Spouse sponsered kitap work

[Brian86]

Also, the explanation of the law for Visa Clarification is provided by the Kepmenkumham No. M.HH-01.GR.01.04 of 2023. It is itemized what each type of visa can and cannot do. It is clearly spelled out no ambiguity here that: for spouse sponsored VISA, It is forbidden to
"Receive rewards, wages,or similar compensation from individuals or corporations in Indonesia, unless it has gone through dual mechanism residence permit activities for establishing work relationships"
View attachment 3729

Your reference to UU No. 6 2011 is the same one I've been referring to, and proves my point. I don't understand what you're trying to say about it?

As for the above, you are looking at the wrong visa type. That is a spouse visa for two WNA, it's saying that Mister Investor can get a KITAS for his wife to join him in Indonesia, but she may not work. There is no content in that circular about the subject of this thread, which is WNA married to WNI.

 

[Brian86]

The last paragraph, does it mean that all WNA with a E31B (spouse kitas) need to have a kitas-work on top of the kitas-spouse? Or a work permit on top of the kitas-spouse? Not clear. Because it says:

E31B is a spouse kitas for the WNA spouse of a WNA visa holder (worker, investor, student, etc). Not a WNA spouse of a WNI, which is what this whole thread is about.

"Penyatuan keluarga bagi orang asing yang menggabungkan diri dengan suami atau istri pemegang izin tinggal terbatas atau izin tinggal tetap"

Google translate for those that need it; "Family unification for foreigners who combine themselves with a husband or wife who holds a limited residence permit or permanent residence permit"

 

[pantaiema]

E31B is a spouse kitas for the WNA spouse of a WNA visa holder (worker, investor, student, etc). Not a WNA spouse of a WNI, which is what this whole thread is about.

Your reference to UU No. 6 2011 is the same one I've been referring to, and proves my point. I don't understand what you're trying to say about it?

As for the above, you are looking at the wrong visa type. That is a spouse visa for two WNA, it's saying that Mister Investor can get a KITAS for his wife to join him in Indonesia, but she may not work. There is no content in that circular about the subject of this thread, which is WNA married to WNI.

This is the E31A VITAS (ex C317): Spouse of WNI is sponsoring his/her WNA spouse available from official Indonesian immigration websites, molina and eVisa website.

https://molina.imigrasi.go.id/front/faq/5eaebbff-d38d-4e12-959d-55c71dabc80a

or

https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/faq/5eaebbff-d38d-4e12-959d-55c71dabc80a

3a. With this visa you can carry out employment-related activities or attending education, as long as it has been reported to Immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).
5e. You are prohibited from working by receiving compensation, wages, or any similar from individuals or companies in Indonesia, unless reported to immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).

So you could work, (like volunteering ?) but you can not receive compensation, wages, or any similar from individuals or companies in Indonesia.

Please note that the information above is the immigration rules and regulations, which immigration officials are required to follow. It is not the product of a Law (undang undang).

This is a direct quotation from article 61 of the Immigration law UU_No_6_2011:
The Holders of ITAS as intended in Article 52 (e) and (f) and the holders of ITAP as intended in Article 54 paragraph (1) letters b and d CAN carry out work and/or business to meet their living and/or family needs.

Whether immigration rule is against the Immigration law UU_No_6_2011 or not, it is not clear. If it is found to be against the law (undang-undang), it will automatically be null and void. However, in order for this to occur, it will need to be challenged in the constitutional court

 

[Brian86]

This is the E31A VITAS (ex C317): Spouse of WNI is sponsoring his/her WNA spouse available from official Indonesian immigration websites, molina and eVisa website.

The regulation only concerns E31B.

E31A is for WNA married to WNI, and there is no larangan in the regulation you showed previously (Kepmenkumham No. M.HH-01.GR.01.04 Tahun 2023), it is not mentioned in that regulation at all.

E31B is for WNA married to WNA, and it does have larangan mentioned in that regulation.

