Bali Traffic Police Corruption

[Vanhelsing]

I don't know how many times I've been stopped by Bali Police on my scooter for fictitious traffic violations or at one of their road blocks. The correct procedure of fining is for you to be issued a ticket with you then having to go to a BNI (or BCA I can't remember) bank and deposit the fine which last I heard was about 40 000 rupiah. The threat of having to appear in court is simply used as intimidation so you will fork over the 100 000 - 1.5 juta (yes I've seen someone pay 1.5) on the spot.

The following beer drinking admissions by the the officer as to how many tourists he's stopped today and much money he makes is insightful to say the least.

Hilarious but true.

 

[jstar]

Yeah, we discussed this extensively three years ago.

This was a Dutch camera crew of a program called 'conned abroad'. Their aim was to expose the shady tactics to sell time-sharing to tourists on the island. (Which you have everywhere in the world.) And also to cover the fraud by money changers.

He states in Dutch: "I have no idea what I did wrong" and you see him driving around without helmet and driver license. (Try that in Holland!)

I don't like these infotainment programs. It's all about spectacle and the shock effect. Van der Spek got a lot of bad rap for this in The Netherlands. (Where 'baiting' by law enforcement is not legal btw.)

They knew they needed a 'film permit' but according to themselves didn't apply for one since they did not want to take the risk of having anybody looking over their shoulder (as it would be in the USSR forty years ago).

Besides the $20 traffic incident it was a $200 bribe, so it was about not having pre-approval for filming in the country for commercial purposes and broadcasting. This approval takes two weeks to get at the embassy.
[sic]

 

[fastpitch17]

Yeah, we discussed this extensively three years ago.

Yeah, we sure did. Three years ago.

 

[Vanhelsing]

Well, I guess if you guys have discussed it on another forum, there's no room for it here then.

You have my apologies.

 

[jstar]

We did not say that. But the video does not have so much to do with (your) traffic misdemeanors and is something from three years ago. With a rather different background than you (seem to) think.

But if you want to discuss those traffic 'fines', fine; I would be urged to say first, I think it is absurd so many bule think it is completely normal to drive around without helmet and front light. Going against traffic on Sunset. And they are proud it will 'only' cost them 50.000 rupiah when caught.

Last week I saw a western girl fall. She was luckily not badly hurt. (But scrapes and abrasions from aspal are very painful.) Helping her and understanding where she came from, I am 200% sure that she has no motorcycle in her home country. (Even if she has a driver license which came with the car license.) And then she will only have experience with 30 and 50 cc mopeds and motorcycles, not with a 125 cc.

 

[El_Goretto]

But if you want to discuss those traffic 'fines', fine; I would be urged to say first, I think it is absurd so many bule think it is completely normal to drive around without helmet and front light. Going against traffic on Sunset. And they are proud it will 'only' cost them 50.000 rupiah when caught.

This! So much this!

I absolutely hate this mentality that some tourists have that they can just come to Bali and do whatever the fuck they want and brag about it.

"I love Bali because there are no rules" is a common theme in comments on FB about Bali and drives me crazy.

It's the same tourists who look down on Indonesians but what they fail to understand is that the chaos on the roads is not due to "being Indonesian", it's due to a lack of enforcement. These tourists prove it that no matter where you come from, human beings will run amok without the stick.

 

[El_Goretto]

Well, I guess if you guys have discussed it on another forum, there's no room for it here then.

You have my apologies.

Nah, it's cool, we can talk about it here.

In fact, maybe we can try to see what has changed in regards to petty corruption in the police in the last 3 years.

I'd like to say that in Jakarta, at least, there is raising awareness that you can simply admit your fault for a traffic violation and simply go pay the small fine at the ATM, like you described. But I'm not sure if I've noticed "less petty corruption" or if what I'm seeing is simply what I want to see.

Thoughts?

 

[jstar]

Of course the motorcycles still are the easy prey. And honestly, the word prey might be too negative. In Jakarta, there are definitely good reasons to be stopped and the violations are not fictitious. Use of the center lane next to the Busway is a popular thing to do. Also, no light, no helmet, no driver license (very young kids), no up to date registration taxes, are all very easy to spot from the roadside. And a hoop net (like a basket trap) is not so difficult to apply without disturbing the rest of the traffic.

There has been a lot of coverage on the local TV stations lately, about an action and effort of the police to avoid bribes and have people pay the official fine. (Even with blurred hidden cameras.) Of course in many cases this doesn't work yet, the drivers still pay.

But it is also a bit of a structural problem, since the police officers had to invest quite some money to get hired. Of course that needs to be recuperated.

 

[Vanhelsing]

My biggest issue is the fictitious traffic offenses created by police to use against me. Offenses like my front wheel going over the white line at the traffic lights while stopped, or venturing into the on coming traffic lane. Although these manufactured traffic violations are blatant falsehoods, there's little one can do when the keys to your scooter have been ripped out and in possession of the officer. You know you ain't getting your scooter back until you cough up the dough.

 

[Euc-]

Of course the motorcycles still are the easy prey. And honestly, the word prey might be too negative. In Jakarta, there are definitely good reasons to be stopped and the violations are not fictitious. Use of the center lane next to the Busway is a popular thing to do. Also, no light, no helmet, no driver license (very young kids), no up to date registration taxes, are all very easy to spot from the roadside. And a hoop net (like a basket trap) is not so difficult to apply without disturbing the rest of the traffic.

There has been a lot of coverage on the local TV stations lately, about an action and effort of the police to avoid bribes and have people pay the official fine. (Even with blurred hidden cameras.) Of course in many cases this doesn't work yet, the drivers still pay.

