Gathering support and contacts in Jakarta

[Vulgarian]

I don't mean to be unfeeling, but... maaaate. Take a step back and survey the facts you have been presented with.

It's better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all, sure, but it sounds like this relationship is over.

Have a think, have a chat with people close to you that care for you, go for a run, breathe.

 

[harryopal1]

I don't mean to be unkind but I think you need counselling. The "love of your life" lies to you about marriaqe and leaves you hanging for a month without contacting you? This seems seriously masochistic. If this lady has genuine affection or love for you then, as has been pointed out, she can just leave. At the very least some positive affirming action on her part. I am not being sarcastic. If you talk with a trained counsellor it might help you better understand this very confused situation.

 

[fastpitch17]

This is Indonesia. I don't care what excuses are used but a woman who is not detained in some physical manor can indeed disapear. Maybe not with immediate family but they all seem to have a extended family. While not blood related, they consider them family. Unless disliked by family and not trusted, family would protect their own. If this guy is supporting the family then that protection goes way down thus, the extended family with no financial ties.

If the husband didn't catch you 2 in the act there normally isn't a case. It may just be the only thing getting screwed is you. You are in Sing, she is in Indo. Best to keep it that way if she can't take any inititive on her own. Go get your noodle wet in Sing and all this will just pass you by. If you elect to die for this silly cause, you very well could. It takes two to get this resolved just like it took the two of you to wiggle in the bed. When you pulled out the partnership didn't end unless one side decided it did. That just may be the case.

So, how much have you spent on her in total, from day one when you met and just knew she was the one? Gifts, food, rooms, spending cash, promises of divorce. Everything. We have all heard these stories before. It is either a fantasy to put in writing to get responses, a total scam on her part, an incredible fuck experience you think will be repeated. All in all, something that isn't going to work out for you. Cheaper to go to the club and get laid.

 

[dafluff]

If she has a formal marriage, buku nikah (from KUA - for Muslims) or Akta Perkawinan (from Catatan Sipil - for all others), then for the legal threats to work he has to prove that sex (penetrative) has taken place. This can be done via several legal means in Indonesia: witnesses (caught in the act), confession, explicit photos/videos (incl. electronic).

I've been asked to elaborate a bit on this, so here goes. But first standard disclaimer: This is not legal advice, get your own lawyer, do your own research, past performance is not indicative of future results, etc.

First the relevant KUHP Statute:

Pasal 284 KUHP

(1) Diancam dengan pidana penjara paling lama sembilan bulan:

1.a. Seorang pria yang telah kawin yang melakukan mukah (overspel) padahal diketahui bahwa pasal 27 BW berlaku baginya;

b. Seorang wanita yang telah kawin yang melakukan mukah.

2.a. Seorang pria yang turut serta melakukan perbuatan itu, padahal diketahuinya bahwa yang turut bersalah telah kawin.

b. Seorang wanita yang telah kawin yang turut serta melakukan perbuatan itu, padahal diketahui olehnya bahwa yang turut bersalah telah kawin dan pasal 27 BW berlaku baginya.

Mukah in this context is usually understood as sexual intercourse (penile-vaginal).

The law requires at least 2 pieces of evidence (alat bukti) for criminal (KUHP) cases. These include witness testimony, expert testimony, letters (photos/pictures, incl digital), and confession. The majority of these cases in Indonesia are people caught red-handed (in flagrante delicto). In these cases, the prosecutors and judges have to rely on witness testimony.

Did the witness actually witness penetrative sex? Probably not: someone trying to break into your hotel room tends to stop that pretty quickly. But they probably saw enough that a reasonable person can conclude what transpired. For photos and videos, the people and time that they were taken need to be established. This will require forensic examination by experts. What exactly needs to be in the pictures for a judge to render verdict can vary, and will also depend on what other evidence is available.

 

[Ernest Chay]

@dafluff You had been extremely helpful. Thank you so much. I felt I have some explanation to do before my next question.

I met her in August 2017. I am still legally married, till today. 15 years, two children, 13 and 9. I am not trying to justify my sin but my wife refuses to have sex for ten years now. Being in a Ioveless marriage somehow seemed to be the perfect excuse to cheat.

My gf just left an abusive bf so we just clicked. I know I made a huge mistake and I am now suffering the consequences.

I made her pregnant in April 2018 and she chose to go back home for abortion. Her home town is not in Jakarta but she had worked there before. This is where the monster came into the picture. They knew each other since 2014. He was attentive and kind to her, even offered to take care of the baby.

She still went through with the abortion and she said she nearly lost her life. He was taking care of her the whole time. I think she was very touched but she did not cheat on me. In early 2019, he claimed that the clinic was raided and she was very scared that her records will be found. According to him, he settled the matter with the police for her.

This whole episode made her extremely grateful to this person and even agreed to marry him. I choose to think she was brainwashed and caught in a weak moment but every time when I think back the lies she told me, I wish someone would just take a samurai sword and slice me into half. I have never felt this piercing pain from such betrayal before.

She said she is going back for three days to settle the legal document for the house she paid off in August 2019. I trusted her 100%. I even paid for the air tickets and gave her a small sum of money. Honestly, I dont wanna sound like a loser.... I did think of killing myself when I just found out....but I am a father of two young kids, I just have to stand back up, somehow.

She called me four days back, said he slapped her and threw an ashtray at her on Sunday night... I havnt heard from her since.

