High-Ranking Indonesian Police Turn On Each Other

snpark

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Is this the rape case from G20 with the female army and the Joko security guy?

Or did you see the politicians fighting in Bali (Jokowi party) about the vote for leadership, my friend said it was a "lucrative" position and it all kicked off into a riot, proper handbags
 

pantaiema

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Police should be investigating the thieves but now turn to become the thieves themselves.
Let alone the thieves are now try bribing or stealing from the other thieves.

"A video recently went viral containing testimony from Ismail Bolong, a former police officer, admitting to paying bribes to a number of police including the head of the Criminal Investigation Department, Cmdr. Gen. Agus Andrianto. Ismail, who has retired from the police force, claimed to have given Rp6 billion (US$385,000) in 2021 to Agus so that his illegal coal mining business in East Kalimantan could continue to run smoothly.

Ismail's statement was confirmed by Ferdy Sambo, the former head of the internal affairs of the National Police who is currently on trial for masterminding the murder of his bodyguard Brigadier Yosua Hutabarat, who was rumored to be having an affair with Sambo’s wife. Ismail's testimony, Sambo said, is in accordance with a report on the results of an investigation he conducted while still in office, that there had been "coordinating money" from illegal mining entrepreneurs to the police, one of whom was Agus
"

I love this statement (as below), at least there are some efforts to reveal all of the dirtiest secret among the Indonesian high ranking policemen.

“Jokowi is letting this roll,” said a western businessman. The government, Mahfud said, will cooperate with the KPK, the anti-graft agency, to uncover police involvement in illegal businesses including mining, fisheries, forestry, food, and others. "We must immediately reduce this (war) by solving the root of the problem,” Mahfud said.
 
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BliGundul

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Absolute power corrupts absolutely?
Many years ago I heard that it cost about 100 juta to join the police force at the entry level.
A preemptive payment for what is often abused and misconstrued as a license to steal under color of authority. Is it any wonder then that this misbehaviour is accepted as the norm? I suspect that fee is appreciably higher these days. The road to easy street is paved with less than honorable intentions. Wherever you go, there you are. The whole concept of "Honor among Thieves" reeks of naivete.
 
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fastpitch17

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Absolute power corrupts absolutely?
Many years ago I heard that it cost about 100 juta to join the police force at the entry level.
A preemptive payment for what is often abused and misconstrued as a license to steal under color of authority. Is it any wonder then that this misbehaviour is accepted as the norm? I suspect that fee is appreciably higher these days. The road to easy street is paved with less than honorable intentions. Wherever you go, there you are. The whole concept of "Honor among Thieves" reeks of naivete.
Last I heard from the law enforcement people was 30 juta for police, 100 juta for areas like AG. It is probably more money making than one thinks. Even though you pay, you can still be rejected with no refund. It is only a fee to get an application in but no guarantee of acceptance. Who you know or are related to helps a great deal also.

I have one nephew who applied for police 3 times before being accepted. His father paid each time. I have another nephew who applied for AG and was rejected. His father footed the bill. He actually knew and was related to higher ups in the AGO. Didn't matter. One of thoes reletives informed the even higher ups that most of the kid's university was completed by friends and paid students. Basically, while having a degree in law he knew nothing about law. Oh, maybe that should have been a qualification. Guess not. Now he hangs a Notary sign up but it seems his only clients are his mother and some of her friends. Good thing his mother set him up with a doctor while she supports him and his family. Oh the image.
 

pantaiema

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Basically, while having a degree in law he knew nothing about law. Oh, maybe that should have been a qualification. Guess not. Now he hangs a Notary sign up but it seems his only clients are his mother and some of her friends. Good thing his mother set him up with a doctor while she supports him and his family. Oh the image.
There are a few universities in Indonesia are operating like that. Fortunately there are still a few people with dedication and integrity to their profession.
Example like this
7 Hasanuddin University Professors Resigns: Forced to Graduate Students who do not meet the criteria. It is in Indonesian but people could use google translate.
Just imagine if these sort of graduates manage to become doctors, pharmacies, nurses, etc.
In the past it was only the applicants who meet criteria, have passed the tough test that force them to compete with other applicants could be admitted to medical school. Nowadays, there are a special route by paying a few hundred million IDR. Doing this, you could be admitted to medical school even you do not pass the the test in the first instance. This thing happens in state funded universities, not private universities.
I am pretty sure, this sort of practice exist everywhere in the world, but I think they exist in a different scale and they are not announced openly.
 
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fastpitch17

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Perhaps a few police have turned on other police and sure, it looks good in the media but, the closed police society will not change. They will still protect themselves within and carry on quite like how they have been. Sure, they will tweek this and that as rules or leadership changes but it will still basically be the same. The police are molded into a corrupt organization starting with the lowest office. They learn to take every advantage they can. Then, as they get promoted they promote their greed along with it and eventually when they reach the highest office you get what has been reported lately. It will die down and things will go back to the way they were.

If one looks, there is no difference with the likes of the TNI. While less options to take advantage of, many still find illegal ways to pad their income.

Ministries are the same. From RTs to Govenors. DPR and all legislative groups. Up and down the government ranks. Corruption is woven into Indonesian society. No one is surprised by it.

