2019 Presidential Election and PKI

[FONT=TIActuBeta-ExBold_web]ASSOCIATES OF DONALD TRUMP in Indonesia have joined army officers and a vigilante street movement linked to ISIS in a campaign that ultimately aims to oust the country’s president. According to Indonesian military and intelligence officials and senior figures involved in what they call “the coup,” the move against President Joko Widodo (known more commonly as Jokowi), a popular elected civilian, is being impelled from behind the scenes by active and retired generals.
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https://theintercept.com/2017/04/18...ed-militia-seeking-to-oust-elected-president/
 
Daniel50 said:
I don't know what is going to happen. It will be dirty and it looks like they will be playing the religion card.
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Did you read the article Daniel? It goes into a lot more detail then that.
 
fastpitch17 said:
Did you read the article Daniel? It goes into a lot more detail then that.
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I did read it and there were parts that seemed too much. I was hoping you might have some more insight into it.
I think some people thought it was spot on. jstar also summarized or gave an overview of the characters involved and the roles they could play for Prabowo. The author dealing with parts of it seemed exaggerated in his inferences but hey what do I know.
 
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Dirty is an understatement. Religious card seems to be reported as a different approach then what citizens have seen so far. They talk of coups with players right under Jokowi's nose. They talk of radical groups being used to take over the palace and DPR so it can be called a takeover by the people and then the treasonous leaders just take over from them. They talk of deputy speakers of the DPR being leaders of the treason as well as high level military personnel. They talk of current Ministers being involved. That is not just a religious card. That is an overthrow of a government before an election.

The military leader has come out and said this is fake news. Perhaps, some of it is but there is a lot of detail and naming names and dates. They are a lot of refusals to comment too from the ones in the know. Does Trump have involvement, I have no idea but I think it it easy to point a finger at Probowo and Hari Tanoe. Hari being Trumps business partner here, who knows what he knows and any involvement. If there are dollars to be made, it wouldn't surprise me.

The article may have some fabrication but I think it is based on a lot of truths. I have always seen the Ahok case as a run up to taking the central government. If he would have won the story may have played out differently. The people didn't speak up when they needed to so the organized, loud, and determined side won. They will get louder. They are already more determined and their organization will build. The communist card will be played and when Indonesians hear communist they seem to automatically relate Chinese to it. Remember, it has already been stated that communist should be fed to the sharks and Muslims should take up arms against it. That pretty much means bloodshed. A lot of blood shed. History repeating itself. Not a pretty sight.

They will win too. Do you know why? Because Indonesians that are uneducated will follow them and most of the ones that have an education will sit on their asses telling their families it is wrong but not doing a damn thing about it. Just like the Jakarta election.

Too bad we can't find a Western Occupier to come in. No, it won't happen.
 
The Army is reporting the website that published the Indonesian version of this article to the police.
 
Well when I started coming here, some years ago, it was hard for me to believe the "stuff" that went on and people would try to debate it rationally. But it just seemed crazy like how can this even be happening. It was like a soap opera. A corrupter suddenly sick or in a wheel chair, the lies upon obvious lies around corruption. Just like the mafia might do. So I guess when I think of things that way if something sounds like a soap opera doesn't mean it might not be happening. That's because the people in power are not subjected to the law, for the most part.

I remember I was staying at a hotel and the TNI were doing some big training in the area. One TNI member sitting there was looking quite intense. He looked like the top general you see in the news. I don't know if it was or not but he was looking around quite intense. I know the look and if a person feels threatened/triggered there can be a conflict. I did not react or engage but there is not much they couldn't do to people here if they wanted, so in that sense it is somewhat unsettling i.e. no to little rule of law when it comes to dealing with the police and military.
 
El_Goretto said:
The Army is reporting the website that published the Indonesian version of this article to the police.
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Of course they are. That would be the standard procedure I believe. The site I posted is not an Indonesian site and my understanding it was reported by the Guardian to begin with. The Indonesian site just shared what they read. Not sure what can be done but something will be whether just or not. The Indonesian news site can't prove the content since they didn't write it and the military doesn't have to disprove it. Celebrities seem to file law suits against foreign publications all the time but I haven't seen any movement by the military to do that. I'm sure the reporter can produce documents to support their reporting and that would make the military look guilty.

The article is out now. It is being spread around in at least the English version so those that need to know should by now. Whether it does any good, only time will tell.
 
I am just not sure of the whole thesis, or premise, that education = more rational. I believe many thinkers believed this prior to WW11 (that humanity would keep progressing to ever greater enlightenment through education) some people were giving this a serious rethink afterwards.

