Opinions on Hi-Scope schools

[William King]

Shot in school here? Not likely. Getting blown up while at the mall is a possibility. But take heart, its about as common as getting shot in an American school.

Please list, in alphabetical order, which malls in Jakarta have had people blown up recently, or even over the last decade.

 

[William King]

.
As for the religion shit I have argued the case that I want my boys to learn a bit about Christianity and Hinduism (we do live in Bali FFS) but they flatly refuse even as an extracurricular lesson because as muslims they can only learn about Islam.
The boys are 13 now and we discuss things on the subject, my kids soak this up and now challenge the RE teacher who doesn't answer their questions and wont engage in any debate - so its the usual brainwashing "accept what I say mentality"

That's due to government regulations on how religion must be taught. Not school choice. They are just complying with the law.

Besides, if a school taught a subject such as comparative religions there is the very real risk that some nut down the road or an unhappy parent will claim they are proselytizing and have the school in even more trouble, possibly jail for teachers and administrators and closure of the school.

 

[William King]

Another useful addition to the family would be a little scooter thingy, that way at least the wife or the maid can pop down to the shops and / or also drop the kids off at school (assuming you trust her on a bike and she can ride one)
Then the 10min walk is a 1 min ride only

Please don't.

1. Bikes are dangerous to ride for even an experienced rider.

2. Maids riding bikes are even worse.

Putting kids on bikes with maids is doubling done.

Bad advice. IMHO.

 

[azrielariel]

We are arriving from the states. Someone asked that. The security at the malls is very high, even in Bakasi where her mother lives so I doubt it's on the short list of bombing sites. What I don't like is being charged a parking fee at every little strip mall or run down area that decides to throw up a toll booth. And, those guys who direct traffic for a fee! They are more of an obstruction than anything else.

I've seen some questionable driving on scooters. Entire families of four on them which is scary to watch. I was there for a month and saw two collisions. One where the scooter guy side swiped a car and then began pounding on his windows as if it was his fault. The other was a woman who merely fell over at a stop light. She was holding a child and nearly got run over. That had a high pucker factor.

The trouble with living in a non-secular country is you have to follow the rules including those that pertain to religion. In Indonesia I read where the government "tolerates" other faiths which to me means it's at their option and discretion to allow anything other than Islam. That's not something I want to test the limits of and if the school tosses in some other beliefs into the curriculum so be it. I'm fine with it. It's up to us as parents to guide our children.

 

[waarmstrong]

Please list, in alphabetical order, which malls in Jakarta have had people blown up recently, or even over the last decade.

I guess you got me. Aside from the Sarinah bombing in 2016, I cannot recall mall bombings; the most recent bombers targeted churches in Surabaya, and of course, the 2002 Bali bombers targeted a night spot. There have been many others that made the news as well.
The point is that whether its an event or school in the US or a public place in Indonesia, the level of risk is not defined by very infrequent terrorist acts that make the news.

 

[jstar]

And, those guys who direct traffic for a fee! They are more of an obstruction than anything else.

Yes they are so annoying you'd pay them to get out of the way...

They are also called pak ogah. That name originates from a children's TV show called Unyil. From a character who is pretending to help you but in fact is just tiresome and always asking for money.....
.

 

[waarmstrong]

Its a mixed bag for me. The Pak Ogah can be annoying, but there are times and places where they are helpful, as well. Besides that, its a way to get rid of otherwise worthless small denomination coins.

 

[snpark]

Please list, in alphabetical order, which malls in Jakarta have had people blown up recently, or even over the last decade.

malls or hotels? Ritz Carlton, JW Marriott, Sarinah ? Various police stations?
I don't remember anyone getting shot in a school recently?

 

[snpark]

Please don't.

1. Bikes are dangerous to ride for even an experienced rider.

2. Maids riding bikes are even worse.

Putting kids on bikes with maids is doubling done.

Bad advice. IMHO.

Fair point but we are talking 500m down a quiet kampung side street, not 1 hour on a toll road

 

[snpark]

Security in malls is just a bored underpaid guy in a black shirt waving a plastic wand in every other bag, for which the batteries expired in 2013 and the thing doesn't beep anyway, and they don't even stop you if it does beep

It is just for show - but realistically it is pretty safe here, safer than USA for sure, imho

 

[waarmstrong]

Planes are supposed to be safer than cars. There are always outliers, of course; Lie'n Air for example.

 

[azrielariel]

Security in malls is just a bored underpaid guy in a black shirt waving a plastic wand in every other bag, for which the batteries expired in 2013 and the thing doesn't beep anyway, and they don't even stop you if it does beep

It is just for show - but realistically it is pretty safe here, safer than USA for sure, imho

I don’t know if it’s safer than the states.

Here is something I noticed. Most houses are locked up tighter than Fort Knox and many have broken glass or prison style razor wire on their surrounding walls. What for? I think it’s more about being overly paranoid than anything else.

