beautiful castle here with all that noise.

 

[fastpitch17]

Tide is starting to turn in the US in regards to supporting Israel's war on Hamas. People, including some American Jews are speaking out against Netanyahu's wholesale war crimes approach to going after Hamas. They want a plan for the end game.

 

[Hawk256]

Simple, one is led by trump

l long for the day when Trump's name isn't mentioned multiple times per day on practially any subject. Stop giving him attention and he will go away. The more you feed a narcissist the worse they behave. A week without his name in the news would be worse than jail time for him.

 

[harryopal1]

l long for the day when Trump's name isn't mentioned multiple times per day on practially any subject. Stop giving him attention and he will go away. The more you feed a narcissist the worse they behave. A week without his name in the news would be worse than jail time for him.

I don't disagree but I suspect that Trump doesn't read the Expat Indo Forum.

 

[snpark]

I don't disagree but I suspect that Trump doesn't read the Expat Indo Forum.

Doesn't. Or can't read

 

[pantaiema]

This is so far removed from critical thought it's PATHETIC. GAZA WAS NOT AT WAR. All conflict was conducted by the terrorist group Hamas and the evil government heads of Israel. In a normal day, the hospitals see the same needs of their patients as hospitals do around the world. The need for hospitals is great. Now that Netanyahu has decided he has his opportunity to eliminate all Palestinians, men, women, children, and babies, the hospitals have even a greater need simply because they are stationary and people know where to go.

When an individual uses the term "Pathetic" in their responses during public discussions, it reveals an additional aspect of his character. And why people need to care other people opinion of being critical or not critical ??. I refrain from using similar language, but I may need to reciprocate if others continue to employ such terminology in the public discussion.

Gaza region has a history of experiencing multiple wars and conflicts in the past. So it is highly inaccurate to say "Gaza was not at war".

Gaza War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I acknowledge that the hospital has the same obligations towards its patients as hospitals worldwide. However, when there is a high risk of it being damaged or destroyed in the conflict, the situation becomes more complex. The option is not necessarily moving it to another city but it could be just a few miles away.

The need for hospitals is great.

I believe it's universally acknowledged that the importance of hospitals is indisputable. While most hospitals primarily serve the vital purpose of caring for patients and their medical needs, some may be exploited for political gains or other morally reprehensible act. I'm not implying that Shifa Hospital in Gaza is being used in such a manner. However, the existence of a network of underground tunnels raises further questions about its necessity.

I have posted here a hospital in Cambodia and Myanmar is used as a centre for removing human organ for trading.

Indonesians Human trafficking in Myanmar ? Is it true ??

I have heard a few stories about human Trafficking in Myanmar, but I just ignored it, as it might be just a make up stories. But this news comes from a reputable source, KompasTV. They do not just publish article if they have not done some level of verification according to Journalism code of...

www.expatindo.org

Additionally, there are hospitals that are established with a business-oriented approach, aimed at maximizing shareholder value. These are often associated with healthcare stocks and are listed as ETFs on stock exchanges. Those interested in this topic can initiate a separate discussion thread.

Now that Netanyahu has decided he has his opportunity to ELIMINATE ALL PALESTINIANS, men, women, children, and babies, the hospitals have even a greater need simply because they are stationary and people know where to go.

This is quite an assertive statement. Are there concrete pieces of evidence to support it, especially when discussing the use of terms like "women," "children," and "babies" in relation to the elimination of innocent people? As far as I understand, the primary objective here is to target HAMAS, not the entire Palestinian population. It's worth noting that HAMAS has been designated as a terrorist organization by numerous countries, including the United Nations.

If you possess evidence to substantiate your assertion, it's possible that you could gain significant attention by sharing it with newspapers or parties interested in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. You could even become a sudden millionaire by selling your evidence to the newspaper, the party who want Israel to be wiped out from the map.

You may claim that some of those being treated at the hospitals are Hamas and you will probably be correct. Medical personnel are trained to treat those in need. No one ever condemned me or my associates when we treated a wounded VC combatant. No one complained when we treated villagers in need of medical attention. Yes, I worked out of mobil hospitals and I can honestly say that many were not treated that could have been simply because we were either too far away or our location was unknown for obvious reasons.

