5yr second home visa

I think this is being a bit dramatic. Are you suggesting a government bank in Indonesia will "nick" your money? Thats rediculous.

Also if its put into some kind of long term investment program within the bank, it could be worth quite a bit more in 10 to 15 years, providing that there is not another crash of the rupiah again. Rupiah interest rates are better than many other currencies.
Some of the biggest failures in Indonesia have been in the banking sector. These were mainly caused by corruption.

I have not seen anything on in which type account this cash would be deposited. I doubt it would be something that has a higher rate of interest than a normal account if interest bearing at all.
 
Some of the biggest failures in Indonesia have been in the banking sector. These were mainly caused by corruption.

I have not seen anything on in which type account this cash would be deposited. I doubt it would be something that has a higher rate of interest than a normal account if interest bearing at all.
At 30 juta a pop for the visa, any interest you did make would be eat up quickly.
 
I think this is being a bit dramatic. Are you suggesting a government bank in Indonesia will "nick" your money? Thats rediculous.

Also if its put into some kind of long term investment program within the bank, it could be worth quite a bit more in 10 to 15 years, providing that there is not another crash of the rupiah again. Rupiah interest rates are better than many other currencies.
The use of "nicked" was a bit tongue in cheek. But remember Indonesia has a history of bank failures.
Depreciation : even with a 3% interest rate (minus 30% tax, remains 2%), your capital will depreciate condidering the inflation is much higher than 2 or 3%.
Plenty simulation websites around, give it a try
 
Cyprus bank crisis. Anything above 100k USD was heavily taxed, if not confiscated.
 
I don’t think for one second it would be unsafe to park money on an account of a governmental bank here. But indeed, it would not generate any new money.

Perhaps there are possibilities within the bank to get something more, I wouldn’t be surprised if they allow a deposito or so. But even then; currently deposito interest rates at Bank Mandiri and BRI are still in the 2% to 3% range. Bank Mandiri for instance, was recently 2.25% (yearly) for the 1 and 3-month, and 2.50% for a 6-month as well as the 12 and 24 months. And then minus 20% tax (not 30).

If you keep the 2 billion somewhere else, assuming you get a total of 4% net, it would mean approx. $2,600 (€2.400, £2,160) extra. Per year. With that you can get quite some trips to Singapore or KL to renew or extensions.
 
If you keep the 2 billion somewhere else, assuming you get a total of 4% net, it would mean approx. $2,600 (€2.400, £2,160) extra. Per year. With that you can get quite some trips to Singapore or KL to renew or extensions
You don't get 4% in the government banks.
Even if, it would be 3,2% net (4 minus 20%).
Inflation eats your capital up....

"
Indonesia’s Statistical Agency (or BPS) announced that December 2022 inflation reached 0.66 percent month-on-month (m/m), higher than our forecast of around 0.50 percent.
It also means we now have the full 2022 inflation figure for Indonesia: 5.51 percent year-on-year (y/y). "


But still less loss than in USA, UK or EU where inflation runs between 6 and 10% !
 
If you keep the 2 billion somewhere else

You don't get 4% in the government banks.

What do you think ‘somewhere else’ means? Didn’t I say Mandiri/BRI offers 2,25-2,5%? But a 4% net is extremely easy now in other places.

There are no traditional savings formulas that can make up for a 8-10% inflation rate. Nowhere. And that begs the question what someone will do with 2 billion lying around. Even real estate or gold is not that safe and currently won’t offer that yield, even in times of war.
 
Wonder if they'd allow govt bonds. I mean that's investing in the government. Safe. And pays +5%
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yeah be great if they allow the gov bond investment as part of the visa - they possibly wont because the value of the bond can decrease sometimes (like a few months ago - so your 2 b investment might not always be 2 b).
I believe they said IDR2b in Bank owned by the government as this is the limit guaranteed by the Indonesian government under Deposit guarantee Schemes, Lembaga Penjamin Simpanan (LPS).
Unlike savings, the bond valued of IDR2b today could worth less in five or ten years. But it could also increase if it is sold before maturity.
 