But it is also a bit of a structural problem, since the police officers had to invest quite some money to get hired. Of course that needs to be recuperated.

In saying that, it's getting way more difficult these days to bribe in Jakarta. Especially the traffic cops on the big bikes won't budge, or so I've been told.

 

[Sky Garden]

This! So much this!

I absolutely hate this mentality that some tourists have that they can just come to Bali and do whatever the fuck they want and brag about it.

"I love Bali because there are no rules" is a common theme in comments on FB about Bali and drives me crazy.

It's the same tourists who look down on Indonesians but what they fail to understand is that the chaos on the roads is not due to "being Indonesian", it's due to a lack of enforcement. These tourists prove it that no matter where you come from, human beings will run amok without the stick.

This..............

Today as most days driving to my office I seen something that just makes me shake my head, foreigner on a vario, wearing nothing but board shorts, surf board attached to the side, weaving through traffic. Unfortunately ends too many times in something like this http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/...rists-die-in-motorcycle-accident-in-bali.html

 

[Vanhelsing]

Sky Garden, are you associated with the Kuta nightclub of the same name where the Australian teen was arrested on suspicion of drug possession?

 

[Sky Garden]

Nope

 

[Euc-]

My biggest issue is the fictitious traffic offenses created by police to use against me. Offenses like my front wheel going over the white line at the traffic lights while stopped, or venturing into the on coming traffic lane. Although these manufactured traffic violations are blatant falsehoods, there's little one can do when the keys to your scooter have been ripped out and in possession of the officer. You know you ain't getting your scooter back until you cough up the dough.

I'm sorry but neither of your samples are "created by police", they are traffic violations. In Europe (well, the Netherlands) having your front wheels over the white line will cost you 140 euro's, venturing into the on-coming traffic lane could, depending on the situation and perhaps mood of the officer, get your driving license suspended and/or revoked plus a fine determined by a judge in court up to a few thousand euro's. Go driving anyway during the time your license is suspended is a felony that carries a jail term and another huge fine.

 

[Vanhelsing]

I'm sorry but neither of your samples are "created by police", they are traffic violations.

sorry, I haven't explained myself very well. My frustration is Police accusing me of having committed a violation when I haven't.

 

[Euc-]

sorry, I haven't explained myself very well. My frustration is Police accusing me of having committed a violation when I haven't.

Ah, fair enough. I guess I've been lucky that in my 4 years in Indonesia (of which 1,5 in Bali) that hasn't happened to me.

 

[El_Goretto]

Ah, fair enough. I guess I've been lucky that in my 4 years in Indonesia (of which 1,5 in Bali) that hasn't happened to me.

Happened to me once in Jakarta when I was still new... Never been stopped ever since but I'm also extra careful.

If it happens, I will say "sorry, I don't speak Indonesian" in the thickest French accent I can find. Or maybe I'll just speak French.

 

[Euc-]

Happened to me once in Jakarta when I was still new... Never been stopped ever since but I'm also extra careful.

If it happens, I will say "sorry, I don't speak Indonesian" in the thickest French accent I can find. Or maybe I'll just speak French.

Yeah that's the way to go. I once took an illegal exit from the toll road, the offramp was backed-up with cars so I took the damri bus entrance/exit bringing me right to the front of the line (I know, I know, I'm an asshole), unfortunately in that pile of waiting cars was a police car as well who obviously pulled me over. Pretended to not speak any Indonesian whatsoever, which turned into a hilarious conversation between the two patroli which went something like this;

Me: Good afternoon officers, how can I help you?
Cop 1: STNK dan SIM mister
Me: handing things over while asking "anything wrong officers"?
Cop 1: Starts talking very fast and I pretend I don't understand Indonesian
Cop 1 to Cop 2; loh, ini orang barat nih, gue gak bisa omong bahasa Ingris, lu bisa gak?
Cop 2 to Cop 1: gue gak bisa juga, gimana nih?
Cop 1 to Cop 2: Ya udah gue panggil mobil lain, coba aja kalau ada yg bisa omong bahasa Ingris
Cop 2 to Cop 1: Jangan, macet sekali, kita nggu mobilnya sampai besok pagi
Cop 1 to Cop 2: Ya bener juga sih
Cop 1 to me: Handing SIM/STNK back, It's okay misterrrrr, tenkyu!

Took a lot of self control to not burst out in laughing then and there I can tell you that

Then again, you might get one that actually speaks English, or.. as I experienced in Papua, could speak Dutch!

 

[R Cameron]

The correct procedure of fining is for you to be issued a ticket with you then having to go to a BNI (or BCA I can't remember) bank and deposit the fine which last I heard was about 40 000 rupiah.

there is raising awareness that you can simply admit your fault for a traffic violation and simply go pay the small fine at the ATM

Can you point me in the direction of some official documentation for this? Perhaps the law or regulation posted on a .go.id website? That's something I'd like to have printed out and tucked into my wallet next to my SIM and STNK.

 

[El_Goretto]

Can you point me in the direction of some official documentation for this? Perhaps the law or regulation posted on a .go.id website? That's something I'd like to have printed out and tucked into my wallet next to my SIM and STNK.

You just gave me an idea for an article on expatindo.org! A little explainer on the red slip and the blue slip will be perfect!

Now, off to do some homework on this because I vaguely know the rule but I can't even remember which slip is the one that takes you to courts and which takes you to simply pay the fine at the ATM!

But basically, if you argue about the offense, they are supposed to give you a slip which you will then need to argue in courts. Huge headache for a minor traffic offense.

If you don't argue and admit your fault, you can ask for the correct slip to simply pay your fine at the ATM.

If nobody beats me to it, I'll be back with more info on this.