Back as an upper-middle income country, but will Indonesia be trapped there?

[Bob]

Yes, they understand .. but they need the earth metals .. but don't want the mines in their own backyards.

So we're destroying the earth to save it. Oh well, there's money to be made that way.

 

[serious_fun]

So we're destroying the earth to save it. Oh well, there's money to be made that way.

Yes, the selective vision surrounding EVs is amazing.

Electricity is generated from thin air, correct?

 

[harryopal1]

The web site Science Daily ( https://www.sciencedaily.com/) posted the report July 14.

Ocean animals vacate areas both around and outside deep-sea mining operations​

Date:July 14, 2023Source:Cell PressSummary:In 2020, Japan performed the first successful test extracting cobalt crusts from the top of deep-sea mountains to mine cobalt -- a mineral used in electric vehicle batteries. Not only do directly mined areas become less habitable for ocean animals, but mining also creates a plume of sediment that can spread through the surrounding water. An investigation on the environmental impact of this first test reports a decrease in ocean animals both in and around the mining zone.

 

[Balifrog]

The web site Science Daily ( https://www.sciencedaily.com/) posted the report July 14.

Ocean animals vacate areas both around and outside deep-sea mining operations​

Date:July 14, 2023Source:Cell PressSummary:In 2020, Japan performed the first successful test extracting cobalt crusts from the top of deep-sea mountains to mine cobalt -- a mineral used in electric vehicle batteries. Not only do directly mined areas become less habitable for ocean animals, but mining also creates a plume of sediment that can spread through the surrounding water. An investigation on the environmental impact of this first test reports a decrease in ocean animals both in and around the mining zone.

Same as when you do this to mine copper or gold :

I guess the animals in this area have moved to another place .....(It's in Indonesia BTW)
And I guess picking nodules on the sea bottom can difficult create a bigger environmental disaster than the above.
At least no humans have their house or job at 4.000 m deep !


It remember a big shit raising by the greenies in HKG a few years ago when we were building an artificial island. "It's the habitat of the white dolphins, you can't intervene there"
Hell, them dolphins ain't stupid, when they hear the ships, barges, drilling rigs etc starting to work near their "habitat" they move elsewhere.
Which they did.

 

[MamangDudul]

Hmm, the behaviour of high school kids is a bit shocking to me also. They hang out in the mall (in uniforms) e.g. in Starbucks. Loud. Drinking their frappucino's. And then leave without cleaning up the table or throwing their garbage in the bin. Expecting the workers will clean up. Actually, the behaviour of the adults is also not up to par. One example (out of many). In the apartment building i saw a familie. The parents bought some bikes for their children, age 5 kira-kira. And let them bike in the lobby and swimming pool. Nobody said anything. I did eventually. In the Netherlands you would be addressed and asked to considerate of other people.

That kind of stuff is still a big issue here. Especially when it comes to trash and doing things that are expected to be done by others. Parents and children alike, cause there aren't really any role models.
I still see trash getting thrown out of car windows on the daily. The when I buy big packs of animal food or gas or water gallons and load them into the car myself, people often look at me like an alien. Why do something someone else can do for you and gets paid for? God beware..
One of the reasons , as long as we can still do stuff ourselves, I don't like having a maid. Maybe that's more of an personal issue, but I don't like when people do stuff for me that I can do myself.


My daughter luckily has more awareness since I will kick her ass if she behaves like a snob and so on.

 

[Balifrog]

A general problem in Asia. Seen it in South Korea, Thailand, HKG and China.
Mainly in urban areas, big cities.
One of the main reasons is that, mainly for economic reasons, people in this areas will tend to have only 1 or 2 kids maximum and then spoil them.
Of course the same type of parents, well aware of their status of "urbanites" certainly won't lose face by bringing their trash out themselves.... and will educate the kids in the same way.
It is much less of a problem in rural areas, where kids are brought up (....) in a more "rustic" way.
Again, don't blame the kids....it are the parents who brought them up this way !

Personally I was brought up in a very strict way (dad ex-Foreign Legion), and brought up mine 3 in a rather strict way (due, among other reasons to my own education, and having been militaty 7 y myself). But adapting that education to more modern times, and a different generational way of life.

 

[Samoerai]

Parents and children alike, cause there aren't really any role models.
I still see trash getting thrown out of car windows on the daily. The when I buy big packs of animal food or gas or water gallons and load them into the car myself, people often look at me like an alien

Of course the same type of parents, well aware of their status of "urbanites" certainly won't lose face by bringing their trash out themselves.... and will educate the kids in the same way.

This kind of behavior has an effect in general on society in the end. Don't know how to formulate this.
One example I experienced myself when I moved from Holland to Indonesia with 30m3 household goods to our new home in a new 'perumahan'. The house had a lot of 'defects', like "dinding bocor, banyak tegel kosong, mempet, .. doors that have to be painted all over again". All the kinds a defects a new house has, but worse than I am used to.

Luckily I brought also my tools from Holland. Some of the defects I took care of myself. Neighbors and "tukangs kerjas" looked at me like I am from another planet. But also in awe that I posses all these professional (electric) tools, more and better than a contractor "biasa" has.

The point is that none of the neighbors, nor the family of my wife offered any help, like helping with painting the doors, walls ... or even unpacking the boxes. In Holland most of the men (generation: boomers) know how to fix things in and around the house, small things like painting walls and doors, but also the more complex things, like laying floors with "parket" or fixing water pipes, taps or faucets" . I think that even if they want to help (and overcome their "lose face of being called a tukang", they don't even know how to paint a door or wall. For every problem there is a tukang, in their lifes.