No regulation disallows WNA spouse of WNI on spousal visa from working, and the highest level law UU6-2011 explicitly allows it. That website stating a prohibition in 5.d. and reporting requirement in 5.e. is interesting, but even official websites are not the law, show me the law or regulation that states this. I've been searching for years, and no expat or immigration official has ever shown me one.

Dimana dasar hukumnya?

 

[galinataz]

@Brian86
This is a direct quotation from article 61 of the Immigration law UU_No_6_2011:
"Pemegang Izin Tinggal terbatas sebagaimana dimaksud dalam Pasal 52 huruf e dan huruf f dan pemegang Izin Tinggal Tetap sebagaimana dimaksud dalam Pasal 54 ayat (1) huruf b dan huruf d dapat melakukan pekerjaan dan/atau usaha untuk memenuhi kebutuhan hidup dan/atau keluarganya."

The Holders of ITAS as intended in Article 52 (e) and (f) and the holders of ITAP as intended in Article 54 paragraph (1) letters b and d can carry out work and/or business to meet their living and/or family needs.
Regarding Article 52
"ITAS are granted to:
(e) Foreigners who are legally married to Indonesian citizens; or
(f) children of foreigners who are legally married to Indonesian citizens."
Regarding Article 54:
"ITAP are granted to:
(b) families due to mixed marriages
(d) Foreigners who are former Indonesian citizens and former child subjects with dual citizenship of the Republic of Indonesia.
The wording
".. can carry out work and/or business to meet their living and/or family needs." indicates that this is not a regular job that often must include the RPTKA.

Also, keep in mind that there are various types of ITAS with different purposes and their own rights, such as work, family, retirement, student, and Digital Nomad ITAS. They are all referred to as ITAS.

Also, the explanation of the law for Visa Clarification is provided by the Kepmenkumham No. M.HH-01.GR.01.04 of 2023. It is itemized what each type of visa can and cannot do. It is clearly spelled out no ambiguity here that: for spouse sponsored VISA, It is forbidden to
"Receive rewards, wages,or similar compensation from individuals or corporations in Indonesia, unless it has gone through dual mechanism residence permit activities for establishing work relationships"
View attachment 3729

Everyone could have their own interpretation, but I can readily see that what is described by @ilovered in post #15 aligns with this description. The information provided by Immigration and Manpower officials to her is in accordance with the law, with no contradiction or ambiguity here.

I'm sorry but this text about visa E31B (spouse of kitas/kitap holder) but no any information about E31A (spouse of WNI). I checked full text of this document and there's no information about E31A at all so does it mean with E31A it's allowed to work informal?

• Index E31A – spouse of WNI (Indonesian citizen)
• Index E31B – spouse of KITAS/KITAP Holder (except Retirement KITAS/KITAP)

 

[marcus]

... I checked full text of this document and there's no information about E31A at all so does it mean with E31A it's allowed to work informal?...

From https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/web/visa-selection
Type of Visa E31A - 1 YEAR or 2 YEARS
3. With this visa you can
Carry out employment-related activities or attending education, as long as it has been reported to Immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).
Travel to and from Indonesia as many times you want.
Conducting activities related to tourism, and visiting friends or family

5. Other information
e. You are prohibited from working by receiving compensation, wages, or any similar from individuals or companies in Indonesia, unless reported to immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).

Poster's Note : I recommend the interested foreigners to inform Immigration "using the multiple activity reporting process" as mentioned above , regarding any work plan you may have .

--------------------------------------------------

As far as I know , there is no issued information from Immigration or Manpower about "informal work" . The "informal work" subject probably first came from a "PERCA/Indonesian Mixed Marriage Organization" article about a meeting between them and 1 Immigration officer + 1 Manpower officer in March 2015 . It was published at http://percaindonesia.com , but it is not there anymore (I don't know why) . See below a copy that I saved from that time .

