How do you guys invest?

[Banana72]

Managed to shy away from those Cryptos, Bot-trading, Forex, etc. So my money is well preserved.

Not the same story in the US. I admit got a bit greedy and FOMO on Covid stocks and EV. Jumped into pretty much everything from big name (Pfizer), hot ones (Moderna, Novavax) to way lesser known but supposedly high reward. All but Pfizer actually lost up to 90% of the value.

 

[make_batik_great_again]

I think many people made not-so-good decisions when the stock market went up, up, up and further up. Felt like nothing could happen to the earnings of the stock-listed companies.

I also speculated a little on a covid-hyped stock (Biontech). But at least, I did not buy at All-Time-High and only a smaller position. And I still hold it in my portfolio because I believe their technology (as well as Moderns‘s) could be used for other diseases in the future. I read Moderna just had quite strong results on a new anti-cancer product. The headlines alone already boost the stock’s price. What would happen then if that product really gets all permissions in a few years?

But of course, this is a longer-term speculation then and far from a „sure thing“. There are also risks, of course...so, in my view those stocks are meant for small positions only. But also the re-opening in China and the possibility that Biontech, Moderna and Co. might get allowed to offer their vaccine there are positive chances for those companies.

 

[Walter Schwager]

I lost a lot of money also, now moved to dividend investing via Interactive Brokers.

 

[Walter Schwager]

I lost a lot of money also, now moved to dividend investing via Interactive Brokers.

 

[pantaiema]

I lost a lot of money also, now moved to dividend investing via Interactive Brokers.

It is currently a bear market. Even you put your money in relatively safe environment such as in index: S&P500, NASDAQ100, DJIA, FTSE100, FTSE250 if you put your money early this year you were still experiencing your investment down around 30% such as what we saw in June this year.
People might have more chance to make money by trading it rather than investing, although it is not suggestible for those who have not familiarised themselves with trading.

 

[Will_M]

This market dip is great. Most stocks are now on sale. If there was a time to start investing this is the ideal opportunity.

 

[make_batik_great_again]

I lost a lot of money also, now moved to dividend investing via Interactive Brokers.

I think from a psychological perspective dividend strategies are a good thing...because you focus more on fundamental data (dividends, are the dividends safe or in danger, company‘s profits and cashflows etc.) and less on the stock‘s price.

Since the stock price can, short-term or even mid-term, be very irrational it is not a bad idea to find companies where you can focus on the dividend (and the fundamentals related to the question whether a dividend is safe or not). If the stock markets go irrational or even crazy, you can stay relaxed as long as the company‘s fundamentals and dividends are not in danger...which should be the case in case of many defensive stocks.

But still, me personally, I would add at least a few growth stock into my portfolio as well. Especially now that the price of many growth stocks became a little fairer.

 

[make_batik_great_again]

People might have more chance to make money by trading it rather than investing, although it is not suggestible for those who have not familiarised themselves with trading.

The basic scenario at the moment, indeed, is that the stock markets will stay volatile for a while. So, yeah, probably, people in trading will have some possibilities.

But I believe in what Benjamin Graham wrote and which many statistics have determined in the past centuries: Private investors should invest long-term. The very most of small private investors have no satisfying performance when trying trading or especially day-trading. Of course, there will be some who are able to have a nice performance for a while. But if you do it for many years and the influence of pure luck becomes less relevant, you will probably have a poor performance (except the very few pros).

 

[Wally]

I originally kept most of my investments in the UK (as I am British). Then some years ago the UK investment broker froze my account as I was non-resident. So I started moving funds to Singapore. Eventually I was able to unfreeze my UK account by convincing them of my UK address. However, some time ago, the Indonesian tax authorities found out about my investments in Singapore and pursued me for tax. I successfully updated my tax returns and paid a considerable amount of back tax and penalties. Now I have let my retirement KITAS lapse and become non-resident for tax purposes by living for less than 183 days in a calendar in Indonesia. So I no longer need to pay tax on overseas investments. But it complicates my staying in Indonesia

 

[harryopal1]

I originally kept most of my investments in the UK (as I am British). Then some years ago the UK investment broker froze my account as I was non-resident. So I started moving funds to Singapore. Eventually I was able to unfreeze my UK account by convincing them of my UK address. However, some time ago, the Indonesian tax authorities found out about my investments in Singapore and pursued me for tax. I successfully updated my tax returns and paid a considerable amount of back tax and penalties. Now I have let my retirement KITAS lapse and become non-resident for tax purposes by living for less than 183 days in a calendar in Indonesia. So I no longer need to pay tax on overseas investments. But it complicates my staying in Indonesia

So, what now? The new retirement visa requires lodging a big wad of cash in an Indonesian bank. Not an attractive proposition. What do you have in mind if you wish to stay here? Returning to the UK would seem like going back to a sinking ship.

 

[Will_M]

Your not the first person I have heard about fall foul of non-resident investasi in the UK whilst aboard. I heard of an English guy who was working in the Philippines had over 2mill GBP split between interactive investor and Hargreaves Landsdown I believe. Both accounts were froze and he was investigated for money laundering.

 

[Wally]

Your not the first person I have heard about fall foul of non-resident investasi in the UK whilst aboard. I heard of an English guy who was working in the Philippines had over 2mill GBP split between interactive investor and Hargreaves Landsdown I believe. Both accounts were froze and he was investigated for money laundering.

Yes, as well as supplying a UK address, I had to send copies of work contracts and pay slips. In those days I worked for international aid organizations and was not liable to Indonesian tax. I worked for an Indonesian company from 2018-20, which is when my tax troubles started. But hopefully they are sorted now

 

[Wally]

So, what now? The new retirement visa requires lodging a big wad of cash in an Indonesian bank. Not an attractive proposition. What do you have in mind if you wish to stay here? Returning to the UK would seem like going back to a sinking ship.

I have been in SE Asia for over 30 years. I also have a bolt hole in Laos, where I spend some of my . time. My two sons who were born here with my unmarried Indonesian partner of 31 years are working in Birmingham. So over the past couple of years we have been spending a few summer months in the UK, making a few visits to Laos and the rest in Indonesia - amounting to less than 183 here in Indonesia. I had a retirement KITAS but am now on a VoA which is good (with an extension) for up to 60 days. Not ideal but working so far.
Even when I was working visas were a continual problem. KITASes took months to arrange and were often held up by tensions between the donor and Government of Indonesia. We we often survived on multiple-entry business visas

 

[Will_M]

Honestly, I don't see the benefit of working abroad and moving money into a taxable UK stocks / trading account. A friend of mine also does it, although I have warned him of the potential problems later.

This year, we will look at some UK property to invest in but I’m thinking this could be an issue similar to stocks ?

 

[Wally]

As I am non-resident in the UK, dividends and capital gains are not taxable. But I don't get an income tax allowance. So the whole of my pensions are taxable

As I am non-resident in the UK, dividends and capital gains are not taxable. But I don't get an income tax allowance. So the whole of my pensions are taxable (state pension and partial teachers pension). I think my money is safer in the UK and management fees are much lower than on my Singapore account

 

[Will_M]

Previously invested shares in the UK (that were frozen) were subject to tax, were they not ?

 

[Wally]

Previously invested shares in the UK (that were frozen) were subject to tax, were they not ?

No they were not subject to tax. As I say, I am non-resident in the UK. As a result, share dividends and capital gains are not taxable. I fill in a UK tax return every year and declare my investments

 

[jstar]

I didn’t know that about the UK, I thought the the £2,000 limit was for everybody? Anyway, in US, NL, BE, NO, IT and many others it doesn’t make a difference if you‘re resident or not; you will be screwed. It’s better in HK and Spore.

 

[Wally]

Here are the relevant UK HMRC regulations:
If you aren’t resident in the UK, the tax you pay on all your income can’t be more than:

• the amount of tax that would be chargeable on income, other than the ‘disregarded income’ shown below, but before the deduction of any personal allowances due
• plus the amount of tax deducted at source from the ‘disregarded income’

‘Disregarded income’ includes:

• interest and alternative finance receipts from banks and building societies
• dividends from UK companies
• income from unit trusts
• income from National Savings and Investments
• profits from public revenue dividends
• profits or gains from transactions in deposits
• certain social security benefits, such as State pensions or widows’ pensions
• taxable income from purchased life annuities except annuities under personal pension schemes

 

[make_batik_great_again]

I didn’t know that about the UK, I thought the the £2,000 limit was for everybody? Anyway, in US, NL, BE, NO, IT and many others it doesn’t make a difference if you‘re resident or not; you will be screwed. It’s better in HK and Spore.

What do you mean? If you live in Indonesia but still keep your broker from the EU, why should you be screwed? What I heard about Germany and non-residents for example is the following:

There are banks (of course, by far not all, but there are some...) which continue offering their brokerage service even if you are not a resident in Germany anymore. It is sufficient to have a post adress (friends/family) so that the broker can send you important mail.

In Germany, the tax is usually deducted automatically from dividends and capital gains. But if you send a formular and proof (confirmation of the ministry of finance) that you are a resident in another state and not taxable in Germany anymore, the bank also stops this automatical deduction. You have to declare and pay taxes by yourself in the country where you are taxable then of course.

So, if you declare and pay the taxes on your capital income (also that part from your broker in the EU) in Indonesia then, why should you be ‚screwed‘?