Executions

[vocalneal]

You have now agreed there's a difference.
Your post implied there was no difference to a person committing suicide and one wanting their life to end because of terminal cancer.

I never said there wasn't a difference. Euthanasia involves assistance from others.

If a person with terminal cancer wants to end their life themselves, without assistance, by say jumping off a multistory car park. Then that is suicide and sometimes is an act of bravery, not desperation.

 

[vocalneal]

Talking of executions is it fair to say everyone has watched Pierrepoint: The Last Hangman

 

[El_Goretto]

What if there was a more human way of dealing with criminals other than harsh long sentences and executions? I invite you to read this article on the Nordic way of dealing with criminals and correction systems: https://mic.com/articles/109138/sweden-has-done-for-its-prisoners-what-the-u-s-won-t#.ewXwPhQPm

Imagine living on ... knowing every minute of every day, that this is not your home, these people are not your family, your friends, your children, and you are always one misstep from a cell in a closed prison. You have strict curfews. In town you carry an electronic anklet. Yet nothing here feels unfair or unreasonable. You have, after all, committed a crime serious enough to make a range of other remedies untenable. Nothing you can see or touch or smell or taste, and no interaction with staff gives you anything to blame or resent about the system that brought you here.

A counter point would be that Northen Europe countries cannot be compared to the USA because they differ on so many points and as such if we ever dreamed of having more humane prisons in America, a lot more would need to change in its society as a whole first.

I do believe that rather than finding ways of designing harsher punishments as a deterrent, we should look at what exactly went wrong for those individuals to commit those crimes in the first place. Maybe fixing those broken aspects of society would be a far greater deterrent in the long term. But of course, it's not as immediate nor as satisfying for the victims as the electric chair.

 

[Davita]

I never said there wasn't a difference. Euthanasia involves assistance from others.

If a person with terminal cancer wants to end their life themselves, without assistance, by say jumping off a multistory car park. Then that is suicide and sometimes is an act of bravery, not desperation.

Jumping off a building surely is suicide and, if done by someone just because they had terminal cancer, IMO, would be an act of extreme despair.
BTW I have terminal cancer (see blog below) but, be assured, jumping off a building isn't on my bucket list as I also suffer from acrophobia.

 

[vocalneal]

You keep coming back to this despair thing. Not everyone who commits suicide is desperate. Why can you not accept that some may chose to end their life on their terms and not on terms that are beyond their control.

What about the Japanese act of Seppuku? Is that an act of desperation?

 

[Davita]

You keep coming back to this despair thing. Not everyone who commits suicide is desperate. Why can you not accept that some may chose to end their life on their terms and not on terms that are beyond their control.

What about the Japanese act of Seppuku? Is that an act of desperation?

I suggest you google "rational suicide" or similar and find there is much debate by minds better than mine.

My OP defined a distinction between suicide by the act of jumping off a building, hanging oneself, cutting wrists or euthanasia by taking a known chemical and die gracefully.

My point being if one can rationally wish to take one's life by euthanasia then a similar method for execution would probably prove to be the most humane....which is the subject of this debate.

 

[Fred]

The logical flaw in that comeback is that life imprisonment is an equally effective deterrent for one person

I understand quite a few people push that rubbish argument as fact.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ot-leaves-five-officers-and-one-prisoner-dead

Inmates who started a deadly riot controlled three cellblocks inside a maximum-security Indonesian jail for more than 36 hours before the siege ended on Thursday morning with five officers and one prisoner dead.

 

[Puspawarna]

I understand quite a few people push that rubbish argument as fact.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ot-leaves-five-officers-and-one-prisoner-dead

If the solution to prison unrest is to kill all the prisoners, why even bother with prisons? Just shoot 'em all.

You'd have to show me evidence that prison riots throughout the world are typically initiated and carried out by prisoners who are in prison for crimes that should be (in your estimation) worthy of capital punishment before I could give any credence to your argument that "capital punishment stops prison riots." Plus, you'd have to show that proper prison management doesn't prevent riots.

 

[steveandpenny]

My final thought on this is maybe most countries with the death penalty should do what England did a while ago........send them to Australia. It worked once before lol.

ITS A JOKE SO DONT TRY TO EXPLAIN TO ME THE DIFFERANCES.

 

[Davita]

My final thought on this is maybe most countries with the death penalty should do what England did a while ago........send them to Australia. It worked once before lol.

ITS A JOKE SO DONT TRY TO EXPLAIN TO ME THE DIFFERANCES.

A bigger joke is that USA was a thriving penal colony before Australia. The War of Independence stopped that but the States around the Chesapeake did thrive on indentured debtors from UK.....
https://paleofuture.gizmodo.com/britain-sent-thousands-of-its-convicts-to-america-not-1707458418

 

[Anglian]

My final thought on this is maybe most countries with the death penalty should do what England did a while ago........send them to Australia. It worked once before lol..

