Discussion on content quality.

El_Goretto

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And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs. Thank you very much @dafluff for taking the time to write these posts!
 

Vanhelsing

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And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs. Thank you very much @dafluff for taking the time to write these posts!


Go for your requirement of "high quality content" and see if you get enough traffic to persuade any advertiser to spend money on a site that has five contributors a day (yourselves). You disenfranchise a huge number of potential members with your grandiose idea that ExpatIndo should be known as some kind of Indonesia expat intelligentsia that places itself above the common man.

Keep dipping into your pockets to support your site and cabal. With this continuing attitude and approach you'll be dead in the water within a year.

Some of us have as much a love of Indonesia as the next person, but we may lack the education, the abiltiy to articulate our ideas, thought or opinions to the extent of others, but still wish to contribute in some way to a forum that relates to Indonesia.

Your site, raise the bar as high as you like, enjoy the tumbleweeds.

ExpatIndo appears to value a certain type of member way above another.
 

Davita

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And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs. Thank you very much @dafluff for taking the time to write these posts!

I have the highest regard for you E-G but honestly...what prompted you to post the above quote.:doh:.... I find it offensive.
All members try their best to communicate their point. It isn't everyone that does it well but, every member is equal and do not need to be reminded that some posts, or comments, are better than others...but that's open for all members to debate.
 

Vanhelsing

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And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs.....

... every member is equal and do not need to be reminded that some posts, or comments, are better than others..

E-G smacks so hard of elitism right now, it hurts.
 

Davita

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E-G smacks so hard of elitism right now, it hurts.

Come on Van....please calm down.
E_G is the genius IT of this forum. There wouldn't be a forum without him and he should have our respect.
I agree that his post appears insulting but...haven't we all done things we regret...I suggest we give him some credit and space.

edit: nanti sikit....dafluff didn't write the original post.....he copied/pasted and did the proper thing by attributing the source.
I can now see that E_G wanted to advise the rest of us how to best post when attributing to other authors. I always ascribe to the concept of avoiding plagiarism and therefore agree.
However, even If that's the case.....perhaps E_G could have posted his explanation in a more conciliatory manner.
 

Daniel50

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President Joko Widodo delivered his annual state of the nation address on the floor of the Consultative People Assembly (MPR) on August 16, 2017, one day before celebrating the nation's 72nd Independence Day. The annual speech usually reviews the government's achievements of the past year. It further outlines their goal for the coming year.

View attachment 266President Joko Widodo in tradtional South Sulawesi garb, after delivering the 2017 State of the Nation (ANTARA FOTO/Akbar Nugroho Gumay)

Jokowi, as he is popularly known, addressed the issues of the nations diversity and the achievement of its people. It further warns of Indonesia's dependency on the natural resources sector. Here are some other the highlights of the speech:

Indonesia must abandon the negative mentality of bickering, framing and attacking each other. He blames colonial attitudes for the low self esteem and pessimistic views, and asks that Indonesians build a strong cultural foundation. To strive for unity in dealing with a complex and increasingly extremist world.

The government will renew focus on economic equality, fighting poverty and reducing unemployment. He cites a modest decrease in people living under the poverty line, from 28.59 million (Mar 2015) to 27.77 million (Mar 2017), and improvement to the Gini Coeficcient to 0.393 (Mar 2017) from 0.414 (Sept 2014).

The government increased budget transfers to the village levels (Dana Desa), to Rp 60 trillion (approx USD 4.5 billion) in 2017. These funds are to be used by local governments to give basic infrastructure such as drinking water.

The nation has reached 92% electrification on March 2017. He congratulated the people of Wogalirit Village in Sikka, East Nusa Tenggara, who finally after 72 years of independence have access to electricity. Jokowi has set a target of 97% electrification by 2019.

To support micro, small and medium enterprises, the government has extended loans totalling Rp 94.4 trillion (approx USD 7 billion) in 2016, and set the Credit for Business (Kredit Usaha Rakyat - KUR) rate at 9%.

