Wet Shaving in Indonesia

Silet

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Just one point before I do continue and hopefully henceforce join a discussion as to what is best here and what our best options are.

I have to question El_Goretto with regards to his post regarding the chromebook.

I know it is off topic but so was his initial post and I feel I was misled and or decieved by his question about Hargadunia and his chromebook options.

I'll not repeat these posts as they are already there.

However I will copy this from El_Goretto's latest post on this matter please refer to Elgoretto's post #76

After interrogating me about Hargadunia and their customs policy, giving examples of both Amazon prices and Hargadunia prices, he openly admitted he had already bought the said items via another means.

Is that not underhand I ask you all?

He then goes on to say

This. I've noticed the same with Derby blades.



No, I haven't asked them yet. When I do, I'll share here.

My asking about Chromebook, by the way, was more relevant than you think: it served as an example as to what happens for items above the $100 value threshold for import duty when ordering from hargadunia.

@El_Goretto, if your asking about the Chromebook was more relavant than I think. Why do you not still have a reply?

I am still waiting for you to share, how long does it take for you to contact a company in Kelapa Gading who can chat on line and answer e-mails and whatsapp to answer.

You have now to answer this question you asked. You have been given the means to do so, so please do it and let us all know your findings.

Thank you.
 

Silet

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Meanwhile, whilst El _Goretto goes on his quest.

Tomorrow, or should that be today now ? I'll continue with you all on the shaving forum and try to pick up where I left off and also try to give my opion on some of the now very good questions being asked, discussed and answered by others.

Thank you all, once again.
 

Silet

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Before I continue on the different methods of shaving here, it seems that most people either use a DE razor, multiblade or disposable.

Of the DE shavers on the forum, which blade or blades are your favourites please

The reason I ask os I am still sorting out what is best for me and some input from you would be more than welcome.

The blades I have used are all initially being compared in my EJ DE 89.

The razor came with Derby Extra but initially I used the Supermax Chromium I have, I found that first shave after three passes a bit aggressive a felt a bit uncomfortable under my neck.chin area. My growth changes direction here, i.e, on my cheeks and under my chin the growth is downwards in general but from below my Adam's apple the growth up my throat is upwards and where the two meet can be a bit difficult.

I then used the Derby blade and that really struggled with the first pass, so much so that I nearly took the bade out but I persevered just to see how it would turn out. That first pass took what seemed like ages but the second and third passes were extremely comfortable.

I then used a Gillette Wilkinson's Sword and that shave was the best yet. The razor just glided on the first pass and the other two passes went perfectly as well.

However, I'm coming to the conclusion that an ideal perfect shave would be with two different levels of aggressiveness. The Derby blade is generally accepted as the mildest and the ultra sharp Feather the most aggressive with the other blades falling in between.

Looking at the "professionals", the guys who actually sell blades and shaving supplies, they nearly all seem to recommend Personna blades as a first blade, in that it is in the middle of aggressiveness and thus a good blade to judge in which direction you need to go from there of any.

The level of aggressiveness is important as people with sensitive skin need a less aggressive razor and blade but it still has to be aggressive enough to shave.

I tend to test a new blade by not shaving for three days or so (I'm also too lazy sometimes) so that I can see how a blade performs properly. If shaving every day then I would need a less aggressive blade than if I had quite a bit of growth.

Any comments please?
 

jstar

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@Silet: What I don't completely understand, is that you seem to relate the aggressiveness to the blades?

It is the DE razor itself that determines the aggressiveness, mostly by its head. So by positioning the blade and with a different shape of the safety and open comb bar. Blades are sharp or blunt. Period.

For me, I currently get better results with an el cheapo Chinese DE razor than the more expensive EJ and top-of-the-line Mühle that my wife bought for me. But the problem is that reviews mean crap if you have another skin type, and you can not really test the razors up front.
 

Silet

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@jstar, maybe I wasn't fully clear. you are 100% correct in that the razor and it's style govern agressivenes. eg The DE 89 is classed as mildly agressive whereas a fully open comb razor would be highly aggressive.

