ExpatIndo Twitter derail discussion

centurion

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Moderation note: This thread has been split off from a different one due to it being off-topic from the original thread. You can find that thread here.

And since this is not "The Cage", someday my comment here could get me deported or hidden away in a tropical gulag, but I believe in what I said.
Don't worry, expatindo.org Twitter account looks like the first candidate, it already has government
bots in its comments.

For the record, Jokowi is the best, and the harvest this year has been amazing!
 
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dafluff

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Don't worry, expatindo.org Twitter account looks like the first candidate, it already has government
bots in its comments.

The Twitter account can definitely become very pro-gov't on short notice. Just need a BUMN commissioner position. Just a mid-tier one is fine...need to be realistic here.
 

centurion

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"Three fishermen who helped Rohingya refugees stranded near Aceh and took them to shore were sentenced to 5 years for breaking immigration law. Meanwhile, a prosecutor guilty of taking bribes from a fugitive who snuck into Indonesia, conspiracy, and money laundering, got 4 years."

This is a little bit stupid and not a very smart, political comment on the Twitter feed. You are criticizing openly the Indonesian judicial branch, the third arm of the GOI, and putting the forum on the radar. I noticed some government bots already.

In the weakest form, the Indonesians would arrogantly say: don't like it, leave. The Indian Ocean is not the Rio Grande, and Indonesia is not the US.

In the strongest form, cybercrime anti-defamation anti-blasphemy unit would investigate, lapor to imigrasi and at the end all moderators' work permits would be revoked.
 

dafluff

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This is a little bit stupid and not a very smart, political comment on the Twitter feed.

I noticed some government bots already.

A little bit stupid AND not very smart? Ouch, that hurt coming from you.

Not sure what the gov't bots are doing, since the Twitter feed is unlocked and using APIs they can get every single thing ever tweeted on it sans bots.
 
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centurion

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It is legitimate to question to ask will openly and publicly criticizing the Indonesian government attracts unwanted attention, especially if done by some forum, mostly consisted of foreigners. This will probably formally become a criminal offence in the near future if the new Penal Law is adopted.

The question was just to remind you that there is a thin line from being on the right side of history to being on the wrong side of the law. You can make a point in the discussion, but making points against the government publicly (promoting publicly healthy discussion and free speech?) jeopardizes the discussion here. Especially if you are making points against the legal system, the same one that you are probably not in compliance. Your right is to jeopardize yourself, but doing that to others is not right.
 

HappyMan

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That is a bit bitter for me, centurion. This forum is the one place I feel able to openly express my opinions. When I meet up with someone for lunch and they tell me (for example) about how freedom in America is a huge problem that causes divorce, child pregnancy, etc, I only ever object to their flawed numbers, and never the origins of their biases. I try to be polite or academic when people start comparing religions, no matter how annoyingly oblivious their approach is.

It eats at me a little, nodding and making noncommittal sounds while I listen to it all. This forum helps with that, makes me feel less alone and far from home, less like a censored minority. I need this place to be a place where people can say what they want to, even if every other forum member will jump down their throat about it. I need the chance to argue without consequences.
 

Ruserious

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This forum is the one place I feel able to openly express my opinions

I agree but isn't that why we don't want posting on twitter that would raise the wrong kind of attention to the forum and jeapodise it.

Why does the forum even need a twitter account? It's not serving in the interest of the forum as a group.
 

HappyMan

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I agree but isn't that why we don't want posting on twitter that would raise the wrong kind of attention to the forum and jeapodise it.

Why does the forum even need a twitter account? It's not serving in the interest of the forum as a group.
Yeah. Sorry, hadn't been keeping up with the Twitter feed and completely missed centurion's actual, specific, point. I'm a dumbass.
 

dafluff

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centurion said:

It is legitimate to question to ask will openly and publicly criticizing the Indonesian government attracts unwanted attention, especially if done by some forum, mostly consisted of foreigners.
This forum is on the internet, and Google still works. It has also been decades since the internet has become mainstream, and I trust that everyone now understands that anything they post on this forum can be seen by anyone.

centurion said:
The question was just to remind you that there is a thin line from being on the right side of history to being on the wrong side of the law. You can make a point in the discussion, but making points against the government publicly (promoting publicly healthy discussion and free speech?) jeopardizes the discussion here.
I appreciate your concerns, but frankly, it's none of your business what I do or do not do with my Twitter account. For those wondering, I have linked the Tweet in question below.

