Solar System for my home

[Hbm]

Good day, seeking advice from anyone with recent experience installing home solar systems and the government incentives, tax deductions and net metering.
Solar Systems

 

[Wisnu]

yes, our solar system has been operating for almost a month full off-grid, no problem at all. So far zero watt taken from PLN.
Unfortunately no gov incentive at all, in fact gov. - at least PLN - does not really support home solar system; seem they have committed to purchase expensive electric from conglomerate; and expecting shodaqoh from home solar system owner.

 

[marcus]

From https://www.esdm.go.id/id/media-cen...rbit-kini-kapasitas-pemasangan-tidak-dibatasi
Title : Latest Rooftop Solar Power Plant Regulation Issued, Installation Capacity Now Unlimited (free translation) , March 2024
Note : PLTS = Pembangkit Listrik Tenaga Surya/Solar Power Plant , PLN = Public Electricity Provider

...The main points of the Regulation PerMen no.2 of 2024 concerning Rooftop PLTS, include:
The capacity of the Rooftop PLTS installation is not limited to 100% of PLN's installed capacity but is based on the availability of PLN quota.

The capacity quota of the Rooftop PLTS system in clustering published by PLN through PLN's official website, application, and/or social media. This quota is determined by the Director General of Electricity every 5 years.

Elimination of the import-export mechanism. The excess value of electrical energy from the customer's Rooftop PLTS system to the Public Electricity network is not taken into account in determining the amount of the customer's electricity bill.

Elimination of capacity costs for all types of PLN customers.

Arrangement and simplification of the application time for the installation of Rooftop PLTS by PLN customers and applications are served by PLN based on the FIFS (First In First Serve) mechanism.

The cost of procuring an advanced meter as a replacement for the import-export kWh meter is borne by the Public Electricity Provider .

Application-based service mechanism for ease of submitting applications, reporting and monitoring the Rooftop PLTS program.

Availability of Rooftop Solar Power Complaint Center to receive complaints from Rooftop Solar Power customers or Public Electricity Provider.

Director of Aneka Energi Baru dan Energi Rebaru:
"We have discussed the Rooftop Solar Power system quota with PT PLN ... have obtained an indication that the Rooftop Solar Power system quota can be developed until 2028. This quota will be proposed by PT PLN to the Ministry of Energy and Mineral Resources to then be determined and reduced to a clustering quota," ...

The business process for submitting Rooftop PLTS applications will be supported by an electronic Rooftop PLTS service application. Specifically for Non-PLN , the Rooftop PLTS Integrated Service and Reporting System (SIMANTAP) application has been prepared. In the future, SIMANTAP will synergize with PT PLN's application. With this application, it is hoped that the implementation of the Rooftop PLTS program can run well and transparently.

The Government will provide guidance and supervision, so that the implementation of the Rooftop PLTS Ministerial Regulation can run according to the rules, effectively, and transparently...

 

[marcus]

PerMen no.2 Year 2024 , partial (free translation)
Article 4
(4) The Rooftop PLTS System ... shall be in accordance with the installation diagram and technical specification standards of the Rooftop PLTS System listed in Attachment I which is an integral part of this Ministerial Regulation.

Article 5
(1) The use of the Rooftop PLTS System ... must pay attention to the safety and reliability of the operation of the Public electrical power network in accordance with the provisions of laws and regulations in the field of electricity.

Article 7
(1) Public Electricity Providers are required to prepare a development quota for the Rooftop PLTS System for each Electric Power System.

Article 12
(1) The capacity of the Rooftop PLTS System to be installed by a prospective Rooftop PLTS Customer ... is adjusted to the capacity needs of the prospective Rooftop PLTS Customer based on the Rooftop PLTS System development quota as referred to in Article 9.

Article 13
Excess electrical energy from the Rooftop PLTS System that enters the public electricity network is not taken into account in determining the amount of the Rooftop PLTS customer's electricity bill.

Article 14
(1) Prospective Rooftop PLTS customer must submit an application for the construction and installation of the Rooftop PLTS System to the Public Electricity Provider with a copy to the Director General of EBTKE and the Director General of Electricity.
(2) The application as referred to in paragraph (1) is to be submitted in January or July of each year.
(3) The application as referred to in paragraph (1) for the first time after this Ministerial Regulation is enacted, shall be submitted within a maximum period of 1 month since the publication of the Rooftop Solar Power System development quota based on clustering ...