Summary of the meeting (free translation and some words changed for clearness) :
[.....
A) Holders of KITAS/KITAP sponsored by Indonesian spouse are allowed to work in a company ... having a work permit .
B) Foreigner workers cannot work in two different places (the same profession or different) EXCEPT investor director / commissioner of PMA (If one works in three places , 3 work permits are required .
C) If the activities of the foreign worker are in more than 1 place / province then he/she must have inter-provincial work permit .
D) Case: Foreigner of a mixed marriage with cuisine chef background want to open a small café, with a small seating area is classified as a small business and does not require a work permit . When this business grows crowded and large, than it is necessary to have operating permits from the relevant authorities . When the businesses becomes a legal entity, then this foreign worker must have a work permit .
E) Case: Foreign of a mixed marriage is already retired. Enters Indonesia with VOA and becomes an investor in a hotel in Bali. Once in a while he does work behind the scenes such as checks on the financial control department. With such conditions, it means the foreigner has been conducting work in Indonesia and must have KITAS and work permit , because even not all the time he/she is working .
F) A foreigner in a mixed marriage with KITAS sponsored by the Indonesian spouse . Working from home and having online business . Does not have an office and legal business such as PT or PMA . Because this foreigner is conducting work even though he only works online so this foreigner must have a work permit . This foreigner also cannot sign work contracts in Indonesia on behalf of himself/herself .
G) A foreigner who works and own business as an acupuncturist, must obtain an official recommendation from the local health office before doing business and work activities. If already have a recommendation from the relevant authorities, the foreign must have a work permit to be able to work in Indonesia .
H) A foreigner holder of KITAS/KITAP sponsored by spouse is allowed to work in Indonesia. The need of a work permit is to be seen from what the job is , workings for a legal entity or not, small or large business .

CONCLUSION:
Although the Immigration Law no. 6 of 2011 Article 61 states that the holder of a KITAS/KITAP can work and/or do business to make ends meet for him/her and/ for his/her family, the foreigner still has to refer back to the Labour Law no.13 year 2003 and Labour Regulations , which essentially means that a foreign worker in a mixed marriage is allowed to work without a work permit if in the informal sector, freelance or have a small business which is not a legal entity. When working in a legal entity then the foreigner MUST have a work permit.]

 

[pantaiema]

I'm sorry but this text about visa E31B (spouse of kitas/kitap holder) but no any information about E31A (spouse of WNI). I checked full text of this document and there's no information about E31A at all so does it mean with E31A it's allowed to work informal?

• Index E31A – spouse of WNI (Indonesian citizen)
• Index E31B – spouse of KITAS/KITAP Holder (except Retirement KITAS/KITAP)

The text below is about E31A VITAS wni spouse sponsored visa. It is official information from Immigration website. Keep in mind when you apply for something, you must agree to their term and condition. Unfortunately molina website has been deactivated.

https://evisa.imigrasi.go.id/front/faq/5eaebbff-d38d-4e12-959d-55c71dabc80a
3a. With this visa you can carry out employment-related activities or attending education, as long as it has been reported to Immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).
5e. You are prohibited from working by receiving compensation, wages, or any similar from individuals or companies in Indonesia, unless reported to immigration (using the multiple activity reporting process).

does it mean with E31A it's allowed to work informal?

In my view, the bolded text is very clear and unambiguous. You may be allowed to work, but it must be reported. Reporting could involve processes like IMTA (Work Permit) and RPTKA (a plan to replace foreign workers with local workers in the future).

However, the challenge to this interpretation comes from Immigration Law No. 6 of 2011, Article 61, which states that holders of KITAS/KITAP can work and/or run a small business helping family with their end meets. This has led some to view it as a grey area. In my opinion, the best approach is to consult the local immigration AND the manpower office, as they are the authorities responsible for inspections and enforcement. When you do, try to get their response in writing, either through formal email or a WhatsApp chat, as it could be useful for your defence later.

