Shortage of 498,000 teachers in Indonesia next year?

Or Spanish Arabic and yes a Chinese language.

In the 80's I did French Latin Greek from age 6-
German 13-16
Physics Biology Chemistry Geography History Scripture Art Woodwork Home Economics
PE daily
Plus the basics Maths English Drama etc

I boarded at a military school in Surrey for kids of RAF parents. Best years of my life.

Interesting to see recently my IG algorithm take me to some videos of Christs Hospital school whom we played at sports. Famous for their amazing uniform very old historic long coats and then reading the comments about it.

Anyway in hindsight perhaps Greek and Latin not as relevant as today although Latin is good for crosswords lol

Caesar sic in omnibus

Get well soon to Caesar
 
harryopal1 said:
While a national effort to teach French may have an advantage with French/Indonesian relations it would be much more realistic to teach Mandarin.
Click to expand...
Ja, English language and Chinese language are the logical investments of classroom time and education budgets.

The countless hours spent on Arabic amazes me. Just imagine how many fluent Japanese / Korean / Chinese / English speakers Indonesia would have if just 50% of those Arabic language studies were dedicated to their acquisition. 📚 📖
 
And ironically there is not a generic Arabic language. Egyptian and Yemen and Lebanese and Gulf Arabic etc etc all have differences. Even the Bedouin in UAE speak slightly differently.
 
snpark said:
And ironically there is not a generic Arabic language. Egyptian and Yemen and Lebanese and Gulf Arabic etc etc all have differences. Even the Bedouin in UAE speak slightly differently.
Click to expand...
But the old Arabic in the Quran has not changed and I imagine that is what most people are learning.
 
Balifrog said:
I suppose so....in an islamic school it seems logic.

Not sure it's very usefull in daily life...🙄🙄
Click to expand...
Learning langauages is not just about usefulness, it is about the love of and beauty of the language. Not much point for anyone to learn French in Indonesia , they choose to, same with German, they choose to- often it is because the student has a love of the language or plans to pursue an academic career in the country that uses the language.
Some people choose to learn music- is there any use at all to that? Cooking poncey food has no actual use, people choose to learn it- because they want to. Same with anything.
 
Bad_azz said:
Learning langauages is not just about usefulness, it is about the love of and beauty of the language. Not much point for anyone to learn French in Indonesia , they choose to, same with German, they choose to- often it is because the student has a love of the language or plans to pursue an academic career in the country that uses the language.
Some people choose to learn music- is there any use at all to that? Cooking poncey food has no actual use, people choose to learn it- because they want to. Same with anything.
Click to expand...
Hola, hola.....🤣🤣🤣🤣,
That made me laugh...
I was educated in Belgium. Dad was Flemish.
First language : Flamish (the national language). But as the Belgian government was not stupid, and knew only very few people spoke it (Belgians, Dutch and a few Zuid Afrikaaners), they imposed 2 other languages.
English mandatory from young age, as it is the main international language.
Next choice between French and German. Historic reasons, the South of Belgium used to be French .
German because the regions of Eupen and Malmedy used to be German but were handed over to the Belgians by the Treaty of Versailles in 1919.

I continued English all my life as I travelled the world from 18 till now (73).
I learned a bit of German, Korean and Thai when working there mainly to converse with my staff. But I pushed them hard to learn technical English, indeed technical brochures at the time where mainly in the manufacturer's language and in English.

My ex wife studied French (in France), because her 2 sisters studied English (UK) and she wanted to be different. She is now private French teacher. My 3 kids speak/read fluent English, French and Thai. Plus Spanish for the eldest one.
And the Thai part is nit to pray in the temple...

Language has to have a rational use. For anybody who want to be in international commerce or hospitality English is mandatory. Chinese next.

I declared music and gym completely useless in school. Ok, I admit I am in admiration in front of Dire Straits or AC/D ..

"Poncey" food 🙄🙄🤣🤣🤣, coming from a Brit I am not surprised.
For us it is standard daily food, that our parents and grand parents served us every day. And I will never touch the sh*te I see in some local warungs, or a 15k Bakso...🤮🤮

Concerning the beauty of a Language, well spoken English or French is certainly nicer to listen at than Indonesian. Most of the girls here sound like loud ducks. That goes for mine as well.... Hence we speak English (neutral territory), and I have ZERO interest in understanding the local gossip, which makes up 80% of their conversations....🙄😁😁

Ho, and don't start me on "sports bar Australian" as a "language" ......

EDIT : Note that I "think" my subject in English and write it directly in English.
No use of Google translate.
It is the only way to "integrate" in a language and the mind / mentality of the native speakers of any language.
 
Last edited:
They are not learning Arabic to be able to speak to Arabic people, they are learning it to be able to say the prayers. I assume they say the prayers in a strong Indonesian accent, so God might not be able to understand them anyway, unless he is using some form of Google translate.
Listening to the screaming noise pollution in that language everyday through distorted loudspeakers is enough to put one off learning it for life. It sounds even uglier than German.
 
Balifrog said:
Hola, hola.....🤣🤣🤣🤣,
That made me laugh...
I was educated in Belgium. Dad was Flemish.
First language : Flamish (the national language). But as the Belgian government was not stupid, and knew only very few people spoke it (Belgians, Dutch and a few Zuid Afrikaaners), they imposed 2 other languages.
English mandatory from young age, as it is the main international language.
Next choice between French and German. Historic reasons, the South of Belgium used to be French .
German because the regions of Eupen and Malmedy used to be German but were handed over to the Belgians by the Treaty of Versailles in 1919.

