U.S. Imperialism

[harryopal1]

It seems we have gone back to the 60s when the USA game was to enable US corporations to plunder the resources of Cenrtal and South America with scant regard for the enormous poverty of millions of people. The CIA worked hard to help put in place right wing leaders like Pinochet to destroy any notions of democracy with murder, torture and terror as principal means of achieving the desired ends.

The present upheaval in Iran is doubtless a reaction to the dissatisfaction felt by millions of Iranians with their present leadership but I would expect that the CIA is there throwing millions of dollars into the fire and employing agitators to fan the flames.

Cuba began the revolution with free education, health measures and widespread programs to lift its people out of poverty. For 60 years the US policy has been to strangle the Cuban economy and it has successfully inhibited growth and real improvement for the masses. This time around it seems Trump is not going to pussy foot around and is determined to tighten the noose to overthrow any kind of leftist government and return to the good old days when the Mafia worked with the dictator Batista to garnish enormous profits from prostitution, casinos and racketeering. A time when US investment in Cuba yielded handsome results. Similar to the position of Nicaragua- pre revolution - where Franklin Roosevelt is reported to have said of the Nicaraguan dictator, Somoza Garcia "He may be a son of a bitch, but he's our son of a bitch". There must be a great deal of anxiety with the present Nicaraguan government and feeling that after Cuba is tied up Nicaragua will be next on the list.

 

[Balifrog]

Nothing new under the sun...

United States involvement in regime change - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

US has been involved in over 50 countries assasinations, kidnapping, coup d'etat, invasion etc since 1945

Don't forget the 2014 Maidan coup d'etat where the US was deeply involved As in the Orange revolution in 2004.

Remember Kissinger : "Being the US ennemy is dangerous, being it's friend is mortal !"

Let's see what they will do in Iran....Because there they are reaping what they have sown in 1953 when, on demand of the British, they overthrew the P.M. Mohamed Mossadegh because he nationalized the oil industry (mainly British owned). So they put in place the shah and we all know how that ended in 1979.....

 

[centurion]

Cuba began the revolution with free education, health measures and widespread programs to lift its people out of poverty.

That is how every communist project starts. It ends up in poverty and misery in every case where the experiment was tried.

 

[Balifrog]

That is how every communist project starts. It ends up in poverty and misery in every case where the experiment was tried.

Nope....Look at Vietnam !
Still a 100% communist country, but an Asian tiger economically and with a booming middle class.

Or should I mention China ?

USSR collapsed due to bad management, but from 2000 onwards Putin got the ship right.

 

[harryopal1]

That is how every communist project starts. It ends up in poverty and misery in every case where the experiment was tried.

The Cuban social revolution was essentially derailed by US sanctions. Having said that it should not be construed that I am pro Marxist Leninism. That path led to millions being destroyed by leaders such as Lenin, Stalin, Mao et al and oppressive regimes. Socialism per se need not take that path and Socialism has been an important element in many Labor governments with great benefit to those in the lower income brackets. The model proposed by Bernie Sanders would go a long way to alleviating the poorest in the USA. But anything that threatens to share profits is quickly maligned by conservatives and corporate leaders as representing the devil.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

The silence of the pro-Gaza crowd on what is happening in Iran is deafening. Perhaps a little support for those trying to overthrow the regime and the tyranny of the hijab might be welcome?

 

[Balifrog]

The silence of the pro-Gaza crowd on what is happening in Iran is deafening. Perhaps a little support for those trying to overthrow the regime and the tyranny of the hijab might be welcome?

Gaza (and Ukraine) have been put on the after burner now.
Front is Venezuela, Greenland and Iran.

Till another story pushes those ones out of the front page.

 

[centurion]

Nope....Look at Vietnam !
Still a 100% communist country, but an Asian tiger economically and with a booming middle class.

Or should I mention China ?

USSR collapsed due to bad management, but from 2000 onwards Putin got the ship right.

Vietnam has a communist government but the economic expansion started when capitalistic elements were introduced.

Same as for China, but the difference is that China after communism was remodeled to a mercantilistic fascist state.

 

[centurion]

The Cuban social revolution was essentially derailed by US sanctions. Having said that it should not be construed that I am pro Marxist Leninism.

Cuban social revolution was derailed by communism.

 

[Bob]

That is how every communist project starts. It ends up in poverty and misery in every case where the experiment was tried.

Maybe 40 years ago that would have been true except for Russia. I haven't seen a study but Yugoslavia might have been another exception. More recently Laos', Vietnam's and PRC's HDIs have seen considerable improvement.