Indonesia's Human Development Index (HDI) has increased from 69.90 in 2014 to 70.18 in 2016, which places Indonesia as a high HDI country. Jokowi credits government social programs as a factor for the increase. These include Kartu Indonesia Sehat (Indonesian Health Card - subsidized health care), Kartu Indonesia Pintar (Indonesian Smart Card - tuition subsidies for poor children), Jaminan Kesehatan Nasional (National Healthcare insurance), and Pemberian Makanan Tambahan (Supplemental food for Mothers and Children).

Jokowi thanked the DPR on recently passing law on Financial Information Access for Taxation, and Automatic Exchange of Information, and mentions it as a way to bolster the national budget, as well as fighting corruption.

Further, the government continues their attempt to deregulate the economy. Having released no less than 15 economic policy packages since 2015, Indonesia has seen modest increase in their Ease of Doing Business rankings. It has climbed from 106th in 2016 to 91st in 2017. He also mentioned the recent increase of Indonesian sovereign debt to investment grade by the big 3 ranking agencies, S&P, Moody's and Fitch.

Sources:

https://tirto.id/teks-lengkap-pidato-kenegaraan-presiden-jokowi-cuFy
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2017/08/16/electrification-on-track-jokowi.html

Now, if they could just convict Setya Novanto, put him in jail for a long time and strip some of his wealth. They would really be on the right track.

Van I doubt if there are any elite on the forum anyways just regular folk some with a little more or less education and some with a little more or less money. Some with higher education don't necessarily have higher intelligence anyways and I doubt there are many "super rich" either just regular people with a little more or less of a few things. And I think it is good to cut E_G some slack none of us have attained perfection yet.
And even if there are 1 or 2 geniuses who are also super rich what difference does it really make. :smile:(it is all just a drop in the ocean of the universe ). They still have just a little more or less of some things. dafluff took the time to write a post that someone liked. Well, I think that is great.
 

steveandpenny

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Go for your requirement of "high quality content" and see if you get enough traffic to persuade any advertiser to spend money on a site that has five contributors a day (yourselves). You disenfranchise a huge number of potential members with your grandiose idea that ExpatIndo should be known as some kind of Indonesia expat intelligentsia that places itself above the common man.

Keep dipping into your pockets to support your site and cabal. With this continuing attitude and approach you'll be dead in the water within a year.

Some of us have as much a love of Indonesia as the next person, but we may lack the education, the abiltiy to articulate our ideas, thought or opinions to the extent of others, but still wish to contribute in some way to a forum that relates to Indonesia.

Your site, raise the bar as high as you like, enjoy the tumbleweeds.

ExpatIndo appears to value a certain type of member way above another.
Where the hell did that come from ? Did you drink too much coffee or something ?
 

dafluff

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Go for your requirement of "high quality content" and see if you get enough traffic to persuade any advertiser to spend money on a site that has five contributors a day (yourselves). You disenfranchise a huge number of potential members with your grandiose idea that ExpatIndo should be known as some kind of Indonesia expat intelligentsia that places itself above the common man.

Keep dipping into your pockets to support your site and cabal. With this continuing attitude and approach you'll be dead in the water within a year.

Some of us have as much a love of Indonesia as the next person, but we may lack the education, the abiltiy to articulate our ideas, thought or opinions to the extent of others, but still wish to contribute in some way to a forum that relates to Indonesia.

Your site, raise the bar as high as you like, enjoy the tumbleweeds.

ExpatIndo appears to value a certain type of member way above another.

What an incredibly negative way to respond, and an absurd assertion to boot. Where is this coming from? There is no "high quality content" requirement, as checking any of our posting histories will quickly show.

What we do have is several complaints from users that some people are posting multiple articles without adding anything to the discussion, and that this is cluttering the forum. So we have recently re-emphasized in our Posting Guidelines, specifically

Do not link to an outside article without comment. This is a discussion forum. If you wish to discuss an article from outside of our forum, you may do so by linking. Please also include your own comments as to why you are linking said article to start off the discussion.

We then added

Under no circumstances should you copy most or all of outside articles and post in on the forum. If you need to quote part of an article, you must cite the source.

It is not unreasonable to require posters in a discussion forum to add their own thoughts as to why they are linking an article, and to respect other authors copyrights. This hardly makes it a "high quality content" requirement.

