Pre/postnups revisited

Euc-

Well-Known Member
Charter Member
Cager
Joined
Jul 21, 2016
Messages
638
As i’m getting married soon to an Indonesian , I’ve looked into the pre- and postnup things that some say are required in the case of mixed marriages.

After doing a lot of online reading (including on this forum), consulting a lawyer and notaris, I am now probably more confused then I was before I looked into everything. Would love you guys’ opinions on below thoughts/questions.

Situation: young working professionals, early / midway in careers, no previous marriages or any major assets that we bring into the marriage. WNI’s family owns a lot of land that she at one point is to (partly) inherit.

Future plans: no immediate plans to leave Indonesia but also no plans to stay long term, we will move to different countries as my job requires. Retirement? One day, preferably on a beach.

Current thinking: As no plans to purchase property or open up a PT, no need for a prenup.

Thought process:

1. We do not plan to purchase any property in the near future, the main reason for a mix marriage couple to have a prenup ceases to exist.

1.a Even if we purchase property, there shouldn’t be an issue with the purchasing part, issues would only arise when we would try to sell it? (Due to the WNA cannot own land and we own everything 50/50 blabla).

1.b We could then simply make a postnup if and when we want to sell the property.

1.c In the event we do wish to purchase property in the future, and if we would have a pre-nup, any money I “give” to the wife to purchase said property could be considered taxable? This can then be avoided by not having a pre-nup, as she owns the money already anyway.

2. When it comes to inheriting property, we don’t need a prenup as the law regulates that inheritances do not fall under the 50/50 rule. I’ve read some arguments that this wouldn’t for some reason apply to mixed marriages, any updated thoughts on this?

2.a maybe silly but not knowing the specifics of inheritance etc: how would she be able to proof that land is inherited instead of purchased?

3. If WNI spouse dies, I would have 1 year to find a solution for the purchased properties in Indonesia. What about her inherited property? What happens to that? Am I right in assuming that it would go to the children or if that is not possible the closest WNI relative?

3.a An often heard solution is “just give it to the children”, what happens if the children are not of a legal age to own property yet? Or are not legally allowed to own property as they have chosen the WNA nationality when it was time to tick that box?

4. If not having a prenup, but wife has a NPWP, I understand there is a life long yearly tax reporting requirement for her. If she would move abroad, is she able to cancel/deactivate the NPWP?

If not: would there be any way that if we live in a non-treaty country my income would then technically become subject to Indonesian income tax through her? (Provided the indonesian tax guys find out of course).

4.a following to point 4, what if she does receive taxable income from Indonesia while she is abroad? Eg income from rent from her owned properties?

4.b talking about tax, how would it work in Indonesia? We both earn salaries above the taxable income minimum, but are in different brackets. Once we are married, would our salaries become combined for income tax purposes, and thus her salary subject to my tax bracket? If so, could this be avoided with a prenup?
 

jstar

Mr. 10,000
Joined
Jul 31, 2016
Messages
4,305
Since it's already rather late; just a quickie on the tax: Yes the NPWP can be removed. That would be possible for a person who wants to have a joined tax filing with her husband (it can stay separate). But also for someone who moves abroad.
 

jstar

Mr. 10,000
Joined
Jul 31, 2016
Messages
4,305
For inheritance in general, there are differences rules depending whether it was a Civil or Muslim marriage. Civil law can be chosen but then all heirs need to agree.

Under Islamic law for instance, you would inherit half if there is no child, and if there is, you would get a quarter of the inheritance.

The exception you probably were thinking about, is if there is a will (testament). That way you can not inherit.
 

Euc-

Well-Known Member
Charter Member
Cager
Joined
Jul 21, 2016
Messages
638
Thanks, yes i forgot that one, it’s not a muslim marriage so we will be going through the catatan sipil.
 

dafluff

Moderator
Moderator
Cager
Joined
Jul 13, 2016
Messages
3,521
Some comments:

2a. The means of transfer (sale/inheritance/gift) should be noted on the certificate.

3. Depends on what happens to her inherited property (ie. who inherits it). If it is to you, then you have to sell within 1 year.

3a. If your kids are dual nationals, this is moot, b/c dual nationals are not allowed to own property either.

4. NPWP can be cancelled, becoming non-resident to Indonesia is one possible reason.

4a. Rental income is subject to income tax. If she is no longer required to pay Indonesian income taxes, then only the other country's tax rules apply.

4b. Even if filing together (1 NPWP for both), I think the taxable income is calculated separately for husband and wife, meaning that each income will be taxed by their own bracket.
 

ericjancoen

Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2018
Messages
24
the point of prenups agreement is to protect both party "in case" they get separated. sure you can take vow to be together forever but who know what the future brings. if the worse case happens with prenups agreement both party will leave the marriage with no hassle because they treated to be different legal entity thus can make legal act on his/her own, without the agreement when divorce happen, good luck having half property with limbo legal status
 

jstar

Mr. 10,000
Joined
Jul 31, 2016
Messages
4,305
You could say “good luck having zero property with clear legal status”. Not sure if that’s so much better..,
 

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Follow Us

Latest Expat Indo Articles

Latest Activity

New posts Latest threads

Latest Tweets by Expat Indo

Online Now

Newest Members

Forum Statistics

Threads
4,399
Messages
67,026
Members
1,768
Latest member
m17tgw
Top Bottom