how to come home to indonesia during covid as an ex (kinda) wni?

[therealpingu]

hi guys hope everyone is doing well, this is my first post, glad to join the forum!

to start with some background of my situation. i was born in the us to indonesian parents and grew up with both passports. spent up to second grade in indonesia, moved back to the us up to middle school, then back to indonesia for highschool nothing too crazy there.

i went to university in the uk for 5 years afterwards, me and my parents aware of the no dual citizenship after 21 rule and getting the student visa on my indonesian passport. used my us passport to travel to the eu and other countries fairly frequently during this period (a lot of uk entry stamps on the indonesian passport with only a handful of visas, red flag?) i also managed to renew the indonesian passport right before i left the uk

after university i moved to the us to start my career, it just seemed like the logical choice financially and i honestly do lean towards identifying as american in many ways although i do still consider myself indonesian in others. nothing in life is that clear cut but if i really had to choose i would choose the us as im fairly established here at this point socially and careerwise although no family yet, but i do still want to maintain links to my family in indonesia.

i have been in the us for 3 years and i was actually supposed to come to indonesia in march 2020 for a trip which was cancelled due to covid. now down to the main issue of this post how can i come to visit indonesia in nov-dec with my current situation? given i cant just show up at the airport with my us passport and get a visa on arrival?

my mom specifically has been getting very impatient with wanting me to go home while i have been delaying saying i should just wait until indonesia is open for foreigners. she wants me to take the third country tactic to enter indonesia with my Indonesian passport. to be more specific it is to go via turkey (oddly the perfect mix of being open to indonesians and americans as well as tourism with minimal covid restrictions), enter there with an e visa on the indonesian passport to get the turkish stamp and then fly right to indonesia and if immigration asks any questions to say i was an illegal in the uk this whole time and that i decided to come home.

this is giving me a lot of strain, i am naturally super cautious and calculated about this kind of thing, i hate even feeling that i am doing something wrong or illegal, but my mom is really pushing me hard, saying just go its indo immigration, they are not that smart no way they will care to check everything etc etc. also i remember indonesia has exit immigration, the tactic there is to go again via a turkey with a turkish e visa on the indonesian then to go to indonesia.

what do you guys think of doing something like this? is it likely to succeed? i feel like there’s so many red flags like the uk story not really adding up, flight manifests/luggage tags showing i came from the us not uk etc. that indonesian immigration would notice during entry or exit and that they would check if i have another passport or not. but in terms of not having to apply for an indonesian visa during these covid times in that sense it is much more straighforward.

like i said my preference is to enter with a us passport with visa on arrival, but as a compromise is it possible to get an indonesian visa these days? i kept asking my mom to just find some calo to help get a visa but she seems really reluctant saying her connections say its too hard to get one now. my cousin actually knows someone who offered to get a b??? business/tourism visa for about 5 mil, anyone hear of that? i also read the posts on this forum about itas to kitas to kitap, is that kind of visa still being issued these days with covid?

also for the itas kitas kitap process, will it revoke my ktp? i have one that’s valid for life, my mom is against this and wants me to keep this as much as possible. also what are the residency requirements to get to kitap? can i get the process going towards the unlimited kitap after 5 years if i just fly in every once in a while and am not actually resident in indonesia? if i could get a permanent kitap on my us passport that would just be amazing for me.

TLDR; man with valid indonesian and american passports wants to come home from the us to indonesia to visit family, should he wing it with immigration or is there a straightforward way to get a indonesian visa during these covid times?

any comments welcome, feel free to discuss broadly as well, thank you!!!

 

[dafluff]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Right now there are no new visas being processed abroad. However, I have a feeling that Indonesia will re-open visa applications within the next month or so, if the cases keep dropping as they are now. My best suggestion in your case, rather than stressing out trying to find loopholes, is to just wait a little longer.

As an ex-WNI, with family able to sponsor you, you can apply for an ITAS, however, I believe in the process they will investigate that you have relinquished your WNI, as well as your KTP. Some ex-WNI members who have gone to the process will hopefully chime in.

 

[SamR]

Therealpingu, I’m guessing that you’ve already taken up the US citizenship but you haven’t disclosed this to your nearest KBRI/KJRI?

If this is the case, from my experience, your Kitas application will be your disclosure to the KBRI/KJRI that you have taken on your citizenship and you will be asked to hand over your Indonesian passport as you collect your visa.

Having a Kitas will mean that your KTP will eventually be revoked. Kitas holders have to have a SKTT issued by the Disdukcapil. But the SKTT number will be the same as your KTP number. So if you already have an E-KTP you’ll have to get your KTP number revoked.

 

[dafluff]

However, I have a feeling that Indonesia will re-open visa applications within the next month or so, if the cases keep dropping as they are now.

Ok, that was fast: Visa applications abroad (including ijin kunjungan) will reopen today, as per the new minsterial regulation. This is similar to pre-PKPM levels.

Borders Opened Again

Fresh new regulation

expatindo.org

 

[Banana72]

my mom specifically has been getting very impatient with wanting me to go home while i have been delaying saying i should just wait until indonesia is open for foreigners. she wants me to take the third country tactic to enter indonesia with my Indonesian passport. to be more specific it is to go via turkey (oddly the perfect mix of being open to indonesians and americans as well as tourism with minimal covid restrictions), enter there with an e visa on the indonesian passport to get the turkish stamp and then fly right to indonesia and if immigration asks any questions to say i was an illegal in the uk this whole time and that i decided to come home.

this is giving me a lot of strain, i am naturally super cautious and calculated about this kind of thing, i hate even feeling that i am doing something wrong or illegal, but my mom is really pushing me hard, saying just go its indo immigration, they are not that smart no way they will care to check everything etc etc. also i remember indonesia has exit immigration, the tactic there is to go again via a turkey with a turkish e visa on the indonesian then to go to indonesia.


any comments welcome, feel free to discuss broadly as well, thank you!!!