Now lets examine your claim that

ExpatIndo appears to value a certain type of member way above another


You may be on to something here. Lets review:

1) When you joined the forum and did not qualify for the 200 post Cage rule, we created a post count boosting thread, basically just for you. (link)
2) When you requested your own blog section, this too was given (link). We note that you apparently got bored with it only a month after it was started.
3) Despite the above mentioned posting guidelines, we have tolerated numerous posts of yours that have ignored it. Including multiple times where you infringed on other authors' copyrights by posting full articles that were behind a pay wall.

After all that, here you are attacking EG who is like 80% the reason you even have a forum for you to throw your little temper tantrum. I can't even estimate the hours of his time that he as contributed to the continuing operation of Expat Indo.

Thank you for your concern that we may be "dead in the water within a year". If that happens, I can guarantee it won't be for financial reasons. Rather it would be because people like EG got tired for getting unreasonably slammed by people like you, even after all the thankless hours he has worked on our forum.

Finally, I got a good chuckle out of your advertisers remark. This site never was, nor ever will be, operated for financial reason. All of us have much higher producing financial endeavors than a site catering to a tiny niche will ever be able to produce. Despite knowing this, we carry on because we feel it is a useful resource and community for fellow expats. It is a labor of love, and honestly some days it is very hard to remember this.
 
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El_Goretto

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dafluff didn't write the original post.....he copied/pasted and did the proper thing by attributing the source.

Except, it's not how this went at all.

What Dafluff posted is 100% original material by Dafluff. He didn't copy past anything, he wrote the piece himself. You won't find any of these paragraphs anywhere in the English media.

In fact, it was so well written, structured and illustrated that he even fooled you into thinking he copy pasted someone else's article.

And that's what I praised him for because that's a lot of effort.

And while I thank @dafluff for recognizing my work, 90% of the articles on the website have been written by him. And that's on top of also doing a good share of the technical side and 90% of the moderation.
 

Davita

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Except, it's not how this went at all.

What Dafluff posted is 100% original material by Dafluff. He didn't copy past anything, he wrote the piece himself. You won't find any of these paragraphs anywhere in the English media.

In fact, it was so well written, structured and illustrated that he even fooled you into thinking he copy pasted someone else's article.

And that's what I praised him for because that's a lot of effort.

And while I thank @dafluff for recognizing my work, 90% of the articles on the website have been written by him. And that's on top of also doing a good share of the technical side and 90% of the moderation.

Thank you for the explanation but, as Dafluff said 'Here are some other the highlights of the speech' and offered two links to his sources I think my comprehension that he copy/pasted was understandable.

btw...I've personally authored many posts containing original material and received a like/dislike or thanks tick...but I've never previously been generally admonished like 'And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs.' nor been fooled by someone pretending to copy/paste.

Note to self...smarten up on your postings or, if unable to reach Dafluff's content quality or E_G's colorful praise...fugetabootit.
 

atlantis

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edit: nanti sikit....dafluff didn't write the original post.....he copied/pasted and did the proper thing by attributing the source.
I respectuously suggest you have a closer look at Dafluff's post. He did not copy/pasted but wrote the whole piece himself. Dafluff, rather than spamming a link and adding no comment, like we have seen repetitively done by a user, took the time to read and comment in English articles initially written in Bahasa Indonesia. Kudos to him.


EDIT: TO ALL USERS AND NOT ONLY TO THE ABOVE QUOTED USER


We certainly don't ask to all users to do the same, but definitely ask users to respect copyrights and, whenever they want to share anything, having the courtesy of adding their opinion to start a discussion. Style doesn't matter.

I understand that not all users may have Dafluff's abilities but come on: trying to have us believe that a (large?) portion of our readership "may lack the education, the abiltiy to articulate (their) ideas, thought or opinions to the extent of others" seem to me disingenuous. As well as the attack on EG in this thread. It's a petty an gratuitous one and I feel that it should only be ignored.
 