In Holland families and neighbors will come and help you with moving to your new homes. There is also a basic curiosity for the new house: where, how, when .. etc.
Actually, this kind of curiosity goes for everything, causing the effect that in general people have a high understanding of how things are done in society, like "paying tax, why, how when" and basic knowledge of the tax rules".

Here? Income tax? Apa itu?

 

[fastpitch17]

I own a lot of tools and hardware. 1, 2, and 3 meter ladders when folded. I do my own work except for putting up a couple small canopies. When I get out the ladders or some tools that still look like new I get those looks. That look like hey, I would do that as long as you pay me.

I like things done right and if a mistake is made, I have someone who will accept the blame. Me. Plus, I don't need to fix whatever I hired someone to repair.

The best looks are when the cordless power washer, grass trimmer, or power tools come out. One time I was even offered someone's services who has their own gas powered trimmer, for a fee. But he would need to use my trimmer. Not happening.

 

[SamR]

Of course the same type of parents, well aware of their status of "urbanites" certainly won't lose face by bringing their trash out themselves.... and will educate the kids in the same way.

I think if you want to see some insights of how "urbanites" think, the best way is in seeing them impart their knowledge to their children. Recently my son was in a queue in front of another kid and was very surprised when the other kid's parent said to their kid "If you see a gap, just go into it, that way you will get served first." Probably expect that sort of thing from kampung parents at a mini mart where the default stance seems to be to look for a gap to the cut the queue but not at large luxurious shopping center.

 

[Samoerai]

In 2022, the volume of instant noodles consumed in Indonesia increased to approximately 14.26 billion servings. Indomie, a brand owned by Indofood, an Indonesian local company, is the most preferred instant noodle brand amongst Indonesians.

However, the Indonesian instant noodle industry has problems: the grain for those noodles comes from Ukraine and the fertilizer for the paddy fields comes from Russia.

Russia ends grain deal with Ukraine. Oeps!
The deal allowed millions of tons of Ukrainian grain to enter the world market. Russia has declared the deal to be over, with possible consequences for food prices worldwide.

The price of Indomie wil definitely go up .. stock up your Indomie now.

 

[centurion]

Russia ends grain deal with Ukraine. Oeps!
The deal allowed millions of tons of Ukrainian grain to enter the world market. Russia has declared the deal to be over, with possible consequences for food prices worldwide.

The price of Indomie wil definitely go up .. stock up your Indomie now.

Actually, Russia did not end the deal. It expired yesterday at midnight.

 

[flavus]

Actually, Russia did not end the deal. It expired yesterday at midnight.

Semantics ... not renewing, letting expire, ending the deal

 

[Samoerai]

Semantics ... not renewing, letting expire, ending the deal

Yes, point is, inflation goes up. Not only because of grain deal ending. Now, also because of the extreme hot summers in Italy, Spain and Greece resulting in lower olive oil production, resulting that pizzas become more expensive.

 

[Samoerai]

I daresay it's a crapshoot. I've seen kids who become full of empathy for those who are of a lower social class, I've seen kids who horrify their parents by becoming better at whatever regional language the pembantu uses than English, and yes I've seen kids who after being spoiled by their parents are also spoiled by the pembantu.

In California same problem with nannies .. see how this comedian makes fun of that .. footage from 1:25

 

[flavus]

In California same problem with nannies .. see how this comedian makes fun of that .. footage from 1:25

Maz is awesome. I highly recommend his Axis of Terror comedy show (making fun of W Bush's labeling of Iran, Iraq and North Korea)

 

[Lemonyellow]

Start with ..
1. Dua anak cukup
2. Free and good education
3. Don't say "kerja untuk Indonesia". But "kerja bagus untuk Indonesia". Only be proud of good quality results.
4. Less corruption
5. As a country, be good in one thing and trade that.
6. Improve infrastructure
7. Step up to implement green energy resources (solar pannels, wind energy, hydrogen, etc).
8. Ban carbon based fuel cars and motors. Support electric based cars and motors
9. Implement social security system.
10. Let the mosques stop making noise in the middle of the night.

Would be my top 10.

Seriously, I just don't understand the mosque part. I mean I am a muslim and I do my prayers five times a day and i barely hear the prayer calls from the mosques, especially for the morning prayer. And i can tell there is no prayer call in the middle of the night. If you refer to the recital they play before Friday prayer, or Thursday night , or it might be before any prayer depending where you live , but i can tell the guy/s who play the recording on the loudspeaker they don't even listen to that, we as muslims, we don't even bother to listen to it. Why would you? Why even care about that ? I mean how many mosques do you have in your neighborhood? I have 3 mosques in walking distance from where i live and i barely hear the sound of the prayer call for morning and that's 5 in the morning. I wish i could switch places with you guys where mosque loudspeakers aren't letting you sleep!!

 

[Helpful Herbert]

Are you serious or just trolling? I spent two years of my life being physically tortured by a mosque with loudspeakers at 110 decibels (yes I measured it) from 3.30am to 4.30am every single morning. Take your bigotry elsewhere.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

I mean how many mosques do you have in your neighborhood?

Currently about 15. And all of them are on full loudspeaker in the middle of the night, when normal people try to sleep.
Until this country removes these backward practices it will never ever develop, and probably won't even maintain its position in the middle income countries.

 

[Lemonyellow]

Are you serious or just trolling? I spent two years of my life being physically tortured by a mosque with loudspeakers at 110 decibels (yes I measured it) from 3.30am to 4.30am every single morning. Take your bigotry elsewhere.

You could be a very devoted Muslim i tell you, because it's very hard to wake up at that time of the night, i have been trying very hard to do that with my phone's alarm and also loudspeakers from the nearby mosques , yet I can't get up.

 

[Lemonyellow]

15 mosques in one neighborhood, you should've known that's not pleasant place to live when you did that survey.