Anyone Care To Fly United Airlines

[Davita]

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Did you clap after the landing?

I did...but it wasn't in applause ..it was to get some circulation back into my white knuckles...

 

[Daniel50]

I read this article a 10 year old boy was bumped by Air Canada so the family missed their vacation. Yet the airlines do not want to give up their cash cow of overbooking and they will swear up and down it is not an issue. They spin it so they are actually benefiting the customers by keeping rates low, ya sure or keeping profits up.

http://globalnews.ca/news/3384054/a...ng-10-year-old-boy-from-flight-to-costa-rica/

 

[Anglian]

You got in one Davita, airlines have only one aim in life and that's 1st profit, 2nd profit and so on, the closer the seats more profit, pay exhorbitant prices for low quality meals, I foolishly bought a bag of crisps on AirAsia, it was all puffed up, when I opened it , it had 12 crisps inside, when I worked for BA the key word was profit, never much about pax comfort

 

[jstar]

Of course the biggies need to compete with all these low cost newcomers. Still, an approach by Lion (Batik) and reversely SQ (Silk Air), Garuda (CitiLink), Virgin Atlantic and Lufthansa (Germanwings) for instance, might work well; create a more luxurious and a cheaper version. Both have their own clientèle.

Having misery class (eh, Basic Economy) in one and the same flight as the better seats, doesn't seem to work so well. For the customers' satisfaction that is, of course the profits on Economy Plus etc. can be huge.

 

[Daniel50]

A short video explaining the business model behind overbooking. Some people who understand the model are still able to ask the simple question: is it ever ethical to sell one product twice? I would say no.

http://video.dailymail.co.uk/video/...141983304/640x360_MP4_4219144262141983304.mp4

 

[Davita]

You got in one Davita, airlines have only one aim in life and that's 1st profit, 2nd profit and so on, the closer the seats more profit, pay exhorbitant prices for low quality meals, I foolishly bought a bag of crisps on AirAsia, it was all puffed up, when I opened it , it had 12 crisps inside, when I worked for BA the key word was profit, never much about pax comfort

Tell me any airline, or any other company (including crisp manufacturers), not interested in profit and I'll show a company going bankrupt.
Many countries use public funds to subsidize flag-waving airlines. BA used to be one 'till Maggie delisted it from the public purse....but she also forgave any debt it carried over.
There is a fine balance between maintaining company value and passenger comfort features.
Freddie Laker/Branson/Ryan and Tony Fernandes proved that many people would rather endure, and pay cheap, than splash out on airline travel. That's why we have a many-tiered structure from first-class to economy and now to bottom-line budget travel.
People would rather spend money on a fancy suitcase than pay for a ticket with a reasonable comfort expectation....they are happy to pay little but expect a lot....due to false advertising.

In reality...airline travel has never been cheaper nor better value.

edit: I read many here saying airlines make big profits...I challenge to show where any airline is making big profits. They got lucky recently with the collapse of the oil price. Excepting that.... many airlines today would have been out of business.
It is one of the least profitable sectors in any stock portfolio...better buy health-care stocks...or pharmaceutical companies.

 

[jstar]

Huh? I have not seen anybody stating that airlines make big profits.

On the contrary, there are probably the most (necessary) mergers and cost cuttings and (almost) bankruptcies in that particular sector. Think the most recent one is Alitalia. But also see what happened with Lufthansa/Swiss/Brussels Airlines or KLM/Air France, etc. etc.

So think most will agree with you.

 

[Daniel50]

So what if airlines weren't allowed to use overbooking? I suppose nobody would fly anymore? I suppose this would officially be the end of all air travel? I suppose nobody would be able to innovate the system to adjust. Well if that is the case, then overbooking should continue because I for one will still need to get somewhere. (It is not just airlines using this business model, not for profits of course but to make things better for their customers).



I have a table for sale I have asked Davita and sold it to him but I got to thinking he may not pick it up. Okay 4% chance he may not pick it up. I don't see any problem selling the same table to jstar. If Davita does happen to get here, for the table, I can explain that a more "important" customer (one who has more prior purchases) has shown up therefore I have sold it to him. There should be no problem right, especially if I refund him for part of the table. Like that family who flew Air Canada and he had to bargain with them to get his compensation increased but it still did not cover the cost of his lost vacation. All sounds fair, I don't see any problem here.

 

[Davita]

1. So what if airlines weren't allowed to use overbooking? I suppose nobody would fly anymore? I suppose this would officially be the end of all air travel? I suppose nobody would be able to innovate the system to adjust. Well if that is the case, then overbooking should continue because I for one will still need to get somewhere. (It is not just airlines using this business model, not for profits of course but to make things better for their customers).

2. I have a table for sale I have asked Davita and sold it to him but I got to thinking he may not pick it up. Okay 4% chance he may not pick it up. I don't see any problem selling the same table to jstar. If Davita does happen to get here, for the table, I can explain that a more "important" customer (one who has more prior purchases) has shown up therefore I have sold it to him. There should be no problem right, especially if I refund him for part of the table. Like that family who flew Air Canada and he had to bargain with them to get his compensation increased but it still did not cover the cost of his lost vacation. All sounds fair, I don't see any problem here.