Pantaiema. I suggest you stop posting about this since it is obvious you haven't a clue as to how things work or what necitates a need for a permanent medical facility. JMHO

You don't require someone else to clarify this for you, and you don't need to work in ambulance services to understand that paramedics, doctors, and nurses will provide medical care to an injured people, even combatant, regardless of which side they belong to in the conflict. Even school children are aware of the humanitarian work carried out by the Red Cross, especially if they become involved in the Scouts and learn about these fundamental principles.

As for tunnels under the hospital, what is your source that they were built by the hospital or were even aware of their presence? If the hospital was involved in tunnels in all likelyhood they were put there with the idea of evacuation needs.

The concept of tunnels for evacuation needs is intriguing, particularly when it's suggested by someone who identifies themselves as part of a mobile hospital unit. Can you provide examples of hospitals worldwide in the city centre that employ an intricate network of underground tunnels for evacuation? Wouldn't it be more cost-effective and efficient to utilize helicopters or EvTOL aircraft for such purposes?

I want to clarify that I never say that professional staff, such as paramedics and nurses, are aware of this. They are dedicated professionals committed to treating the injured, regardless of their affiliation. However, it seems highly improbable that no one within the hospital's management was not aware of the existence of a complex network of underground tunnels, especially considering that:

• It's not just a single tunnel but a mesh of underground tunnels.
• Such a tunnel network would take time to construct.

 

[Will_M]

I think you need to open your eyes to what is really happening in Gaza.

No denying that Hamas is a terrorist group. However collective punishment is also a war crime and the UN stated that 7/10 didn’t happen in a vacuum.

What’s currently happening is near genocide.

 

[Hawk256]

I think you need to open your eyes to what is really happening in Gaza.

No denying that Hamas is a terrorist group. However collective punishment is also a war crime and the UN stated that 7/10 didn’t happen in a vacuum.

What’s currently happening is near genocide.

If anybody takes anything away for this thread, it should be this. Israel is bombing with impunity and I'm afraid if you don't see that, there is no reason to argue further about the situation. Gaza is 50% children. How can you support them getting caught in crossfire? And that is no mention of the women and elderly. These are civilan people, not terrorists.

 

[MamangDudul]

I think you need to open your eyes to what is really happening in Gaza.

No denying that Hamas is a terrorist group. However collective punishment is also a war crime and the UN stated that 7/10 didn’t happen in a vacuum.

What’s currently happening is near genocide.

I know the history of Israel or the Jewish people is kinda complex and usually many people (especially in Germany) get easily offended if you criticize Israel. On the other side, isn't it fair to say that Isreal as we know it today is basically built on war crimes and crimes against international law and human rights?

 

[snpark]

Now journalists are being murdered by Israelis

 

[fastpitch17]

When an individual uses the term "Pathetic" in their responses during public discussions, it reveals an additional aspect of his character. And why people need to care other people opinion of being critical or not critical ??. I refrain from using similar language, but I may need to reciprocate if others continue to employ such terminology in the public discussion.

Gaza region has a history of experiencing multiple wars and conflicts in the past. So it is highly inaccurate to say "Gaza was not at war".

Gaza War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I acknowledge that the hospital has the same obligations towards its patients as hospitals worldwide. However, when there is a high risk of it being damaged or destroyed in the conflict, the situation becomes more complex. The option is not necessarily moving it to another city but it could be just a few miles away.



I believe it's universally acknowledged that the importance of hospitals is indisputable. While most hospitals primarily serve the vital purpose of caring for patients and their medical needs, some may be exploited for political gains or other morally reprehensible act. I'm not implying that Shifa Hospital in Gaza is being used in such a manner. However, the existence of a network of underground tunnels raises further questions about its necessity.

I have posted here a hospital in Cambodia and Myanmar is used as a centre for removing human organ for trading.

Indonesians Human trafficking in Myanmar ? Is it true ??

I have heard a few stories about human Trafficking in Myanmar, but I just ignored it, as it might be just a make up stories. But this news comes from a reputable source, KompasTV. They do not just publish article if they have not done some level of verification according to Journalism code of...

www.expatindo.org

Additionally, there are hospitals that are established with a business-oriented approach, aimed at maximizing shareholder value. These are often associated with healthcare stocks and are listed as ETFs on stock exchanges. Those interested in this topic can initiate a separate discussion thread.