However in an individual razor the blade plays it part as well. All my references were to the DE 89 for clarification purposes. (I have other razots one of which is milder than the DE 89 and the others are more aggressive)

If you put a Derby blade in a DE 89 the shave will be a lot milder than if you put a Feather blade in.

Razors are classed in aggressiveness as you correctly say but so are blades.
.
 

Silet

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May 1, 2017
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@jstar Just for further clarification if I'm still not clear to you.

Please see this link as an example (there are many others and videos etc on the same subject.

http://hairfreelife.com/the-sharpest-double-edged-razor-blades-top-to-bottom/

from which I quote-

Those with sensitive skin should also think twice before purchasing a feather blade - the aggressiveness of the blade can be quite uncomfortable if your skin is easily irritated.

.........

Derby blades are at the opposite end of the spectrum to Feather blades, but are equally as popular for a different category of shaver.

Derby blades are far smoother and tend to be the favourite choice for those who have sensitive skin or for new wet shavers who want to learn the technique before moving up to sharper blades.

.......
 

Vicissidude

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I'm new to DE shaving and I use a Merkur 34c, which is similar to the Edwin Jagger DE89 in terms of mild aggressiveness (soon I'll have a DE89 too, so I can compare). For blades, so far I've used Derby (which I didn't like), as well as Astra SP and Personna Red, which seem to work well for me. I'm alternating between the two to determine my preference, and right now I'm leaning toward the Personnas. That could change next week though! I have a pack of Feathers, but I haven't tried them yet.. I'm waiting until I feel completely comfortable with my technique to take that leap.

My understanding is as jstar says, aggressiveness refers to razors and sharpness to blades. But I guess it's all semantics. I understood what you meant, Silet.
 

Vicissidude

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After interrogating me about Hargadunia and their customs policy, giving examples of both Amazon prices and Hargadunia prices, he openly admitted he had already bought the said items via another means.

Is that not underhand I ask you all?

I think you're reading far too deep into El_G's question. He was just curious because you have experience and Hargadunia could be a useful resource. I don't think he's doing an investigative exposé on questionable online retailers.. lol

It was relevant to me and IMO this thread, as most of the things I've personally ordered from abroad were shaving related, and I recently ordered shaving supplies with a total over $100 after shipping. So I'm also curious to know more for future reference.
 

El_Goretto

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@Vicissidude, I've tried the DE89 and Merkur 34C. I broke both of them when they fell in the shower.

I now have a Parker 24C which is an open comb design and yet it is surprisingly not aggressive, very comfortable. There is a technique to it which is to hold it at a more perpendicular angle to your skin. A normal angle would bring the blade itself too perpendicular to your skin and be too rough. This is due to how the blade is positioned within the razor.


About the Derby, it's been reported that the quality from one blade to another can vary greatly. Sometimes I'll grab a blade and it's a dud. Completely dull and I have to ditch it and start with something else. But when the blade is very good, it's very comfortable.

My favorite now after having tested a ton of them is the pesonna blue. Comfortable, sharp, consistent.
 
Last edited:

Vicissidude

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About the Derby, it's been reported that the quality from one blade to another can vary greatly. Sometimes I'll grab a blade and it's a dud. Completely dull and I have to ditch it and start with something else. But when the blades is very good, it's very comfortable.

I'll keep that in mind. It might also be worth revisiting now with more experience. And of course, everything including blade choice is personal preference and varies for everyone. I've heard people's blade preference will also change with time and with different razors.

What soaps or creams are you using?
 

El_Goretto

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I'll keep that in mind. It might also be worth revisiting now with more experience. And of course, everything including blade choice is personal preference and varies for everyone. I've heard people's blade preference will also change with time and with different razors.

Yes, the winning combination is definitely a personal preference. It takes a bit of time to find the right one, especially for those among us with sensitive skin, but it's well worth it.