Also see my comment and attachment below on post #28 regarding my reply to the post #26

From what I've observed, the people who usually get caught are those who openly flaunting their lifestyle on social media and attract attention. Alternatively, someone who know it might be shopping them. If you do open a small business, ask immigration could you please share your information so we could also learn form it.

 

[pantaiema]

CONCLUSION:
Although the Immigration Law no. 6 of 2011 Article 61 states that the holder of a KITAS/KITAP can work and/or do business to make ends meet for him/her and/ for his/her family, the foreigner still has to refer back to the Labour Law no.13 year 2003 and Labour Regulations , which essentially means that a foreign worker in a mixed marriage is allowed to work without a work permit if in the informal sector, freelance or have a small business which is not a legal entity. When working in a legal entity then the foreigner MUST have a work permit.]

This information attached comes from people who have asked the immigration directly, so draw your own conclusion. Some of this information comes from the long standing members of this forum.

 

[Shadrach]

This information attached come from people who have asked the immigration directly, so draw the conclusion. Some of these information come from the long standing member of this forum.

This is a strange post. There is no way, I'm going to download this! Your spelling is way off. Red Flag! 🪿

 

[pantaiema]

This is a strange post. There is no way, I'm going to download this! Your spelling is way off. Red Flag! 🪿

As I mentioned earlier, the attached information is not mine, I am simply compiling it. It is just a screenshot compilation, and I haven’t changed or modified a single word. Do you really think I made it up?

As stated previously, some of the information in the attachment comes from the long standing members of this forum. If you search, you might still be able to find it in this forum.

 

[pantaiema]

CONCLUSION:
Although the Immigration Law no. 6 of 2011 Article 61 states that the holder of a KITAS/KITAP can work and/or do business to make ends meet for him/her and/ for his/her family, the foreigner still has to refer back to the Labour Law no.13 year 2003 and Labour Regulations , which essentially means that a foreign worker in a mixed marriage is allowed to work without a work permit if in the informal sector, freelance or have a small business which is not a legal entity. When working in a legal entity then the foreigner MUST have a work permit.]

@marcus, I am aware immigration Law no. 6 of 2011 Article 61 regarding small informal business, working helping family with their end meets.

Regarding Labour Law no.13 year 2003 would you mind referring the specific article confirming this phrase " which essentially means that a foreign worker in a mixed marriage is allowed to work without a work permit if in the informal sector, freelance or have a small business which is not a legal entity. "

 

[marcus]

@marcus, ... Regarding Labour Law no.13 year 2003 would you mind referring the specific article confirming this phrase " which essentially means that a foreign worker in a mixed marriage is allowed to work without a work permit if in the informal sector, freelance or have a small business which is not a legal entity. "

Let me clarify : that "CONCLUSION" is not my conclusion , but part of the article I mentioned in post no.26 above .

As far as I know there is no Article in Law no.13 Year 2003 stating anything similar to the phrase you mentioned .

 

[x799]

I have recently heard that IMTA is abolished and RPTKA is put in motion. So if a school wants to employ someone, what amount of money* do they have to pay to imigrasi or manpower ? *(estimate)

I also heard that there is something called DKPTKA. What is it ?

I am on a spouse sponsored KITAP btw.

 

[marcus]

I have recently heard that IMTA is abolished and RPTKA is put in motion.

From a quick look of the Regulation (see below) , it seems the process now is based only on the RPTKA . Although all changes , I think that in practice , for foreigners things are the same , except for few foreigners who were benefited in the Omnibus Law .

So if a school wants to employ someone, what amount of money* do they have to pay to imigrasi or manpower ? *(estimate)

Usually , US$100 per month (see details in the Regulation)

I also heard that there is something called DKPTKA. What is it ?

It is the US$100 per month fee above (see the Regulation below) .