 

[Bob]

The silence of the pro-Gaza crowd on what is happening in Iran is deafening. Perhaps a little support for those trying to overthrow the regime and the tyranny of the hijab might be welcome?

You're not pro-Gaza, as in the people of Gaza? I don't see how a reasonable person wouldn't be since the other side's fond of indiscriminately killing tens of thousands of noncombatants and stealing land, among other human rights abuses. But anyway, what's the link between Gaza and Iran?
I personally hope the people of Iran get a government that's answerable to the people and not one decided by and subservient to outsiders. But often our hopes go unfulfilled.

 

[Bob]

Going back to the OP, US intervention in South and Central American started long before the 60's and continued well past the 70's. It's disappointing that Trump found the Dulles brothers' handbook and is applying it with such simpleminded enthusiasm. Maybe he got a reminder that Venezuela and Iran have a whole lot of oil that could or should depending on your perspective be sold in USD.

 

[Balifrog]

Cuban social revolution was derailed by communism.

No, it was killed by the Yanks.
Remember the Bay of Pigs disaster ? The dozen assasination attempts on Castro by the CIA, sometimes subcontracted to the mafia ?
Same as Venezuela, Iran and plenty others.

 

[centurion]

No, it was killed by the Yanks.
Remember the Bay of Pigs disaster ? The dozen assasination attempts on Castro by the CIA, sometimes subcontracted to the mafia ?
Same as Venezuela, Iran and plenty others.

Sure, all heaven on earths. That is why so many people emigrating from these countries and nobody goes in. Almost 1/3 of Venezuelan population emigrated from the socialis paradise from 2014.

Not to mention Cuba that was on USSR funding and even at that time was failed state. You forgot they installed soviet nuclear missiles at the doorstep of the US?

 

[centurion]

Maybe 40 years ago that would have been true except for Russia. I haven't seen a study but Yugoslavia might have been another exception. More recently Laos', Vietnam's and PRC's HDIs have seen considerable improvement.

Yugoslavia was on western loans and grants during the cold war. When that ended the country bankrupted.

Laos has 2000+USD/per capita GDP, 16 billion the whole country. All these countries prosper when they introduce market economy. China is not a communist country anymore, as they moved to a totalitarian state model again, and probably stagnating already.

 

[Balifrog]

Sure, all heaven on earths. That is why so many people emigrating from these countries and nobody goes in. Almost 1/3 of Venezuelan population emigrated from the socialis paradise from 2014.

Not to mention Cuba that was on USSR funding and even at that time was failed state. You forgot they installed soviet nuclear missiles at the doorstep of the US?

Iran was a very nice place in the 70's
Venezuela was the richest South American country from the 50's to the 80's.
Mismanagement, corruption + the US blocus killed it after that.

BTW, don't forget that your ancestors were a bunch of ragtag Europeans fleeing famine and religious perscussion ...
Don Ronald iz from German origin..
Marco Rubio is Venezuelian.

Yep, missiles at the doorstep of the US is not tolerable.... but the same (American) nuclear warheads in Turkey or Germany are OK.
Not to speak about the Pershing crisis in Germany.

Man, we're not living in the 50 / 60's communist paranoia....wake up !

 

[Bob]

Yugoslavia was on western loans and grants during the cold war. When that ended the country bankrupted.

Laos has 2000+USD/per capita GDP, 16 billion the whole country. All these countries prosper when they introduce market economy. China is not a communist country anymore, as they moved to a totalitarian state model again, and probably stagnating already.

My point was that it hasn't always ended in poverty and misery. There's been plenty of poverty and misery in capitalist societies too.

 

[Bob]

Iran was a very nice place in the 70's
Venezuela was the richest South American country from the 50's to the 80's.
Mismanagement, corruption + the US blocus killed it after that.

BTW, don't forget that your ancestors were a bunch of ragtag Europeans fleeing famine and religious perscussion ...
Don Ronald iz from German origin..
Marco Rubio is Venezuelian.

Yep, missiles at the doorstep of the US is not tolerable.... but the same (American) nuclear warheads in Turkey or Germany are OK.
Not to speak about the Pershing crisis in Germany.

Man, we're not living in the 50 / 60's communist paranoia....wake up !

Excuse me, Don Ronald is German and Scottish.
L'il Marco is of Cuban descent. Trump said something recently about putting him in charge of Cuba, as in governing the place.

 

[Balifrog]

https://jakartaglobe.id/news/what-to-know-about-the-muslim-brotherhood-after-the-us-terrorist-designation