My next and most probably last question is, @dafluff sir, what is the legal implication for having an abortion in Indo? I guess this guy has been gathering evidence against her since the abortion in 2018 to gain control over her. Can evidence gathered by illegal means, eg. illegal hacking software, duress, threat, etc, be used in court?

I did not expect so many replies and kind advices and I sincerely thank you all. I wish I have the strength to let go, but I cant.

 

[El_Goretto]

Nothing will come from the abortion, it's water under the bridge and can't be proved.

 

[Balifrog]

Ernest, mate, I have seen "complicated" dramas like yours many, many times all over Asia in over 25 years.
Drop it, forget her, get over it, go out a bit and stop torturing yourself, because nothing good will come out of it, best case you end up broke, worst case mentally destroyed.
Allow me to add that the money you have spend / still spend on this mistress (because technically that is what she is) would be better spend on your 2 kids considering their age !
Be patient a few more years till they are 18+ and more or less able to manage their lives, then you can make the decision of starting a new life.
Meanwhile if you want to get laid, SGP offers all options in that domain.

Your life, you money, your choice but your first priority is preparing the future of your kids.
Saddle up and get in control !

 

[harryopal1]

@dafluff ".... I did think of killing myself when I just found out....but I am a father of two young kids, I just have to stand back up, somehow."

Suicide would be a terrible legacy to leave with your children.

 

[fastpitch17]

You said first she returned with the promise if divorce and now to settle a house. If a Muslim marrage she needs to go to the KUA and file for divorce and tell them he is abusive physically. Then get out if she is in fact married.

You never answered as to how much you have invested in her and your relationship.

No matter what I stand by the advise that she get out.

 

[Ernest Chay]

You said first she returned with the promise if divorce and now to settle a house. If a Muslim marrage she needs to go to the KUA and file for divorce and tell them he is abusive physically. Then get out if she is in fact married.

You never answered as to how much you have invested in her and your relationship.

No matter what I stand by the advise that she get out.

She lied about the house in Aug 2019 which in fact she went back to get married.

I understand your point but she does not.....ignorance and anxiety is a unfortunate combination for a weak woman living in fear and abuse. I hope I am wrong.

 

[Will_M]

I really think you need to take a step back and look at the situation. If your friend came to you with an issue similar to your predicament, what advice would you give him ?

 

[melvintee]

From one singaporean to another, get a grip of the situation, leave her and focus on your children.

 

[macvert]

From one singaporean to another, get a grip of the situation, leave her and focus on your children.

Or to put it a slightly different way ..... let her leave you & focus on your children

 

[snpark]

Or "Man up"

 

[macvert]

A mate of mine's father got ripped off of the family's life savings & committed suicide, that mate of mine was married with kids & exactly 1 year to the day my mate did the same thing & that is not the only instance I personally know of suicide running in families, do you want your kids to be in that state of mind Ernest? Like Harry said. "a terrible legacy to leave your children".

 

[William King]

If this story is true, you need to follow the sound advice here on this thread and forget it. She lied and got married while being a mistress to you. And you are still married too? The makings of a sinetron series right there!

 

[dafluff]

My next and most probably last question is, @dafluff sir, what is the legal implication for having an abortion in Indo? I guess this guy has been gathering evidence against her since the abortion in 2018 to gain control over her. Can evidence gathered by illegal means, eg. illegal hacking software, duress, threat, etc, be used in court?

Abortion, except for a very limited set of circumstances is illegal in Indonesia. I do not know under what circumstances the abortion took place, but if it was illegal, the clinic would be insane to keep records.

As for evidence, only legally obtained evidence is admissible in court in Indonesia. However, the system in practice is not as...rigorous, in determining this. Anything more I say on this would be speculation.

Anyway, as more details come out, this story is becoming more circuitous than a Korean drama. My final comment on this for you is this: If any of this is even remotely true, then you should strongly consider that you mean to her much less than she means to you.

In your shoes, I would count my blessings that an exit has been provided.

 

[fastpitch17]

You are in Singapore. Bataam is full of future mistresses if you are looking for someone to support. I'm sure you can find one that will tell you everything you want to hear and show you good time, for a bit extra of course.

Since you have avoided answering how much this, oh, so in love, but, cost you, I would guess that trips to Bataam and helping to support a working girl would be a lot less. At least you will get something fir your money that should probably be spent in your own family but, oh well.

 

[Ernest Chay]

What I have posted here is 100% true. I am not rich. I did not touch on the subject of money because I felt that 500 sgd on average per mth is not an unreasonable amount to spend on a gf's spending money.

I guess I am attracting a lot of negative reviews on this matter, simply by not giving up till this point. Dont get me wrong, I know I deserve a slap in the head. But I felt responsible, for making her pregnant, for not being there when she needed me the most. For the first few months of our relationship, I lied to her I am divorced. The very moment I chose to disclose it was to hurt her, when I was jealous about her past relationship.

Another reason why I am so sure this isnt about money is, the monster is not rich. He is a technician, shorter than her with average looks. I know I am giving myself excuses to hold on to something most deemed a lost cause, but as bro fastpitch17 puts it, oh well.

Doing nothing all day, chain smoking and just waiting for her call is indeed torturing and destructive. I know I will stand back up, some day, some how. Thank you all for your kind and equally effective not so kind messages.

 

[Balifrog]

I am not rich. I did not touch on the subject of money because I felt that 500 sgd on average per mth is not an unreasonable amount to spend on a gf's spending money.

Depends on your income..500 out of 3500 or 500 out of 10.000 doesn't "hurt" the same way.

All the best, hoping you see the light .