BTW, I'd like to add that the DE89 and merkur 34C are excellent razors. I was just unlucky that I dropped them several times in the shower and they snapped. That's when I decided to give another razor a go and picked up the Parker. I also had a spare DE89 that I gave away after getting the Parker.

What soaps or creams are you using?

I've tried quite a lot including Nivea, Palmolive, The Body Shop, Taylor of Old Bond Street sensitive skin, Baxter of California, khiels, l'occitane, etc.

In the end my favorite are proraso sensitive skin (the pre-shave is also amazing), omega, arko sensitive skin and the basic arko stick. I have all of these at the moment but when they run out, I'll probably only reorder the arko stuff.
 

jstar

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What soaps or creams are you using?

These are my four favorites. The Proraso can only be used by brush, the others are convenient for traveling as well. The Taylor of Old Bond street I think of as being superior, I use quite some of their products. I also use pre- and aftershave, alcohol free.

IMG_1397.jpg
 

El_Goretto

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I wonder if we shouldn't start a shaving supplies buying club or something.
 

Vicissidude

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These are my four favorites. The Proraso can only be used by brush, the others are convenient for traveling as well. The Taylor of Old Bond street I think of as being superior, I use quite some of their products. I also use pre- and aftershave, alcohol free.

So far I've only used Proraso Green (eucalyptus and menthol) in the tub and Tabac in the tube, as those were recommended to me as a beginner. Both lather up really well. I'd be interested to try Proraso White and see what all this hype is about.

Ultimately I want to find some more natural options, limiting or eliminating artificial ingredients including artificial fragrances. I have some artisan soaps on the way that might fit the bill. I specifically ordered ones that only use essential oils for fragrance.

I've also used Kiehl's and some other latherless creams in the past, but not since I started wet shaving and using a brush. Building lather is half the fun!

I wonder if we shouldn't start a shaving supplies buying club or something.

I'd be down. I assume the benefit would be to save on shipping if we order more stuff, right? We might run into issues with the 100 USD limit for customs exemption. Maybe we can get a Singaporean resident to join and act as our middleman!
 

dafluff

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Re: DE blades

I found I do prefer the super sharp Feathers. As observed before, they are better for the second and third shaves. I found Derby to be inconsistent...sometimes I love them, other times I don't.

The Gillette Goal and 7 O clock are about average for me. As is Croma. Super Max is absolute garbage.

But blades are a very personal choice, and your preference may even change after awhile, so my review could be completely different than someone else's.
 

Silet

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Hi All, some excellent posts and information above and thanks to El_Goretto in his posts I have decided where my next purchase of blades and shaving soap should be, I'd also like to make a comment on the video he put up later with regard to the man shaving with the Parker 24c and how I believe he got it all wrong the first time around.

First though I'd like to finish of on blades, in the main just to add and re-enforce perhaps some of the comments made above.

I can only really comment on the blades I have and my current experiences with them and I may change my mind later as I feel I need to do some revision on them.

I read exactly the same comments as El_Goretto did on the Derby blades, i.e. some of them are no good and the others are.
It seems derby blades are either a love them or hate them, I have never seen as much controversy over a blade as the Derby blades get.

My own personal experience with Derby is tha same as @dafluff above, this however only applies to the Derby Extra as I have not yet tried the Derby Premium I have. I also need at some stage to put these into a shavette, to see how they really perform just as a raw, bare blade.

On the SuperMax, I only have the Chromium and maybe @dafluff had different in the Platinum. These gave me a very close shave but I was very uncomforable afterwards. Since then I put one of these in a shavette and the blade was brilliant. I only used it to trim my sideburns and shave doewnwards in that area towards my jawbone and my cheeks but in the area I shaved, all in the direction of growth, I was absolutely smooth and needed no further passes at all.

My favourite go to blade at the moment are my Gillette Wilkinson's Sword blades, in my DE89 these if shaving in the true direction of growth for a first pass, (not just straight down as in a lot of videos), give a DFS in one pass and only a small clean up necessary in some "difficult" areas. It's the success of these in my DE89 that at the moment is preventing me from trying other blades that I have.