I continued English all my life as I travelled the world from 18 till now (73).
I learned a bit of German, Korean and Thai when working there mainly to converse with my staff. But I pushed them hard to learn technical English, indeed technical brochures at the time where mainly in the manufacturer's language and in English.

My ex wife studied French (in France), because her 2 sisters studied English (UK) and she wanted to be different. She is now private French teacher. My 3 kids speak/read fluent English, French and Thai. Plus Spanish for the eldest one.
And the Thai part is nit to pray in the temple...

Language has to have a rational use. For anybody who want to be in international commerce or hospitality English is mandatory. Chinese next.

I declared music and gym completely useless in school. Ok, I admit I am in admiration in front of Dire Straits or AC/D ..

"Poncey" food 🙄🙄🤣🤣🤣, coming from a Brit I am not surprised.
For us it is standard daily food, that our parents and grand parents served us every day. And I will never touch the sh*te I see in some local warungs, or a 15k Bakso...🤮🤮

Concerning the beauty of a Language, well spoken English or French is certainly nicer to listen at than Indonesian. Most of the girls here sound like loud ducks. That goes for mine as well.... Hence we speak English (neutral territory), and I have ZERO interest in understanding the local gossip, which makes up 80% of their conversations....🙄😁😁

Ho, and don't start me on "sports bar Australian" as a "language" ......

EDIT : Note that I "think" my subject in English and write it directly in English.
No use of Google translate.
It is the only way to "integrate" in a language and the mind / mentality of the native speakers of any language.
Click to expand...
"....Ho, and don't start me on "sports bar Australian" as a "language" ......"

Stone the crows, Mate. What's wrong with speaking Strine? Bloody hell. Only a flaming drongo would say something like that. Fair crack of the whip. May all your chickens turn into emus and kick down your dunny door.
 
Bad_azz said:
Learning langauages is not just about usefulness, it is about the love of and beauty of the language. Not much point for anyone to learn French in Indonesia , they choose to, same with German, they choose to- often it is because the student has a love of the language or plans to pursue an academic career in the country that uses the language.
Some people choose to learn music- is there any use at all to that? Cooking poncey food has no actual use, people choose to learn it- because they want to. Same with anything.
Click to expand...
One wonders how many young learners here in Indo are experiencing Arabic language courses (as opposed to "studying" or actually "learning") for the love and beauty of the language.:cool:

It would be wonderful to see the interests of the children being put first. WASTING decades of life enduring ridiculous indoctrination* is common around the world, but a developing country needs to 'play catch up'. They must fast track these young people to take on the future, generally speaking. (I love history but I'm not going to memorize facts & figures about the dead...I can find the data in seconds if I need to.)

Of course, electives should always be offered even if only to give the illusion of 'freedom' or 'student ownership', but Indonesian authorities must act as if they are genuinely free rather than just shouting 'merdeka' and following the same exact style of brain-numbing and rigid colonial education.
This text should be in the hands of every administrator of every school in the country. Indonesia will never catch up or break out of the middle income trap while they work at the same speed as they are now.#


*I'm not referring specifically to any subject, just curriculum across the board. "Memorizing - Reciting - then Forgetting."

#If an individual or a group is years behind, they must necessarily speed up in order to eventually catch up to the leader(s), yes? Moving at the same speed will only close the gap if the leader(s) slow down.
 
serious_fun said:
One wonders how many young learners here in Indo are experiencing Arabic language courses (as opposed to "studying" or actually "learning") for the love and beauty of the language.:cool:

It would be wonderful to see the interests of the children being put first. WASTING decades of life enduring ridiculous indoctrination* is common around the world, but a developing country needs to 'play catch up'. They must fast track these young people to take on the future, generally speaking. (I love history but I'm not going to memorize facts & figures about the dead...I can find the data in seconds if I need to.)

Of course, electives should always be offered even if only to give the illusion of 'freedom' or 'student ownership', but Indonesian authorities must act as if they are genuinely free rather than just shouting 'merdeka' and following the same exact style of brain-numbing and rigid colonial education.
This text should be in the hands of every administrator of every school in the country. Indonesia will never catch up or break out of the middle income trap while they work at the same speed as they are now.#


*I'm not referring specifically to any subject, just curriculum across the board. "Memorizing - Reciting - then Forgetting."

#If an individual or a group is years behind, they must necessarily speed up in order to eventually catch up to the leader(s), yes? Moving at the same speed will only close the gap if the leader(s) slow down.
Click to expand...
Very well resumed !
 
serious_fun said:
yes, but is it not the case that there are many non-Arabic words in the Quran?

Not trying to be oppositional, just sayin'... :sneaky:
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what you mean. The Quran was written in the Arabic of the time. It would have been the language they were using so how can it be non-Arabic?
 
Hawk256 said:
I'm not sure what you mean. The Quran was written in the Arabic of the time. It would have been the language they were using so how can it be non-Arabic?
Click to expand...
The official narrative (the Quran itself) is that the Quran was 'revealed' in 'clear Arabic language' and this was a 'divine choice' which 'must be preserved'...but experts have identified many non-Arabic words , perhaps as many as 300.

Of course this is controversial for some and has created differing schools of thought.

IMHO the 'Arabic only' position reveals an exclusive and chauvinistic nature rather than a loving and accepting doctrine. Just my opinion.
 
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