-------------------------------------

PerMen no.8 Year 2021 (partial) - free translation (I am not sure if it was revised or not)
Article 1
9. DKPTKA (Foreign Worker Compensation Fund) is compensation that must be paid by foreign workers' employers for each foreign worker employed as non-tax state revenue or regional income.
Article 4
Every foreign worker employed by a foreign worker employer must:
a. possess education that aligns with the qualifications of the work position;
b. possess at least 5 years of competency or work experience that aligns with the qualifications of the work position; and
c. transfer his/her expertise to the foreign worker's accompanying worker.
Article 35
(1) Employers of foreign workers who employ foreign workers are required to pay the DKPTKA in the amount of US$100 (one hundred United States dollars) per position per person per month as PNBP or regional revenue in the form of regional levies.
(2) The obligation to pay the DKPTKA does not apply to:
a. government agencies;
b. foreign country representatives;
c. international bodies;
d. social institutions;
e. religious institutions; and
f. certain positions in educational institutions.

 

[serious_fun]

b. possess at least 5 years of competency or work experience

This is the clause that eliminates me; my former employees have all considered me to be incompetent and have accused me of not working... therefore no verified work experience. (sigh)

Oh well.

 

[pantaiema]

This is a strange post. There is no way, I'm going to download this! Your spelling is way off. Red Flag! 🪿

Looking at this thread again, I have more to clarify. It's important for people to understand that the attachment in post #28 comes from individuals worldwide, where English is not necessarily their first language.

Additionally, the posts may have been written by their Indonesian spouses. When people post on a forum from a mobile device, it isn’t the same as writing an article or a formal essay. They often don’t pay much attention to spelling or grammar, as long as their message is understood.

It seems someone here may need to fine tune his radar.

 

[pantaiema]

There are good articles written by professionals about work permit, DKP-TKA, RPTKA and other procedures and how to get it for those who need it. It is explained in step by step

What is DKP-TKA, and How to Pay for It - Visa Indonesia

Learn how and when to pay DKP-TKA correctly in Indonesia. Follow our detailed, step-by-step guide to ensure smooth foreign worker recruitment. Read now!

visa-indonesia.com

https://www.hukumonline.com/klinik/a/siapa-yang-wajib-membayar-dana-kompensasi-penggunaan-tka-lt5e4621468f1ec/

 

[x799]

I will ask a couple of questions of you guys don't mind, (one by one once I receive answers for my first question)

I got in touch with a lawyer the other day, he said "the companies that recruit spouse sponsored KITAP holders are not required to pay IMTA / RPTKA or DPTKA. any type of that mentioned 100 dollars per month fee."

How accurate is this statement?

I am pretty much confused now.

 

[marcus]

... "the companies that recruit spouse sponsored KITAP holders are not required to pay IMTA / RPTKA or DPTKA. any type of that mentioned 100 dollars per month fee."

How accurate is this statement?

Not true in my view . Ask the lawyer about the name/number and article of the Law or Regulation .

 

[x799]

As I am a foreigner holding a spouse-sponsored KITAP, and a school is considering employing me;


I would like to understand what costs the employer must pay to Immigration and Manpower on top of my gross salary, if any. In particular, I am trying to get a clear picture of the following items:
To make it easy for the calculation of the prices, let's assume that the salary would be 10 juta (net) not gross.

• Salary (net)
  
  
• PPh 21 (income tax) – who pays what portion?
  
  
• BPJS Ketenagakerjaan (Manpower BPJS) – employer vs employee contribution
  
  
• BPJS Kesehatan (Health BPJS) – employer vs employee contribution
  
  
• Any mandatory government fees (e.g., DPKK / USD 100 levy, if applicable to Spouse Sponsored KITAP holders after the recent amendments in law)

If possible, could someone please explain this with a simple example, using percentages or approximate figures, so I can clearly understand the total cost to the employer excluding my salary?


Thank you in advance for your guidance.

Note= I used AI and unsurprisingly I got conflicting answers, that is why I am here.