I received similar advice before of using Indo passport coming into Indonesia, similar views about 'they won't check too carefully" I'd say...don't listen to your mom/those people. They are not in your shoes. If you happen to be a bit unlucky and then got caught doing that...then usually those people who give advice don't claim responsibility.... Indo is slowly getting better with their database I think...although I don't know how good. I'm an ex-wni with a (now revoked) KTP Indo and a legal KTP Orang Asing. Interestingly, my NIK from the Indo KTP is the same as my KTP OA....and I actually got a letter from Department Kehakiman for my 'relinquishing citizenship' (pelepasan kewarganegaraan)...now...if they did it incorrectly there, I don't know. Another ex-wni also has his KTP OA, but his NIK is different than his (also revoked) KTP Indo. Shows you how inconsistent the SOP in Indonesia...but I personally am not gonna gamble with that passport Indo thing. I've heard one or two people done it in the past, but this was at least 10 years ago and not worth it doing it now, the horror of getting sent back to UK after a long flight is hard enough...adding covid restrictions...not worth it. Just my .02.

 

[harryopal1]

"..... enter there with an e visa on the indonesian passport to get the turkish stamp and then fly right to indonesia and if immigration asks any questions to say i was an illegal in the uk this whole time and that i decided to come home."

Whatever the difficulties try and keep it simple and straight. The moment you make something up you are on an slippery slope if pressed for details.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

TLDR; man with valid indonesian and american passports wants to come home from the us to indonesia to visit family, should he wing it with immigration or is there a straightforward way to get a indonesian visa during these covid times?

I guess it is an obvious point but your Indonesian passport is not actually valid, since it is invalidated by the fact you have an American one.

 

[SamR]

I guess it is an obvious point but your Indonesian passport is not actually valid, since it is invalidated by the fact you have an American one.

In practice, it’s only invalidated when you disclose to the embassy and you hand it over to them. Before that, as an ex-WNI friend has told me, everything depends on how “honest each individual is”.

Much as banana72, I had relatives try to make the argument that “Immigration won’t notice” when I was coming back but I just don’t want to take the risk.

In the experience of the eks-WNI who got elected as a bupati earlier in the year, even if one slips through the cracks, the country where you have taken up citizenship will have data that you have taken up a foreign citizenship.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

It only gets physically invalidated when you hand it over, however it is not actually valid even now. Imagine you buy a fake passport and successfully use it to get through passport control - it doesn't mean it's valid, it just means no officials have found out yet that it's invalid.

I had a relative who came back after studying in the US, and tried to enter on the US passport. But there was something wrong with it and he had the Indonesian one in his bag. The final result was a fine of about 150jt (after nego and threats) and he was allowed to keep the Indo one but had to formally give up the US one.

Anyway for the post-2011 generation their dual citizenship is formalised and they'll have to choose one or the other.

 

[dannyboy]

If you have taken citizenship overseas, I'd say don't even attempt to enter Indo with Indo passport. Last I heard from A consulate overseas that Indo is trying to synchronise all the id cards (sim, passports, ktp, kk) into one central database which can be accessed by relevant authorities local and overseas. Not sure how likely and feasible this is though, but as the vaccine passports being attached to travel requirements in the near future, I'd imagine it can only get harder.

 

[jukung11]

I am having trouble with the math on this one.

I thought the dual citizenship law wasn't until 2006. 2021-2006 = 15 years.

18 years for high school + 5 years for university + 3 years in the U.S. is OP is at least 26?

For dual citizenship any child born before 2006 was required to register with the Indonesian embassy as a dual citizen status within a few year grace period. If you did register, your citizenship status should automatically have been revoked at the age of 21 (technically 18 with a 3 year grace period). If you did not register, you were never legally a dual citizen. Citizenship status is revoked upon any Indonesian citizen obtaining a passport from another country.

This has been covered many times here.

I am shock, they want to DEPORTASI my daughter

Thanks a lot again for your opinions and advices. My daughter wants to be Indonesian citizens and hold Indonesian passport. In March 2020 her Indonesian passport will expire and the Spanish one will expire in August 2020. The last time she entered Indonesia it was in July 2018 with the...

www.expatindo.org

Pasal 31 (1) Warga Negara Indonesia dengan sendirinya kehilangan kewarganegaraannya karena:
g. mempunyai paspor atau surat yang bersifat paspor dari negara asing atau surat yang dapat diartikan sebagai tanda kewarganegaraan yang masih berlaku dari negara lain atas namanya; atau

The world is getting smaller. There are many information sharing agreements, like common reporting standards and tax information agreements, between governments to ensure taxation. Governments are getting better at establishing citizenship and residency status every year. The U.S. and Indonesia established information sharing in 2018 and there is usually a couple year delay before people get a good look at the data. The Indonesian embassy may already be aware of your status.

but if i really had to choose i would choose the us as im fairly established here at this point socially and careerwise

So you are educated with a successful career in the U.S. and you want to break the law in a foreign country just to visit your family?