This is quite an assertive statement. Are there concrete pieces of evidence to support it, especially when discussing the use of terms like "women," "children," and "babies" in relation to the elimination of innocent people? As far as I understand, the primary objective here is to target HAMAS, not the entire Palestinian population. It's worth noting that HAMAS has been designated as a terrorist organization by numerous countries, including the United Nations.

If you possess evidence to substantiate your assertion, it's possible that you could gain significant attention by sharing it with newspapers or parties interested in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. You could even become a sudden millionaire by selling your evidence to the newspaper, the party who want Israel to be wiped out from the map.



You don't require someone else to clarify this for you, and you don't need to work in ambulance services to understand that paramedics, doctors, and nurses will provide medical care to an injured people, even combatant, regardless of which side they belong to in the conflict. Even school children are aware of the humanitarian work carried out by the Red Cross, especially if they become involved in the Scouts and learn about these fundamental principles.



The concept of tunnels for evacuation needs is intriguing, particularly when it's suggested by someone who identifies themselves as part of a mobile hospital unit. Can you provide examples of hospitals worldwide in the city centre that employ an intricate network of underground tunnels for evacuation? Wouldn't it be more cost-effective and efficient to utilize helicopters or EvTOL aircraft for such purposes?

I want to clarify that I never say that professional staff, such as paramedics and nurses, are aware of this. They are dedicated professionals committed to treating the injured, regardless of their affiliation. However, it seems highly improbable that no one within the hospital's management was not aware of the existence of a complex network of underground tunnels, especially considering that:

• It's not just a single tunnel but a mesh of underground tunnels.
• Such a tunnel network would take time to construct.

Yes, pathetic so go ahead and bring it.

Wars in Gaza are not wars with Gaza

If a hospital is a few miles away, how are patients supposed to get there since everyone is restricted in their movements? Hospitals need to be located where they do the most good. The Indonesian sponsored hospital is exactly where it is needed.

What in the name of imbacel does human organ trade have to do with Palestine. Geesh.

Yes, Israel claims to be targeting Hamas. Just the price of war that over 9,000 innocent lives got in the way. Source, every media outlet around the world. Even Israeli newspapers are reporting it. All are pointing fingers directly at Netanyahu and his radical government. Unlike you, I think there is a minority of the world that wants or feels that Israel will be wiped off the face of the map. Wipe out Netanyahu and it all changes. Get someone who can come up with an actual plan to end this thing without eracing Palestinians off the world population list.

It is obvious that someone hasn't a clue to what hospitals do. Sorry, evidently, unlike you I have not visited every hospital in the world to inspect their underground facilities. What I can tell you that under many hospitals lie a vast network of underground tunnel like structures. I have not explored them since I wasn't concerned about them.

What? Now the hospital has their own network of tunnels? Are you sure since evidently you have been in them. If I were to assume everything like you I would have to assume you have been in them because you are a Hamas terrorist.

Maybe just stop talking about things you know nothing of.

 

[fastpitch17]

Now journalists are being murdered by Israelis

Already happening by Hamas so both sides are now to blame.

 

[fastpitch17]

l long for the day when Trump's name isn't mentioned multiple times per day on practially any subject. Stop giving him attention and he will go away. The more you feed a narcissist the worse they behave. A week without his name in the news would be worse than jail time for him.

I agree so as soon as I get a position with a media service, any media service I will definately never name him. Hoping that solidary confinement will take care of hearing from him.

 

[centurion]

Tide is starting to turn in the US in regards to supporting Israel's war on Hamas. People, including some American Jews are speaking out against Netanyahu's wholesale war crimes approach to going after Hamas. They want a plan for the end game.

Absolutely the tide is turning back.
This brave young man tried to solve the Jewish issue but the evil government aprehended him.

Cornell Student Allegedly Threatened to Rape and Kill Jewish Students

Patrick Dai, 21, could face up to five years in prison after authorities allege he posted the threats online.

people.com

https://www.npr.org/2023/10/31/1209839480/cornell-student-arrested-antisemitic-threats