One note on the Gillette "Wilkinson Sword" blades. These are not to be confused with the Wilkinson Sword Classic blades once made in the UK but that are now made in Germany. Gillette own the Wilkinson Sword trade mark in India only and as such cannot themselves distribute them outside of India. So these blades are bought directly from or via a third party seller from India.

With regards to my comments on El_Goretto's post above on blades, in my next purchase I am going to include some Astra SP blades. El_Goretto was weighing up between these and Personna and eventually came down on the side of Personna but that was of sufficient interest for me to try the Astra SP blades. Personna blades are not directly available here and I doubt they will be, I read the other day that they are manufactured both in the USA and Israel, the latter country just about says why, without any further elaboration here.

Thank you all so much for your kind input on this thread, I'll try to give you all bonus points.

Next time I'd like to discuss El_Goretto's video on the Parker and where I think this guy in the video went wrong the first time around.
 

Silet

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One more addendum on the above on blades before I move on, I forgot to add this video link which covers the aggressiveness of various blades etc.

You will have to pause the video on each pack as he progresses to see on his sharpness scale how aggressive each blade is in comparison to others, He also markets a sensitive skin pack.

It's worth a look I think.

I have no contact with this guy nor have I ever bought any products off him but his "agressiveness packs" seem a very good idea, unfortunately, not available in Indonesia but at least the local blade prices don't break the bank even if you have to buy 100 at a time. LOL.

Here it is (I don't know if this video will embed automatically, if not any Mod reading has my permission to edit this post to make it do so).

 

vocalneal

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Am I missing something? I'm using something similar to this.

Sensor-Simple3-Tech-Tab_desktop.jpg


Mine don't even have a name :embarassed:

I think about $1.50 for two.
 

Silet

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I'll continue now on the video in El_Gorettos's post on the guy shaving with the Parker and why he in my opinion got it wrong the first time.

I'ts my belief people are being taight to use DE razors incorrectly from the beginning by how people and some experts tell them how to handle a razor.

I'll have to take you back to a straight edge/cut throat or shavette to be clear where I am coming from also please note all blades have a bevel, whether or not it's a razor blade or your set of kitchen knives, all blades have a bevel.

When you use a straight edge or shavette for the first time, or a shavette with any new blade, you put the razor blade and it's spine flat, i.e, parallel to your face. You then move the spine away from your face until the blade slides freely, just slicing through your beard.

Now just for a moment, imaging you have a DE razor with a blade that is not curved in the head but at right angles (perpendicular) to the handle.

If you had this razor, you would put the blade parallel to your face and the handle would be perpendicular to your face. You would slowly move the handle down until the blade glides as above.

You would never, ever put a straight edge razor at right angles to your face and move it upwards until it "caught", you would seriously hurt yourself, the same applies to a shavette and the same applies to my theoretical DE razor. You would never put a blade at right angles to your face.

Now when you see people on youtube showing people how to use a DE they tell them to put the safety bar on their cheek, with the razor handle parallel and tilt the razor up until it cuts. Totally wrong in my opinion, totally.

You should put the head of the razor on your cheek with the handle out and bring the handle down, this way you get the correct blade angle straight away, just as it would have been had you used a raw blade.

Now on to the bevel.

People tell you that an angle of +/- 30 is where the blade should be, yes that is about correct but with the blade in general at this angle, the bevel ground on the blade, at around 30 degrees, is just about running parallel to and on the surface of your skin.

Always try to remember where the actual blade is, and put the blade itself as parallel as possible (not the razor handle) and bring the blade down. Not put the safety bar or open comb on your face at right angles and then try to take the blade up, the more aggressive your razor if you do this the more you will hurt yourself.

The guy in the video learnt this the hard way by apparently scratching and scraping. Had he taken the blade down from it (the blade) being parallel to his skin rather than from just above right angles upwards, he would I am sure have not have gotten himself into trouble with an open comb in the first place.
 

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