The biggest reason for such wide spread corruption and why it is accepted is the people who give into it. If people stopped paying and started reporting, you would see a decline.
 

harryopal

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The biggest reason for such wide spread corruption and why it is accepted is the people who give into it. If people stopped paying and started reporting, you would see a decline.
The irony is that on this and other forums, expats not infrequently point out ways to bribe their way past police or to get other services.
 

fastpitch17

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The irony is that on this and other forums, expats not infrequently point out ways to bribe their way past police or to get other services.
It is also the case that on this and other forums that contributers say don't be part of the problem. I pay a RT and Lurah for services I need. I offer, they don't ask. Everyone else I say no to simply by asking for an official reciept for any money they may ask for. Let's face it. Once you start paying they keep that in mind and each time becomes more. Don't be the problem.
 

HappyMan

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You can't fight every battle, or at least I can't.

Last time I had to apply for (not renew) my automobile driver's license, I think I made around 10 trips to the police office. Not everyone has that kind of time to spend (I wouldn't now). I'm not the best driver, but I'm certainly not the worst either. I don't hit things that don't hit me first and I don't need any fucking help parking.

The system is designed to be absurdly difficult with everything from a simulator machine that you get no time to familiarize yourself with before being tested with to a car with a ragged out clutch that you are supposed to be able to instantly hill start (I've driven an automatic for around 15 years now). There were people there who had failed the driving portion itself (something like) 10 times. Hell, I want to say there was a guy on his 7th attempt at the simulator (but my memories tend to exaggerate).

It isn't hard to see how your average citizen does their math, unknown number of missed days of work/embarrassment vs flat fee and go home with their bit of plastic. If they are buying a car then they probably have the money to pay... (just to take away from my own story here, I think you can actually skip the driving bit of the test by going to a driving school now... I bet I know where some of the fees go though)

I'm not saying that I would encourage people to buy their licenses or that I think it is best for society or anything, but I really understand why they would and I'm not angry about it. They need that (arbitrarily withheld) bit of plastic to work or transport their family. You can't put all the onus for change on the backs of the individual citizens. Not everyone is strong enough to fight the system. Sometimes the system is so broken that you actually need to fix it before you can expect anyone to use it.

Somewhat unrelated, as a foreigner (here for some 13 years now) I don't feel I have a lot of right/standing to push for change on these things. And, I don't want to voluntarily be the tallest poppy. So, if I saw a petition or rally to improve the testing facilities at the local licensing office, I'd steer clear of it. Guess I'm admitting to a certain combination of laziness and cowardliness, but I can't afford to make problems for myself. I just can't do it to myself or my family. Guess I'm saying that if I talk about the need for progress and change in Indonesia... even I know it is only talk.
 

MamangDudul

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You can't fight every battle, or at least I can't.

Last time I had to apply for (not renew) my automobile driver's license, I think I made around 10 trips to the police office. Not everyone has that kind of time to spend (I wouldn't now). I'm not the best driver, but I'm certainly not the worst either. I don't hit things that don't hit me first and I don't need any fucking help parking.

The system is designed to be absurdly difficult with everything from a simulator machine that you get no time to familiarize yourself with before being tested with to a car with a ragged out clutch that you are supposed to be able to instantly hill start (I've driven an automatic for around 15 years now). There were people there who had failed the driving portion itself (something like) 10 times. Hell, I want to say there was a guy on his 7th attempt at the simulator (but my memories tend to exaggerate).

It isn't hard to see how your average citizen does their math, unknown number of missed days of work/embarrassment vs flat fee and go home with their bit of plastic. If they are buying a car then they probably have the money to pay... (just to take away from my own story here, I think you can actually skip the driving bit of the test by going to a driving school now... I bet I know where some of the fees go though)

I'm not saying that I would encourage people to buy their licenses or that I think it is best for society or anything, but I really understand why they would and I'm not angry about it. They need that (arbitrarily withheld) bit of plastic to work or transport their family. You can't put all the onus for change on the backs of the individual citizens. Not everyone is strong enough to fight the system. Sometimes the system is so broken that you actually need to fix it before you can expect anyone to use it.

Somewhat unrelated, as a foreigner (here for some 13 years now) I don't feel I have a lot of right/standing to push for change on these things. And, I don't want to voluntarily be the tallest poppy. So, if I saw a petition or rally to improve the testing facilities at the local licensing office, I'd steer clear of it. Guess I'm admitting to a certain combination of laziness and cowardliness, but I can't afford to make problems for myself. I just can't do it to myself or my family. Guess I'm saying that if I talk about the need for progress and change in Indonesia... even I know it is only talk.
Well said and I know exactly what you mean. Sure, some might call it being a coward but I don't have the intention to have a big mouth here or to start Demos or whatnot. If the Indonesian people can't or don't want to fix their country then we, as foreigners, also have no deal in involving.
I feel like as outsiders it is not our job to involve in the business of other countries and on top of that they surely don't want us to involve. We just have to accept that maybe not everything is on par with our views or our "great" western democracies or we can just leave.
 

Hawk256

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Well said and I know exactly what you mean. Sure, some might call it being a coward but I don't have the intention to have a big mouth here or to start Demos or whatnot. If the Indonesian people can't or don't want to fix their country then we, as foreigners, also have no deal in involving.
I feel like as outsiders it is not our job to involve in the business of other countries and on top of that they surely don't want us to involve. We just have to accept that maybe not everything is on par with our views or our "great" western democracies or we can just leave.
You said everything I would want to say about the subject. I can't think of one time an Indonesian has asked my opinion about anything, nor should they feel the need to.
 

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