I’ve walked the streets of Bekasi at all hours and never got accosted. The most interaction I’ve had is a hello sir which I’d reply back in kind.

Where I live in Colorado there are no fences, walls, or security details. That was a surprise that there were gates and men guarding a street till all hours. Every hour he’ll bang on a fence he walks by. A couple times I wanted to yell out that people are trying to sleep.

Point is, I suspect the real crime rate is no where near the perceived level. However, I’ve also been told there would otherwise be a much higher number of unemployed people if they weren’t doing mostly useless security.

 

[jstar]

hello sir

"Hello Mister!"

When I walk the dogs at night, okay bad example (they're afraid of dogs)....when I walk around at night I never have any issues either. But several houses in the kompleks have been visited by burglars here the previous year. (Luckily we have dogs, it does help.) Those guys can climb really well.

What is also an issue, is the attack of women on the street, while walking, taking Gojek, sitting in Angkor or Bajaj, ... to steal their purses. Most often by two guys on a motorcycle.

 

[waarmstrong]

My point exactly. Crime rate statistics in both countries, I will wager, do not jive with the hysteria born of headline grabbing shootings or bombings.

If that's a nit you want to pick, be my guest, but please do your own research.

 

[Euc-]

Indonesian schools are safe from shootings yes, from getting your head stabbed? nope:
https://news.detik.com/berita-jawa-...9.1971089661.1532329967-1146510251.1493360763

Then you have the issue of the "tawuran", giant street fights between kids from different schools which is apparently a "right of passage" to become a man.. Apparently "
Over the past five years, there were over 130 student deaths from more than 800 brawls just in and around Jakarta.".

Al Jazeerah did a pretty good documentary about it. A "tawuran" youtube search will give you some ideas as well.

All in all, Indonesia in general is still far safer compared to the USA and many other places in the world, but we should not diminish the safety aspect completely.

 

[Euc-]

I don’t know if it’s safer than the states.

Here is something I noticed. Most houses are locked up tighter than Fort Knox and many have broken glass or prison style razor wire on their surrounding walls. What for? I think it’s more about being overly paranoid than anything else.

I’ve walked the streets of Bekasi at all hours and never got accosted. The most interaction I’ve had is a hello sir which I’d reply back in kind.

Where I live in Colorado there are no fences, walls, or security details. That was a surprise that there were gates and men guarding a street till all hours. Every hour he’ll bang on a fence he walks by. A couple times I wanted to yell out that people are trying to sleep.

Point is, I suspect the real crime rate is no where near the perceived level. However, I’ve also been told there would otherwise be a much higher number of unemployed people if they weren’t doing mostly useless security.

Burglary is a real issue, unfortunately. Especially for the somewhat more "luxurious" looking houses.

As jstar has pointed out, having dogs will help. Unfortunately if they know they are in for a real score that's nothing that a little poisoned meat won't solve. You should always try from a very young age to train them not to accept any food from ANYWHERE else, except their own bowl. Easier said then done though.

If you have a "prize dog", husky's or the like, then that could actually make them a target for the burglary in itself.

 

[waarmstrong]

Bullying and adolescent group thuggery are serious problems in Indonesian schools. Your comment lists Jakarta stats, but you link is to Cikajang Garut. There were actually 3 or 4 student street brawls in Jakarta in June, one resulting in a death, but that's not as many as you suggest are common. (800 in five years is over 13 a month. That appears over blown, to me.)

Again, hand wringing, sensationalizing reports suggesting schools are unsafe does not comport with reality, in my experience. What is disheartening? The failure of schools, and beyond the local level, the Indonesian government writ large, to address this serious cultural flaw.

 

[snpark]

yeh there is opportunist petty crime for sure, because of the poverty and they way a lot of indo's show off with new phones etc so you see a lot of "muggings", bag snatches, etc and yes scooters being nicked

and of course ATM hypnotisms
lol

 

[Euc-]

Bullying and adolescent group thuggery are serious problems in Indonesian schools. Your comment lists Jakarta stats, but you link is to Cikajang Garut. There were actually 3 or 4 student street brawls in Jakarta in June, one resulting in a death, but that's not as many as you suggest are common. (800 in five years is over 13 a month. That appears over blown, to me.)

Again, hand wringing, sensationalizing reports suggesting schools are unsafe does not comport with reality, in my experience. What is disheartening? The failure of schools, and beyond the local level, the Indonesian government writ large, to address this serious cultural flaw.

I never said Jakarta, I said Indonesia.

The numbers are from the news article, not what I suggest. Numbers quoted from following: https://coconuts.co/jakarta/news/sixth-grader-attacks-kills-classmate-scissors-missing-book/

Schools are not safe? Nah, I merely intended to show that all countries have their issues, wether that's inside schools or "extracurricular activities" such as these brawls. I'll leave the interpretation up to the readers.

 

[jstar]

and of course ATM hypnotisms

That is so amazing. Even a tante of my wife is convinced she was victim of such a hypnotism. Money missing from the account and she realized later she even took the guys home?!