Sadly if you have a criminal record they won’t let you in, funny that, in Dorset, UK, the bridges have a metal plaque saying to the effect anyone damaging the bridge will be deported for 7 years, probable to America first, pay your own fare home,
People steal the plaques, probably americans

 

[Fred]

If the solution to prison unrest is to kill all the prisoners, why even bother with prisons? Just shoot 'em all.

For terrorists (as in my link) and drug dealers, I agree with you - kill the pointless idiots and be done.
It's good to see you coming round to a right way of thinking.

 

[Anglian]

For terrorists (as in my link) and drug dealers, I agree with you - kill the pointless idiots and be done.
It's good to see you coming round to a right way of thinking.

I see in UK they are getting worried that many jihadist will be released from prison after serving their time for terrorist offenses, and are they repentant after serving their time, of course not, so they will be released and off we go again, it’s a total waste of time and money, just shoot them, bullets aren’t to expensive

 

[Gratilla]

For terrorists (as in my link) and drug dealers, I agree with you - kill the pointless idiots and be done.

More insidious than terrorists and drug dealers are CORRUPT POLITICIANS.

Consider how many suffer and die for each million diverted from public coffers.

 

[Fred]

More insidious than terrorists and drug dealers are CORRUPT POLITICIANS.

Consider how many suffer and die for each million diverted from public coffers.

China has something handy for them - a bullet in the back of the head

 

[Puspawarna]

For terrorists (as in my link) and drug dealers, I agree with you - kill the pointless idiots and be done.
It's good to see you coming round to a right way of thinking.

Fred, I'd like to make an introduction: Rhetorical question, meet Fred. Fred, meet Rhetorical Question. Hopefully the two of you can get to know one another and come to a mutual understanding.

 

[Puspawarna]

My final thought on this is maybe most countries with the death penalty should do what England did a while ago........send them to Australia. It worked once before lol.

ITS A JOKE SO DONT TRY TO EXPLAIN TO ME THE DIFFERANCES.

Better watch that, steveandpenny! I worked mostly with Australians for over 7 years. Uncouth American that I am, I made a couple of jokes along those lines. They didn't go over particularly well, so I stopped. Most Australians I've met have a damn fine sense of humor, so I'm not sure they were offended exactly. Maybe just tired of being ribbed that way over and over again?

 

[Anglian]

Better watch that, steveandpenny! I worked mostly with Australians for over 7 years. Uncouth American that I am, I made a couple of jokes along those lines. They didn't go over particularly well, so I stopped. Most Australians I've met have a damn fine sense of humor, so I'm not sure they were offended exactly. Maybe just tired of being ribbed that way over and over again?

That’s true Puspa, but Aussies should be proud of their convict ancestors as they built a great country, the intellect and skills of those early convicts is far higher than the convicts we have in UK prisons at the moment, you couldnt send them to a shop to buy a bottle of milk

 

[harryopal1]

For all those in favour of capital punishment here's today's scene. 4 am in the morning your front door is smashed open. A shouting and angry group with guns burst in. You are thrown to the floor, roughed up, handcuffed and taken away.

An elderly lady down the street has been bashed to death in her bedroom. Another lady next door to her saw the perpetrator run away and gave police a description which matches you. And when she sees you she is positive that you are the killer. (All Bules look alike.) A neighbour across the street with whom you don't particularly get along saw you skulking outside the victim's house earlier that night and days earlier heard you threaten to kill her.. You actually threatened to kill her dog as it had pooped right in front of your front gate. Earlier that night you had moved along the footpath picking up trash from you can that had been tipped over by another scavenging dog. The police find bruising on the side of your right hand. You had tripped a couple of days ago and put out your hand to break the fall. Where were you at the time of the murder. At home but there was no one else in the house to be a witness.

You are sentenced to death and because of the heinous nature of the crime are also to be given 30 lashes. You appeal and the lashes are dropped.

A month later the cell door opens and guards troop in to take you off for execution. You think to yourself that everyone makes mistakes and because of your rigorous commitment to capital punishment and knowing that it is a deterrent and for the greater good you go off happily to be hanged.

 

[Davita]

RE: post ^ #39
Currently there's a documentary of some who have been incarcerated for many years in USA jails for crimes they didn't commit. Imagine if they were capital crimes.
Also, breaking-news is a rogue cop and his buddies faked evidence, stole drug proceeds and re-sold drugs while simultaneously charging the criminals. The evidence from this cop is now so tainted thousand of cases have to be annulled. I think it was in Baltimore but not sure.