I definitely believe it is much to narrow, thinking the uneducated can be fooled so easily. In fact many times they know what needs to be done and have a keener sense of social justice.

I don't believe the communist purge is going to be a repeat (read I believe this is delusional) but it may be a good scare tactic.
 
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Daniel50 said:
I am just not sure of the whole thesis, or premise, that education = more rational. I believe many thinkers believed this prior to WW11 (that humanity would keep progressing to ever greater enlightenment through education) some people were giving this a serious rethink afterwards.

I definitely believe it is much to narrow, thinking the uneducated can be fooled so easily. In fact many times they know what needs to be done and have a keener sense of social justice.

I don't believe the communist purge is going to be a repeat (read I believe this is delusional) but it may be a good scare tactic.
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Education in Indonesia relates to the poor unemployed/under employed. They are eager to be led to prosperity. The uneducated part pretty much makes them keep coming back even when the promises don't materialize. The uneducated part relates to those that have been told to follow their entire lives and be submissive to a religion that has it's messages delivered by those that would like to lead them to a way that will not be beneficial for the nation but believe it will be for them if they continue to follow. The, "it's god's will" people who have been so misfed information for so long that all open-mindness and critical thinking has escaped them. Sure, there are some well educated people involved with all this but their motivation is not religion.
 
Daniel50 said:
I remember I was staying at a hotel and the TNI were doing some big training in the area. One TNI member sitting there was looking quite intense. He looked like the top general you see in the news. I don't know if it was or not but he was looking around quite intense. I know the look and if a person feels threatened/triggered there can be a conflict. I did not react or engage but there is not much they couldn't do to people here if they wanted, so in that sense it is somewhat unsettling i.e. no to little rule of law when it comes to dealing with the police and military.
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I totally understand that feeling. It happened to me at the Thousand Islands. A bunch of soldier literally came out of the water: they were training in the nearby island and apparently needed to do live fire drill on the island where we were. Luckily it didn't happen. However, a bunch of them approached us (I was a lone with a friend visiting from overseas) while we were sitting in front of our bungalow, trying to strike a conversation with us in a seemingly friendly manner. But their body language and the fact that one of them just kept going around looking (but not entering) inside our room as if looking for something was rather intimidating.
A couple of hours prior, a mix group of Immigration officer, Police and Navy asked me what I was doing in Indonesia and controlled all my paperwork on the spot (I had everything with me). Needless to say, on that small island, far from the capital, I felt extremely powerless.

fastpitch17 said:
The article is out now. It is being spread around in at least the English version so those that need to know should by now. Whether it does any good, only time will tell.
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The Indonesian translation one has been spreading like crazy as well. Even my in-laws read it after receiving it through whatsapp from one of their contacts.
 
.
About the New-Style Communism the article mentions, this is the Powerpoint referred to, which explains the background of the so called KGB: https://theintercept.com/document/2...ts-posed-by-new-style-communism-in-indonesia/


Hereby a translated quote in the article of a large newspaper, the Pos Kota, from March 16, 2016:
[SIZE=-1]It also needs to be remembered that communists in Indonesia represent a latent threat that has never died out, but has simply changed its form and will continue to develop though new styles. Society very much needs to play a role in supporting the TNI (Indonesian military) in safeguarding the country's sovereignty and the integrity of the NKRI (Unitary State of the Republic of Indonesia) from the dangers of latent communism.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Because of this therefore, we as citizens of the state must assist one another in stemming the development of communist ideas in Indonesia. Remember, "THE COMMUNISTS ARE EVERYWHERE!!!".[/SIZE]
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It was about a planned showing of the film Buru Island My Home Land. Pulau Buru Tanah Air Beta is a movie about political prisoners that were detained in the Moluccan Island of Buru after the 1965 events. Because of protests and fear for mass demonstrations, many screenings were cancelled. [sic]
 
I passed the English and Indonesian versions on to my daughter who in turn has passed them on to her ex uni friends, so it must be half way round jakarta by now
 
Anglian said:
I passed the English and Indonesian versions on to my daughter who in turn has passed them on to her ex uni friends, so it must be half way round jakarta by now
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Is the Indonesian version still around?
 
Well then if it is going to be that bad then we had all better get on the right side, because we know what happened to the other side. We also need to be patriotic and be on the right side. Only someone who is strong re: Prabowo can guide us through all this without a repeat of all the bloodshed, but only if we are on his side.
 
Daniel50 said:
Well then if it is going to be that bad then we had all better get on the right side, because we know what happened to the other side. We also need to be patriotic and be on the right side. Only someone who is strong re: Prabowo can guide us through all this without a repeat of all the bloodshed, but only if we are on his side.
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Are you OK?
 
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