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Bonds value vary with interest rates.

For a 5% bond to go down in value, interest rates would need to be higher than 5%. Unlikely to happen in the short term.
 
According to Forbes: traders on Wall Street are prepared for another rate increase in February that could bring the FFR range up to 4.5 and 4.75 percent if the Fed opts for a .25 percent bump like they did in December. With the latest jobs report showing continued strength in the labor market, a half-point increase is not out of the question. The Federal Reserve’s projections released after their December meeting showed that in 2023 the bank expects the FFR to average around 5.1 percent.
 
If the 2nd Home visa doesn't pull the number of applicants as hoped then what next, I wonder. I also wonder what kind of cash flows are involved with the Russians coming to avoid call up for the Ukraine war and what kind of visas will enable to stay long termish.
 
I believe they said IDR2b in Bank owned by the government as this is the limit guaranteed by the Indonesian government under Deposit guarantee Schemes, Lembaga Penjamin Simpanan (LPS).
Unlike savings, the bond valued of IDR2b today could worth less in five or ten years. But it could also increase if it is sold before maturity.

Do you really trust the bank or the government NOT to get sticky fingers?

There is a story somewhere floating around about bonds(maybe it was Dan who shared the story) and long story short, the bonds were worthless.
 
Do you really trust the bank or the government NOT to get sticky fingers?

There is a story somewhere floating around about bonds(maybe it was Dan who shared the story) and long story short, the bonds were worthless.
I trust some governments more than others but suffice it to say that I won't be purchasing any bonds here.
 
Do you really trust the bank or the government NOT to get sticky fingers?

There is a story somewhere floating around about bonds (maybe it was Dan who shared the story) and long story short, the bonds were worthless.

Well, I never say there is no sticky fingers propensity. Like I and other people have said many of the largest graft cases in Indonesia are involving bankers, or the like. I do not think the banks as institutions themselves; however the history has shown, it could be individuals, people working in the banking industries colluding with other parties. If the law makers, police, the prosecutors, judges are colluding what left for justice ?
The good examples are: ASABRI, Jiwasraya, Century Bank, Bali Bank, Jamsostek, or the most recent one Indosurya (recent judgement). In the past similar cases to Indosurya involving cooperative initiative, involving illegal bankers such as Koperasi Langit Biru KLB IDR6T, Koperasi Cipaganti IDR 3.2T, Koperasi Pandawa IDR 3.3T. All of these mega graft cases are involving bankers or the like such as illegal bankers using Cooperative Initiative colluding with other parties.

In Indonesia, there is IDR2b guaranteed by LPS but people might be more creative in syphoning those money instead of using the deposit guaranteed scheme to pay the depositors. The things like the victims of ponzi pyramid scheme Binary trading, Robo trading who are offered legos, cryptos or it could be bogus investment that have very little value (if any). But considering it is only IDR2b guaranteed there are always money available to pay back. But political and corruption risk could come into equation where those money resting in LPS which supposed to pay back to the depositors could be diverted to other means. But that risk might be smaller than the previous cases. Even there is not enough money left in LPS, the indonesian government will be thinking twice not to pay their obligation considering international community, the institutional lenders, international credit rating agencies are watching and might get involved. These might lead to the unrepairable reputational damage.

Regarding bonds, if it is treasury Bonds, Gilts issued in the developed world, the chance it will be worthless is extremely small. Unless those countries cease to exist or become failed states. They offer lower return than equity but more secure and less volatile. That is why some people especially those who who want to minimise the risk (apart from inflationary risk) still invest in it.
If it is held until maturity you will always get at least the face value of those bonds. But I personally prefer a high risk high reward play, so never have interest in investing in Bonds. I prefer to put it into sort term saving waiting allocation to equity. The major risk of Treasury Bonds, Gilts are inflationary risk. The purchasing power of your money will worth less in ten years (say).
This is a pro and Contra about investing in bonds
 
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