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atlantis

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Thank you for your concern that we may be "dead in the water within a year". If that happens, I can guarantee it won't be for financial reasons. Rather it would be because people like EG got tired for getting unreasonably slammed by people like you, even after all the thankless hours he has worked on our forum.
Finally, I got a good chuckle out of your advertisers remark. This site never was, nor ever will be, operated for financial reason. All of us have much higher producing financial endeavors than a site catering to a tiny niche will ever be able to produce. Despite knowing this, we carry on because we feel it is a useful resource and community for fellow expats. It is a labor of love, and honestly some days it is very hard to remember this.
Here! Here!
Really, it's about time that the (very tiny) part of the readership who still don't understand it get that point: The only return on Investment those who have financed this adventure from the beginning are looking for is to build up a USEFUL resource for the community and the best one available in Indonesia.

We don't need to "persuade any advertiser to spend money on (our site) site" Heck! Sorry to say it the way it is: We don't need advertisers, we have done the financial effort by ourselves and are committed to do it for many years should it be needed.

Last, should any advertiser be interested, THEY will have to persuade us that they share the same aim than us: being a useful and honest resource for the community. That's a key point you should integrate to better understand us and our goals, VH.
 
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El_Goretto

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Note to self...smarten up on your postings or, if unable to reach Dafluff's content quality or E_G's colorful praise...fugetabootit.

So this is then? You're just... Jealous?

Seriously, you're all reading too much into this. Dafluff did a good job with his post and I praised him for it. End of story.
 

Davita

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RE: Atlantis above post # 12
You have quoted my post # 6 but only responded to that in your first para. You then continued to respond to other posts ......not to mine. This gives the suggestion that I said things...which I didn't.
In future I'd hope you multi-quote so your responses accurately reflect where, and to whom, you are directing your response.
 

atlantis

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RE: Atlantis above post # 12
You have quoted my post # 6 but only responded to that in your first para. You then continued to respond to other posts ......not to mine. This gives the suggestion that I said things...which I didn't.
In future I'd hope you multi-quote so your responses accurately reflect where, and to whom, you are directing your response.
I consider that the membership is smart enough to read and understand to who the answer(s) was/were directed, with our without quote/multiquotes. It seems you have and I see no reason for others not being able to match your ability.

Anyway I promise to give it a thought.

Respectuously yours,
O.

Edit: In order for you to feel better, I have edited post #12 and inserted a spoiler.
 
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Davita

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So this is then? You're just... Jealous?

Seriously, you're all reading too much into this. Dafluff did a good job with his post and I praised him for it. End of story.

Giving praise (mano to mano) is one thing but saying ''And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you properly post high quality content on current affairs.' is offensive to others. It infers the rest of us are inadequate.

edit: on reflection it reminds me when I was at school over 70 years ago. The teacher would always select this little dweeb smart-ass to come to the front and show the rest of his dumb classmates how things should be done.

The little dweeb was me.
 
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Davita

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I consider that the membership is smart enough to read and understand to who the answer(s) was/were directed, with our without quote/multiquotes. It seems you have and I see no reason for others not being able to match your ability.

Anyway I promise to give it a thought.

Respectuously yours,
O.

Edit: In order for you to feel better, I have edited post #12 and inserted a spoiler.

Thank you...that's better but I was only wishing for a small multi-quote...but your edit does help me with my failing eyesight.
 

Bad_azz

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Seriously! I go off on holiday for a few days & this happens.
Slapped wrists the lot of you- I don't care who started it. (& I ain't mini-modding, I'm mummying)

Personally I like VH 's posts - all the links to the interesting videos, I also like dafluff's posts & even some of Davitas.
Content Quality
It isn't a competition is it?
We all have our own individual style and contribute because we wish to, & because we care to be helpful or entertaining to the people who choose to take time to read.

We should value all the contributions others make to the forum, especially if they are of a different style to our own because that is what generates the variety. Without variety the place would be B A F
So guys c'mon- tuck those egos back in your panties. Play nice xx

I brought you all a friendship bracelet back from the beach.


Go for your requirement of "high quality content" and see if you get enough traffic to persuade any advertiser to spend money on a site that has five contributors a day (yourselves).

I have the highest regard for you E-G but honestly...what prompted you to post the above quote.:doh:.... I find it offensive.


Come on Van....please calm down.
& the rest of it.
 

Anglian

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I agree with BA, this is a forum, if we all thought the same and conformed, we might as well pack it in
 

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