Article 15
(1) The Public Electricity Provider must provide approval or rejection of the application as referred to in Article 14 paragraph (1) within a maximum period of 30 calendar days since the application deadline as referred to in Article 14 paragraph (2) and paragraph (3) ends.

Article 17
(1) Prospective Rooftop PLTS customer who undertake the construction and installation of Rooftop PLTS Systems with a total capacity of more than 500 kW connected in 1 electricity installation system, must have a business permit for the provision of electricity for their own interests.

Article 24
(1) Rooftop PLTS systems with a total capacity of:
a. more than 500 kW that is connected in 1 electrical power installation system; and
b. up to 500 kW with technical specifications of the control panel being 1 (one) inseparable part,
must have an SLO.

Article 25
(1) Rooftop PLTS systems with a total capacity of up to 500 kW with technical specifications of the control panel being 1 (one) inseparable part and can be operated in a plug and play manner
that meets the following requirements:
a. Rooftop PLTS System conditions using:
1) one inverter; or
2) more than one inverter with a total capacity less than 10 kW ,
b. a series of solar modules in one part of the same building construction;
c. Rooftop PLTS systems in the same grounding; and
d. The Rooftop PLTS System serves one installation for the same use, and is declared to have met the mandatory SLO requirements.

Article 30
(1) The Minister through the Director General of EBTKE builds an integrated service and reporting system application for the Rooftop PLTS electronic System ...

Article 31
(1) Based on this Ministerial Regulation, PT PLN (Persero) builds:
a. an integrated service and reporting system application for the Rooftop PLTS electronic System for PT PLN (Persero) customers;
b. an application for using a digital-based Rooftop PLTS System integrated with the Supervisory
Control and Data Acquisition (SCADA) system or smart grid distribution; and
c. builds supporting infrastructure for the Rooftop PLTS System.
..................

 

[Shadrach]

PerMen no.2 Year 2024 , partial (free translation)
Article 4
(4) The Rooftop PLTS System ... shall be in accordance with the installation diagram and technical specification standards of the Rooftop PLTS System listed in Attachment I which is an integral part of this Ministerial Regulation.

Article 5
(1) The use of the Rooftop PLTS System ... must pay attention to the safety and reliability of the operation of the Public electrical power network in accordance with the provisions of laws and regulations in the field of electricity.

Article 7
(1) Public Electricity Providers are required to prepare a development quota for the Rooftop PLTS System for each Electric Power System.

Article 12
(1) The capacity of the Rooftop PLTS System to be installed by a prospective Rooftop PLTS Customer ... is adjusted to the capacity needs of the prospective Rooftop PLTS Customer based on the Rooftop PLTS System development quota as referred to in Article 9.

Article 13
Excess electrical energy from the Rooftop PLTS System that enters the public electricity network is not taken into account in determining the amount of the Rooftop PLTS customer's electricity bill.

Article 14
(1) Prospective Rooftop PLTS customer must submit an application for the construction and installation of the Rooftop PLTS System to the Public Electricity Provider with a copy to the Director General of EBTKE and the Director General of Electricity.
(2) The application as referred to in paragraph (1) is to be submitted in January or July of each year.
(3) The application as referred to in paragraph (1) for the first time after this Ministerial Regulation is enacted, shall be submitted within a maximum period of 1 month since the publication of the Rooftop Solar Power System development quota based on clustering ...

Article 15
(1) The Public Electricity Provider must provide approval or rejection of the application as referred to in Article 14 paragraph (1) within a maximum period of 30 calendar days since the application deadline as referred to in Article 14 paragraph (2) and paragraph (3) ends.

Article 17
(1) Prospective Rooftop PLTS customer who undertake the construction and installation of Rooftop PLTS Systems with a total capacity of more than 500 kW connected in 1 electricity installation system, must have a business permit for the provision of electricity for their own interests.

Article 24
(1) Rooftop PLTS systems with a total capacity of:
a. more than 500 kW that is connected in 1 electrical power installation system; and
b. up to 500 kW with technical specifications of the control panel being 1 (one) inseparable part,
must have an SLO.

Article 25
(1) Rooftop PLTS systems with a total capacity of up to 500 kW with technical specifications of the control panel being 1 (one) inseparable part and can be operated in a plug and play manner
that meets the following requirements:
a. Rooftop PLTS System conditions using:
1) one inverter; or
2) more than one inverter with a total capacity less than 10 kW ,
b. a series of solar modules in one part of the same building construction;
c. Rooftop PLTS systems in the same grounding; and
d. The Rooftop PLTS System serves one installation for the same use, and is declared to have met the mandatory SLO requirements.

Article 30
(1) The Minister through the Director General of EBTKE builds an integrated service and reporting system application for the Rooftop PLTS electronic System ...

Article 31
(1) Based on this Ministerial Regulation, PT PLN (Persero) builds:
a. an integrated service and reporting system application for the Rooftop PLTS electronic System for PT PLN (Persero) customers;
b. an application for using a digital-based Rooftop PLTS System integrated with the Supervisory
Control and Data Acquisition (SCADA) system or smart grid distribution; and
c. builds supporting infrastructure for the Rooftop PLTS System.
..................

Wow, that's a lot of Mumbo Jumbo for a person to understand. One thing I noticed that I thought was peculiar, was Article 13. That stated any excess Electrical Energy that goes into the public network, is not reflected on the customers billing. Does that mean the Public system gets free electricity and doesn't give credit to the homeowner? Shouldn't the homeowner get some kind of reimbursement for the Electricity produced by their Solar installation? Such as a reduction in cost of the electricity they use from the Public network? All of these name abbreviations are hard to understand.

 

[Hbm]

yes, our solar system has been operating for almost a month full off-grid, no problem at all. So far zero watt taken from PLN.
Unfortunately no gov incentive at all, in fact gov. - at least PLN - does not really support home solar system; seem they have committed to purchase expensive electric from conglomerate; and expecting shodaqoh from home solar system owner.

Great, here are a couple of questions; 1) what set up do you have, is; with or without battery (if with, what type?) 2) panels, inverter, battery; brands? 3) who did the installation for you?

 

[Shadrach]

yes, our solar system has been operating for almost a month full off-grid, no problem at all. So far zero watt taken from PLN.
Unfortunately no gov incentive at all, in fact gov. - at least PLN - does not really support home solar system; seem they have committed to purchase expensive electric from conglomerate; and expecting shodaqoh from home solar system owner.

Well that's because the Electricity is produced by Coal and LPG, LNG, and they pay the politicians big bucks to keep control of Electricity production! They don't like Solar energy because it's free from the Sun, and they can't charge you for it.
And to all the Solar skeptics, yes we know it takes Rare Earth minerals, and Inefficient Batteries, but it still pollutes less, and it's quiet, and the way of the Future. So we should support it and the Youth of the World to come up with new ideas to make it better!
What is shodagoh?

 

[marcus]

... One thing I noticed that I thought was peculiar, was Article 13. That stated any excess Electrical Energy that goes into the public network, is not reflected on the customers billing. Does that mean the Public system gets free electricity and doesn't give credit to the homeowner? ...

It is also not clear to me .

 

[Wisnu]

It is also not clear to me .

That's why I call it - shodaqoh - a voluntary offering or alms.

 

[Wisnu]

Great, here are a couple of questions; 1) what set up do you have, is; with or without battery (if with, what type?) 2) panels, inverter, battery; brands? 3) who did the installation for you?

Off-grid hybrid 11,550 WP with 20 KWH LFP battery (considering to add 3850 WP + 10 KWH LFP). Initial plan DIY, supposed to have plenty of time after retire; fortunately not. So, a company in Surabaya did the job.

 

[Shadrach]

That's why I call it - shodaqoh - a voluntary offering or alms.

Oh, I didn't know that what's that was called. I remember when I was a kid going to a Southern Baptist Church, and the collection plate would be passed. I wondered where did that money go? I noticed all the people there would be praying to God, asking for forgiveness, then the next day, go back to back stabbing, lying, cheating on their wives, and husbands, overcharging for goods, Hating the local Black neighborhoods, ( All White Church). The Priest sure was friendly to all the young pretty girls too!
Luckily I could escape to the basement and make handicrafts with the other kids.
I stopped going to that Church at 11 years old, when my Parents stopped going. Never had a religious bone in my body since!
But I do like Solar power!

 

[centurion]

I have a solar home genset, but no incentives. And needs no batteries.

 

[Wisnu]

for info who want to install, with 11,000 WP PV panel, my daily electricity production is vary 15KWH when rain all day to 42 KWH.
and now

 

[Shadrach]

I have a solar home genset, but no incentives. And needs no batteries.

I assume this means you are connected to the Grid, and not independent. If your solar system produces all, or more than your electrical needs. Do you still have monthly bills? And why would you do this?

 

[marcus]

for info who want to install, with ... : 7047 W > 6322 W stored in batteries + 417 W consumed

I don't know anything about , but did I understand it correctly : most of the days (not night) , your consumption is less than 10% of the generated energy ?

If I understood it correctly , why ?
And why did you decide for a off-grid system ? Because I imagine I would prefer to connect it to the grid .

I imagine the solar panels generate from around 7AM until 5PM (around 10 hours) , so you have no generation from around 5PM to 7AM (around 14 hours) .

Even off-grid I would prefer a smaller system (panels & batteries) .
I don't like batteries (they are expensive and low operation life) , so I would prefer few batteries and disconnect all panels & batteries and use only the energy from PLN (public electricity provider) from around 5PM to 7AM . Isn't it possible ?.

 

[Wisnu]

I don't know anything about , but did I understand it correctly : most of the days (not night) , your consumption is less than 10% of the generated energy ?

If I understood it correctly , why ?
And why did you decide for a off-grid system ? Because I imagine I would prefer to connect it to the grid .

I imagine the solar panels generate from around 7AM until 5PM (around 10 hours) , so you have no generation from around 5PM to 7AM (around 14 hours) .

Even off-grid I would prefer a smaller system (panels & batteries) .
I don't like batteries (they are expensive and low operation life) , so I would prefer few batteries and disconnect all panels & batteries and use only the energy from PLN (public electricity provider) from around 5PM to 7AM . Isn't it possible ?.

load in the picture is jus spot, does not reflect full usage profile throughout the day. Currently not living there because it is still in the completion stage, the load can jump high when workers use welding machines or hand tools or when I am on site and turn on all the AC; often the load reaches > 6000 watts.

I decide off-grid; since I dont like the current regulation as you posted, very unfair, uncertainty on the permit approval, and dependency to PLN.

Indeed, PV panel will produce electricity typically from 7 to 5pm with the peak here at 01PM - 02PM. For 11,000 WP, on the shiny day yield 40 - 45 KWH, or drop to 10 - 15 KWH on the cloudy and rainy days.
Now, on the good day of 40KWH and your load is only 500 watt average; then you're very kind by donating PLN 35KWH. At night, you still have to pay your consumption full.

11,000 WP and 20 KWH battery is not a big system. I'm preparing to add at 7 PV 550WP and 10KWH battery after we get full profile of our consumption.

 

[Wisnu]

Even off-grid I would prefer a smaller system (panels & batteries) .
I don't like batteries (they are expensive and low operation life) , so I would prefer few batteries and disconnect all panels & batteries and use only the energy from PLN (public electricity provider) from around 5PM to 7AM . Isn't it possible ?.

Sure; you can choose hybrid on-grid or hybrid off-grid.

 

[fastpitch17]

Waste not, want not.
Some pretty smart innovating people out there.

“I Began Collecting Them and Now Have Over 650” – A User Has Been Powering His Home with Laptop Batteries Since 2016

In a world where sustainability and innovation are constantly intertwined, one energy enthusiast has discovered an unexpected way to turn tech waste into an endless

www.wecb.fm

 

[Shadrach]

Waste not, want not.
Some pretty smart innovating people out there.

“I Began Collecting Them and Now Have Over 650” – A User Has Been Powering His Home with Laptop Batteries Since 2016

In a world where sustainability and innovation are constantly intertwined, one energy enthusiast has discovered an unexpected way to turn tech waste into an endless

www.wecb.fm

What a great story! Obviously he knew what he was doing, being able to read the output of the batteries, and move them around accordingly. And recycling laptop batteries is a Genius thing to do. I do wonder though how much electricity he can get from this system? It must take a lot of these small batteries to have enough power for a house, lights, computer, phones, etc?

 

[Wisnu]

Could be good idea; however even if somebody offer me this approach at significant lower cost; I will not buy not even for free. Most if not all those are Liyhium Ion batery. While Lithium-ion batteries offer higher energy density and faster charging, but more prone to some safety issues including fire and explosion. I heard some not very good report about the super expensive Tesla powerwall.
In the other hand, LiFePO4 batteries are known for their safety and longer lifespan although bulkier than Li ion.
Still very interesting with the fact, the battery that techically shorter life span, the system has remained uninterrupted since 2016.