It contains two translated headlines, sourced from local, reputable media, with links to the original articles in the second tweet.


centurion said:
Especially if you are making points against the legal system, the same one that you are probably not in compliance.
This is an incredibly rude assumption but has now become expected from you. You can rest assured that my compliance with Indonesian law is as good as it can be considering the nature of it, and also once again, none of your business.

centurion said:
Your right is to jeopardize yourself, but doing that to others is not right.
I have absolutely no ability to put anyone on these forums in jeopardy, no matter what I Tweet. But you already knew that, didn't you? If you were sincere in your concern for me or other board members (ha!) you would have brought it up constructively. Instead, you responded to a 3-month-old post with a swipe at my Twitter post. Then when responded to with humor, you took another swipe at me. The third time, you still took another swipe at me. Finally, on the 4th attempt, you came up with a semblance of reasoning. Obviously in search of sympathy from other forum members, rather than out of any altruistic desire on your part.

PS:
centurion said:
In the strongest form, cybercrime anti-defamation anti-blasphemy unit would investigate, lapor to imigrasi and at the end all moderators' work permits would be revoked.
While I find you having a go at me to be amusing from time to time, please know that I will not tolerate any rudeness to my fellow moderators. So this had better be failed attempt at humor because if it is decided that it isn't, you won't have to worry in the least that your participation on these forums will land you in jeopardy going forward.
 

dafluff

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Why does the forum even need a twitter account? It's not serving in the interest of the forum as a group.
The forum doesn't have a Twitter account.

I have a Twitter account that I post specifically to increase the visibility of the forum and perhaps attract new members. Additionally, it serves as a point of contact for tech support in situations when the website/forum is down.

Forums in general are not really a growing form of communication, largely having been superseded by various social media. Therefore I feel it is necessary to try and attract new members using social media tools available to me.
 

Ruserious

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I appreciate your concerns, but frankly, it's none of your business what I do or do not do with my Twitter account. For those wondering, I have linked the Tweet in question below.

Bullshit. You have a twitter account that uses the name of the forum. The value of the forum is from all the members here posting. If you use this forum name as the name of your twitter account then you are effectively posting for all of us.

Therefore I feel it is necessary to try and attract new members using social media tools available to me.

I agree with trying to attract new members and when you stuck to posting usefull information about covid or visa rules that was great. When you start adding your opinions then it becomes an issue.
 

dafluff

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Bullshit. You have a twitter account that uses the name of the forum. The value of the forum is from all the members here posting. If you use this forum name as the name of your twitter account then you are effectively posting for all of us.
With all due respect, this is ridiculous. If I ever were to post for all of us, I would need to create a poll to obtain everyone's permission before ever posting a single tweet. Also, the Twitter account refers to ExpatIndo.org which is the website, which also has a forum.

When you start adding your opinions then it becomes an issue.
If you are truly worried that being a member of a forum where a related Twitter account occasionally posts news articles is putting you in jeopardy, then I don't really know what to tell you.
 

snpark

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So the expat Indo Twitter account is not an official one? Just one that someone operates pretending to be expat Indo?
Even with good intentions how is that allowed?

What if I open one and call it "therealexpatindo" ?
 

Helpful Herbert

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So the expat Indo Twitter account is not an official one? Just one that someone operates pretending to be expat Indo?
Well I think he's the owner, so that makes it official. Expatindo is not a publically listed company. It's not the same as a Jakarta Post journalist setting up a Twitter account in the name of the Jakarta Post without telling his boss!
 

dafluff

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So the expat Indo Twitter account is not an official one? Just one that someone operates pretending to be expat Indo?
There is no "official" Expat Indo Twitter, which is one verified by Twitter (blue checkmark). The account I quoted in this thread is operated by me, who is also one of the operators of this site. This is also why there is a feed to it on this site, and I obviously wouldn't link to a feed from a complete random account. In that way, it is official.

Even with good intentions how is that allowed?

What if I open one and call it "therealexpatindo" ?
You can start a Twitter account with that name, and there is nothing I or anyone can do about it. This is why this whole brouhaha is even more hysterical than it is. Check out how many Twitter accounts "Elon Musk" has, or any other famous name.
 

dafluff

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Yes and apparently it is none of our business what is said there.

Correct. You have no control over (and obviously are not responsible for) internet/social media accounts that are not yours. I don't understand why this is so difficult to grasp.
 
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