Second Visa Stamp after re-entering Indonesia on a 2nd home visa

[Balifrog]

Speaking about complicating ones life....

Personally, and this only me, I could never convert to another religion, even symbolically.
I am not a religious man at all, but I consider it part of my culture or cultural heritage.
Same there is no way I abandon my French nationality to adapt any other. If I can legally keep both, it would ok.

Both changes (religion and nationality) would morally feel like treason.

 

[fastpitch17]

Speaking about complicating ones life....

Personally, and this only me, I could never convert to another religion, even symbolically.
I am not a religious man at all, but I consider it part of my culture or cultural heritage.
Same there is no way I abandon my French nationality to adapt any other. If I can legally keep both, it would ok.

Both changes (religion and nationality) would morally feel like treason.

I always seem to have someone from my wife's side of the family suggesting I convert. Nothing to it. Just go to Imam and say the words. No classes or any understanding of the religion needed. No need to drop your pants and let an Imam fondle you to make sure you are cut. I guess you just automatically get divinely filled with Islamic knowledge and understanding. Not even required to attend any services but donations are always welcomed. Looks to me like the only thing of importance is adding another number to the population of followers.

Citizenship, get that too sometimes. Not going to happen. I may have the nationality of a now pretty messed up nation but, it is my messed up nation and I do now and always will support the freedoms and democracy it offers, at least for now. Enter my property behind closed walls and all those freedoms are offered to everyone. Do or say whatever you wish as long as no one is harmed. Here, all that is expected is that people just, Be You. Leave your religion and social injustices at the gate or remain outside.

 

[marcus]

... If you marry such that you are subject to the Muslim court, it is much harder to 'rewrite the birth cert', if you marry as a catholic .. you are subject to the secular court which is much easier ...

Could you tell us from where/who you got this information .

From the article below , it seems there is only 1 rule about it which is not dependent on religion , and it is very clear/simple , so I don't think it would have different procedures in these 2 different courts .

My Indonesian wife said that she already heard that divorcing in Pengadilan Negeri/National Court (for non-Muslims) is easier , but I myself divorced (without lawyer) at Pengadilan Agama/Religious Court (for Muslims) and didn't see any difficult .

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From https://www.hukumonline.com/klinik/...ta-kelahiran-anak-luar-kawin-lt55e08ea842273/
Title : Inclusion of the Father's Name in the Birth Certificate of an Illegitimate Child
By Tri Jata Ayu Pramesti, S.H. , 14 September 2015


... The issue of legal relations between children born out of wedlock and their parents is regulated in Article 43 paragraph (1) of Law no.1 of 1974 (“Marriage Law”).

However, the Constitutional Court (“MK”) through decision Number 46/PUU-VIII/2010 dated February 17, 2012 decided that Article 43 paragraph (1) of the Marriage Law is contrary to the 1945 Constitution if it is not read:

"A child born out of wedlock only has a civil relationship with his/her mother and his/her mother’s family and with a man as his/her father who can be proven based on science and technology and/or other evidence according to the law to have a blood relationship, including a civil relationship with his/her father’s family."

So, if you want the child to have a civil relationship with his/her father too, this can be proven legally, namely through a court ruling. For the purpose of issuing a birth certificate, a court ruling is required for the legal protection of the child himself/herself.

The Republic of Indonesia based on Pancasila and the 1945 Constitution ("UUD 1945") is essentially obliged to provide protection and recognition for the determination of personal status and legal status for every population event and important event experienced by Indonesian citizens. Recognition of legal status in important events here, one of which is the issuance of a birth certificate.[1]

Then, regarding the court that has the authority to issue a ruling on the legitimization of an illegitimate child, for those who are Muslim, the application for a court ruling is submitted to the religious court. The Religious Court has the duty and authority to examine, decide, and resolve cases at the first level between people who are Muslim in the field of marriage.[2] ...

Meanwhile, for those who are non-Muslim, the application for a court ruling on the legitimization of an illegitimate child is submitted to the National Court ...

 

[Shadrach]

Could you tell us from where/who you got this information .

From the article below , it seems there is only 1 rule about it which is not dependent on religion , and it is very clear/simple , so I don't think it would have different procedures in these 2 different courts .

My Indonesian wife said that she already heard that divorcing in Pengadilan Negeri/National Court (for non-Muslims) is easier , but I myself divorced (without lawyer) at Pengadilan Agama/Religious Court (for Muslims) and didn't see any difficult .

--------------------------------------

From https://www.hukumonline.com/klinik/...ta-kelahiran-anak-luar-kawin-lt55e08ea842273/
Title : Inclusion of the Father's Name in the Birth Certificate of an Illegitimate Child
By Tri Jata Ayu Pramesti, S.H. , 14 September 2015


... The issue of legal relations between children born out of wedlock and their parents is regulated in Article 43 paragraph (1) of Law no.1 of 1974 (“Marriage Law”).

However, the Constitutional Court (“MK”) through decision Number 46/PUU-VIII/2010 dated February 17, 2012 decided that Article 43 paragraph (1) of the Marriage Law is contrary to the 1945 Constitution if it is not read:

"A child born out of wedlock only has a civil relationship with his/her mother and his/her mother’s family and with a man as his/her father who can be proven based on science and technology and/or other evidence according to the law to have a blood relationship, including a civil relationship with his/her father’s family."

So, if you want the child to have a civil relationship with his/her father too, this can be proven legally, namely through a court ruling. For the purpose of issuing a birth certificate, a court ruling is required for the legal protection of the child himself/herself.

The Republic of Indonesia based on Pancasila and the 1945 Constitution ("UUD 1945") is essentially obliged to provide protection and recognition for the determination of personal status and legal status for every population event and important event experienced by Indonesian citizens. Recognition of legal status in important events here, one of which is the issuance of a birth certificate.[1]

Then, regarding the court that has the authority to issue a ruling on the legitimization of an illegitimate child, for those who are Muslim, the application for a court ruling is submitted to the religious court. The Religious Court has the duty and authority to examine, decide, and resolve cases at the first level between people who are Muslim in the field of marriage.[2] ...

Meanwhile, for those who are non-Muslim, the application for a court ruling on the legitimization of an illegitimate child is submitted to the National Court ...

How Sad, that life has become so complicated. It makes me think How lucky people were 100 years ago, when all these courts didn't exist.
A child is born to a mother and a father, Period!
Who needs a bunch of old grumpy Men sitting on a court, to decide your fate?