1. I for one would love the airlines to get rid of overbooking...but it will take a regulatory authority to manage that. It's unreasonable, in this age of competition, to expect any individual airline to go it alone.

2. There's a lesson here...never buy a table from Daniel...

 

[Davita]

Huh? I have not seen anybody stating that airlines make big profits.

Sorry...must have read that being said or implied elsewhere but I'm happy you think most agree with me.

 

[jstar]

I can understand if David is still not sure whether he wants the table, you tell him you sell it without reserving it for him if you get another potential buyer. And if I buy the table in the mean time, bad luck for him.

But you can't really sell the table to both of us. And make us pay for it. And when we both come to pick it up, tell one of us that we have an issue...

 

[Daniel50]

I think this whole issue is part of a bigger picture of people often feeling powerless over real, or perceived, corporate greed. People feeling like they are working harder and getting squeezed more at every turn. Also, overbooking is a way for companies to "maximize" their resources including human/employees (I am not saying you want employees just sitting around but it is draining dealing with more stressed angry customers). With maximum stress for employees being sometimes translated to a less caring/empathetic group of employees a more us (employee) vs them (the customer) siege mentality. I think people should try to push back against this but everyone knows where the power lies. It takes something big like a man being beaten and dragged off a flight to get some action. But the airlines are defending overbooking to the end. I hope people keep reporting these abuses and pushing for change. Sorry but I don't see airlines ceasing to exist (tight profit margins) without overbooking.

 

[R Cameron]

Sorry...must have read that being said or implied elsewhere but I'm happy you think most agree with me.

I won't pretend to understand it, but airline profits has been a regular part of the news coverage about this United incident, particularly that United made $2.X billion last year. I also find it interesting that Warren Buffett has been putting billions into airlines in the past year: http://www.businessinsider.com/warren-buffett-10-billion-airline-investments-reveal-2017-2

 

[R Cameron]

I think this whole issue is part of a bigger picture of people often feeling powerless over real, or perceived, corporate greed. People feeling like they are working harder and getting squeezed more at every turn.

I think you're absolutely right.

I have no problem with airlines overbooking, the part that becomes problematic for me is them also having the ability involuntarily bump people because of overbooking. They should have to keep bidding for the seat until someone gives it up voluntarily, even if it occasionally costs them $10,000 they can simply add the estimated cost into the algorithms they are already using to determine how much to overbook. As it stands now they are able to make their customers pay for the company's mistakes.

 

[Davita]

I won't pretend to understand it, but airline profits has been a regular part of the news coverage about this United incident, particularly that United made $2.X billion last year. I also find it interesting that Warren Buffett has been putting billions into airlines in the past year: http://www.businessinsider.com/warren-buffett-10-billion-airline-investments-reveal-2017-2

the link also says about Warren Buffet....The is a striking about-face for the legendary investor who, at his company’s 2013 annual meeting, called the airline industry a “death trap for investors.â€
So, what’s changed?
First, the price of crude oil is 50% cheaper in 2017 than it was in 2013.

That is what I suggested in a previous post. If the oil price were to go up again it would be a disaster for some airlines. Cathay Pacific made a major error in forward-buying its jetfuel last year and paid heavily in its profit margin.

Link: http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/...t-oil-prices-leads-hk109-surcharge-cathay-and

 

[jstar]

Damned if you do damned if you don't.

 

[Daniel50]

This story has pretty much died. Things trend and get pushed out for new stories pretty quick. This story may be stretching things, it calls it a PR disaster that a giant rabbit died on board a United Airlines flight. I thought it would actually make the world a bit safer.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligence...faces-pr-disaster-after-giant-bunny-dies.html

 

[jstar]

Talking about huge bunnies:

There is a mixed Belgian / Indonesian couple in Yogya, who have a B&B and kos for rent. They took a Flemish Giant with them. But it recently died.

 

[Anglian]

This story has pretty much died. Things trend and get pushed out for new stories pretty quick. This story may be stretching things, it calls it a PR disaster that a giant rabbit died on board a United Airlines flight. I thought it would actually make the world a bit safer.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligence...faces-pr-disaster-after-giant-bunny-dies.html

I suppose normally this wouldn't be reported, but very sad for some little kids pet bunny deceased, what do you tell the kid. What else can United screw up

 

[Davita]

Methinks the rabbit died from humiliation and shame.

How in the world could it's owner send such a celebrity rabbit cargo-class on UNITED!!!!....should have been in a velvet padded box safely seated in first-class on a reputable airline, with lettuce and carrots served on a silver platter.

This story is analogous to any one of the Kardashians (including Rob, Caitlin, Scot and some basketball BBD) being welcomed into a Nevada whore-house as colleagues or clients.....
if I were a Nevada 'pro' I'd be humiliated and shamed.:lol: