'Golden Visa' Ministerial Decree 22/2023

[centurion]

Ok Golden Visa is here and many new things. The new regulation was published last week and the whole immigration system is turned upside down. Many strict rules coming, effective immidiately. Investor visa requires 10billion now, ex Indonesians start from 15.000 USD obligatory investments. Link to the regulation enclosed.

Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 – Paralegal.id

Download Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 tentang Visa dan Izin Tinggal

paralegal.id

Moderation note: This post has been separated from the other Golden visa thread because it now contains concrete information that can be discussed in its own thread.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

You say the whole immigration system is turned upside down, but I don't think the rules for spouse kitas/kitap have been changed?

 

[nd_eric_77]

Also, IMTA / employment KITAS has not changed. Personally, I will not be affected because I am on a spousal KITAS and working for an employer that has an IMTA for me. (Why would nd_eric_77 want to have a spousal KITAS instead of a fully employer-sponsored KITAS? Glad you asked. Because I am free to do freelance work beyond the one employer.)

 

[dannyboy]

If I am not mistaken... "ex Indonesians start from 15.000 USD obligatory investments" in Pasal 52 is only applicable to those applying without penjamin/sponsor.

Though I find it quite interesting, why would any ex-WNI return to the country without sponsor?

 

[centurion]

You say the whole immigration system is turned upside down, but I don't think the rules for spouse kitas/kitap have been changed?

Spouse sponsored rules are mostly untouched. The biggest change is the investor visa requiring 10 billion now. Generally, there is a trend of more strict rules in foreign investments in the last decade, and doing business gets harder all the time.

Pension visa is somehow reinstated with age above 60, with 3.000 USD/month requirement (how to prove that is not precisely defined-pension slip? yearly deposit?).
Remote worker visa requires 60.000 USD salary per year, or 5.000 USD per month.

 

[Dave70]

Ok Golden Visa is here and many new things. The new regulation was published last week and the whole immigration system is turned upside down. Many strict rules coming, effective immidiately. Investor visa requires 10billion now, ex Indonesians start from 15.000 USD obligatory investments. Link to the regulation enclosed.

Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 – Paralegal.id

Download Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 tentang Visa dan Izin Tinggal

paralegal.id

Moderation note: This post has been separated from the other Golden visa thread because it now contains concrete information that can be discussed in its own thread.

10billion is authorized capital or paid-up capital ?

What happens to those who had obtained investor visas years ago (but below 10billion) ?

 

[SamR]

Though I find it quite interesting, why would any ex-WNI return to the country without sponsor?

I'm going to re-read again more closely to be certain but what I'm seeing is that ex-WNIs can now apply to stay in Indonesia without any sponsors being required anymore. Try to look for the keyword "tanpa penjamin" in the file and other than seniors wishing to retire Indonesia and "Tokoh Dunia", you can see that it only applies for ex-WNIs.

I think for the last decade or so, even though ex-WNIs are acknowledged as a category, there hasn't been anything tangible to go alongside this status when going through the immigration processes. You can be an ex-WNI, but ultimately your Kitas/Kitap is on the basis of being sponsored by your spouse rather than because you're an ex-WNI. So in this regard, no longer being required to have a sponsor is a step forward for the ex-WNI. I am definitely curious how things will play out for future "exes" wanting to return to Indonesia under this rule.

Edit:
OK, now wondering how much of a step forward this is when reading that as a condition of being granted a Kitas without a sponsor, the ex-WNI will be required to buy obligasi (bonds?), saham (stocks?) and reksadana (???) worth the amount stated in the regulation.

 

[dannyboy]

OK, now wondering how much of a step forward this is when reading that as a condition of being granted a Kitas without a sponsor, the ex-WNI will be required to buy obligasi (bonds?), saham (stocks?) and reksadana (???) worth the amount stated in the regulation.

My point exactly...Will there be there any Exes willing to invest for that amount of money without any ties to a possible sponsor (spouse/relatives/employer) in the country?

 

[centurion]

10billion is authorized capital or paid-up capital ?

What happens to those who had obtained investor visas years ago (but below 10billion) ?

Subscribed and paid-up capital (basically shares owned).

I suppose if they are on lifetime KITAP, they are on the safe side. If they need to extend from 5 years to indefinite, who knows.

 

[Hermes]

Does the new law affect the ability of foreigners to 'live' in Indonesia on a never ending series of social visit visas? If not, then it may be better for retirees and nomads to go that route, as under the new law the minimum income requirements have a big sting in the tail - they will form the basis for annual Indonesian income tax calculations, as it will be assumed by the Finance Ministry that these individuals possess at least that amount in taxable income. Better to stay on a social visit visa, since Indonesia doesn't enforce the 183 day rule for tax residence, nor does it allow social visit visa holders to obtain an NPWP.

 

[Samoerai]

Ok Golden Visa is here and many new things. The new regulation was published last week and the whole immigration system is turned upside down. Many strict rules coming, effective immidiately. Investor visa requires 10billion now, ex Indonesians start from 15.000 USD obligatory investments. Link to the regulation enclosed.

Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 – Paralegal.id

Download Peraturan Menteri Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Nomor 22 Tahun 2023 tentang Visa dan Izin Tinggal

paralegal.id

Moderation note: This post has been separated from the other Golden visa thread because it now contains concrete information that can be discussed in its own thread.

I cannot speak bahasa Indonesia, rely on Google translate, but ... as far as I understand this document ... I don't see anything about 10 billion rupiah for an investor visa. I read US$2.500.000 for investor visa. Am I wrong?

 

[pantaiema]

Also, IMTA / employment KITAS has not changed. Personally, I will not be affected because I am on a spousal KITAS and working for an employer that has an IMTA for me. (Why would nd_eric_77 want to have a spousal KITAS instead of a fully employer-sponsored KITAS? Glad you asked. Because I am free to do freelance work beyond the one employer.)

I wonder, is it true and stated clearly in the regulation/law? Could you do that officially, or is it a grey area? Differentiate between doing freelance as a hobby or freelance as a source of income (e.g., work) so it will attract an income tax.

I remember reading in this forum that someone is arguing otherwise. I personally have not investigated this matter, so I am asking.

It is probably good to discuss this if someone could direct it to the authoritative sources, e.g., regulation/law, not using one's own interpretation. In many other countries if you are on spouse visa, you could work with no restrictions. You are even entitled to benefit and other social security.

But like many things in Indonesia, unless it is stated explicitly with no ambiguity, indonesian officials interpret the law/regulation differently The same with BPJS; some retired expats manage to get BPJS some do not.

But I think the main difference between getting BPJS and working under a spouse visa is that, with BPJS, they will need to approve it first. So, once you get approval, all the future burden will be on the official who approved it. But working under a spouse visa means that you are assuming you are allowed until it is proven otherwise. You do not apply for a work permit. You might get caught someday, where this mean is tested. When the assumption is wrong you might get fined and deported.

 

[snpark]

Arguing in this forum? Never.

 

[Hawk256]

I wonder, is it true and stated clearly in the regulation/law? Could you do that officially, or is it a grey area? Differentiate between doing freelance as a hobby or freelance as a source of income (e.g., work) so it will attract an income tax.

Not sure that I have seen a definititive answer either way. A lot of stories but light on facts. I can say that the only times I have known someone to get in actual trouble is when money is involved. I just don't deal with it, I have enough problems without making a new one for a few dollars here and there. YMMV.

 

[Samoerai]

In the Dutch newspaper Telegraaf, 4 September 2023

Indonesia wants to attract foreign investors by providing so-called 'golden visas'. Depending on the amount invested, lenders can stay in the country for a certain period of several years. Indonesia wants to use this to stimulate the economy in the country.
Buying shares of Indonesian companies or government bonds counts as an investment, as does the deposit in a savings or deposit account in the country. The higher the amount, the longer the allowed stay. For example, someone who invests $350,000 qualifies for a five-year residency. At $700,000, that's ten years. Golden visa holders are expected to enjoy exclusive benefits. They no longer have to apply for a temporary residence permit.

Second home
Last year Indonesia introduced a 'second home visa' for wealthy tourists who have at least 2 billion Indonesian rupiah in their bank account. That is about € 121,000.

Indonesia is not the first country to issue golden visas. The United States, Ireland, New Zealand and Spain have introduced similar visas to attract foreign capital and high net worth residents.

 

[snpark]

exclusive benefits? For €700,000. Lol

 

[snpark]

I think I will keep my €700k in my own bank and just fly to Monaco once or twice a year and come back to Indonesia for a long meeting

Or make my own PT and be a director with imta kitas npwp bjps for less than $5k.

 

[Helpful Herbert]

I still don't get the point of this visa. Who is going to tie up 700k Euro in order to be able to stay in Indonesia for 10 years? The only benefit they have stated is that you don't need to go to the immigration office so often?
The only group of people that this could help could be money launderers - if they have 700k which is "hard to explain" I'm sure the Indonesians won't ask questions, so they can deposit it, and after 10 years it has been successfully washed and considered as legitimate money.

 

[pantaiema]

I still don't get the point of this visa. Who is going to tie up 700k Euro in order to be able to stay in Indonesia for 10 years? The only benefit they have stated is that you don't need to go to the immigration office so often?
The only group of people that this could help could be money launderers - if they have 700k which is "hard to explain" I'm sure the Indonesians won't ask questions, so they can deposit it, and after 10 years it has been successfully washed and considered as legitimate money.

Government officials in Indonesia use the issue of new regulations and new program schemes just to demonstrate their seriousness about their work. The problem here is that they are not held accountable for the failures of previous programs they have initiated. They are even rewarded with promotions.

A good example of this is the second home visa program, which was recently launched for those who have at least 2 billion Indonesian rupiahs (approximately EUR 121K) in their bank accounts. The result can be seen

Kepemilikan Properti Warga Asing di RI Naik 52 Persen pada Periode 2020-2023

INBISNIS.ID, JAKARTA - Properti di Indonesia semakin ramai dibidik warga negara asing (WNA). Hal ini dipicu sejumlah relaksasi yang diberikan pemerintah melalui

inbisnis.id

According to the source, "there were 52 foreign-owned units, and from 2020 to 2023, an additional 79 units were purchased, bringing the total number to 131 units." Anyone could easily see that EUR 700K is much more than EUR 121K, with no substantial benefits. If EUR 121K did not work, how could you expect EUR 700K to work? Also keep in mind this program still subject to the worldwide taxation where the income earned anywhere else in the world (not just in Indonesia) is taxable by the Indonesian tax authorities, no social security, benefits from the government. Have I missed something here?

The problem here is that those who make these blunders are not held accountable for their decisions. Instead of facing punishment, they are being rewarded. If Indonesia, as a great country, wants to see significant development, this culture needs to change drastically. Instead of being rewarded, individuals responsible for such decisions should be named and shamed and possibly punished.

 

[Dave70]

Silmy menjelaskan pemegang golden visa dapat memanfaatkan sejumlah manfaat eksklusif selain masa berlaku yang lebih lama, di antaranya kemudahan keluar dan masuk Indonesia dan efisiensi waktu karena mereka tidak perlu lagi mengurus Izin Tinggal Terbatas (ITAS) ke kantor imigrasi.

"Begitu sampai di Indonesia, mereka (pemegang golden visa) tidak perlu lagi mengurus izin tinggal terbatas (ITAS) di kantor imigrasi," kata Silmy.

Dirjen: Golden visa untuk datangkan WNA berkualitas ke Indonesia

Direktur Jenderal Imigrasi Kementerian Hukum dan Hak Asasi Manusia Silmy Karim mengatakan kebijakan golden visa yang diluncurkan pada tahun ini ...

www.antaranews.com

So holders of Golden Visa don't need KITAS (nor KITAP), I assume their passport will be stamped with 5 or 10 years stay permit, and that's it, they can come and go as they like, no need for MERP.