Bali is Having Serious Problems

fastpitch17

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Bali and tourism there is getting a lot of negative press. Big scream about too many tourist and a tourist minister saying not enough. Current Administration saying more, more, invest, build, share the wealth.

One of the obvious deviations between PDI-P and Jokowi may be right in Bali.

Not to forget locals are claiming government is allowing Bali to be colonized by the Russians.
 
I think the blame on 'tourism' as such is a bit misplaced. The government has decided to allow tens of thousands of foreigners to live permanently in Bali on an endless series of social visit passes, tax free I might add. So there is a huge community of foreign carpet baggers hanging out in Bali, some of whom are total knuckleheads. If the government simply cleaned up its immigration policies and adopted a Schengen zone type approach (max 90 days stay in any 180 period), it would not only eliminate the tax farce, it would also reduce the carpet bagger population in Bali very significantly, and many of the associated problems would disappear as well.
 
I had to look up carpet bagger. Im guessing its the last one.... :ROFLMAO:

car·pet·bag·ger
/ˈkärpətˌbaɡər/
noun
DEROGATORY•INFORMAL
noun: carpet-bagger

a political candidate who seeks election in an area where they have no local connections.
  • HISTORICAL
    (in the US) a person from the northern states who went to the South after the Civil War to profit from the Reconstruction.
  • a person perceived as an unscrupulous opportunist.
    "the organization is rife with carpetbaggers"
 
You can’t have your cake and eat it too. Megawati is proposing a weird mix of measures. Or you limit the influx or you build an additional airport and develop the north. Or you ’protect’ the Balinese culture and stop the income for many locals or you open it up even more to tourism for financial gain of the local communities.

Try to find a Balinese developer and workers for a new construction. Even our pergola‘s or kitchen sets are made by Javanese. And the Russians‘ success in car/motorbike rental, beauty and manicure salons and creating a ‘hidden city’ is also very obvious.

It‘s very nice that Megawati wants the Balinese to profit from the wealth that tourism can bring and become investors etc., but as long as their priorities are on ceremonies and they leave the businesses to people from the ‘main island’, there will never be any progress. Of course there are some bigger local companies with wealthy families active (Gde, Ramayana, Waka, …); perhaps Megawati should talk to them instead of solely addressing the government(s)?
 
I think the blame on 'tourism' as such is a bit misplaced. The government has decided to allow tens of thousands of foreigners to live permanently in Bali on an endless series of social visit passes, tax free I might add. So there is a huge community of foreign carpet baggers hanging out in Bali, some of whom are total knuckleheads. If the government simply cleaned up its immigration policies and adopted a Schengen zone type approach (max 90 days stay in any 180 period), it would not only eliminate the tax farce, it would also reduce the carpet bagger population in Bali very significantly, and many of the associated problems would disappear as well.
Bali has 4 million population and one million tourists, foreign and local, every moment. Tens of thousands,even hundreds of thousands foreign residents do not add much.

If the building was not allowed in green areas, and green areas kept or expanded, you could not buld so much. The tourism influx is in accordance with the existing rooms/beds capacity, and any issue on this is on the local government.

Less buildings=less tourists=higher prices=more tourists with deep pockets.
 
I think the blame on 'tourism' as such is a bit misplaced. The government has decided to allow tens of thousands of foreigners to live permanently in Bali on an endless series of social visit passes, tax free I might add. So there is a huge community of foreign carpet baggers hanging out in Bali, some of whom are total knuckleheads. If the government simply cleaned up its immigration policies and adopted a Schengen zone type approach (max 90 days stay in any 180 period), it would not only eliminate the tax farce, it would also reduce the carpet bagger population in Bali very significantly, and many of the associated problems would disappear as well.
It seems, you fail to recognize the millions of Rupiah tourist spend, to live here. Every Balinese I know, depends on tourism for their income! I think you fail to realize, most businesses don't pay Taxes!
Isn't it the local population responsibility for paying their share of taxes?
 
tourist spend, to live here

Tourists by definition don't live in Bali. They are visitors and that is exactly what Hermes point was. There are too many tourists who now live in Bali and dont contribute.

There are of course some exceptions that should be allowed such as retired + married to a local but now there are too many others who skirt the rules and effectively live in Bali, often working and not paying taxes. Why should locals pay taxes to support those people? Its the same argument world over.
 
I still wonder who wants to live in Bali.😅
If you can't afford some of the upper living standards concerning houses or live in a nice beach resort, I really don't see the point anymore. Besides some nice rural areas, Bali is turning more and more into an overrated, overcrowded mess.

As for the problems, if you want quality tourism and not so much of a mess, just enforce some rules. But that's one of the problems here anyway, rules here only seem to be enforced when somone is out for money or you stepped on the wrong foot.
 
Bali is turning into a budget Dubai
Dubai was screwed the moment the Burj Al Arab was full of London taxi drivers who were on a 5 day all Inc package Inc flights for $500 by clipping vouchers from The Sun newspaper

They went for quantity not quality.

Now everything is so overpriced you just have low quality but funded by others like bloggers and content creators and OF etc

And as for "you can't have your cake and eat it too"

But my dear. This in Indonesia. I shall keep my cake. And eat your cake.
 
It seems, you fail to recognize the millions of Rupiah tourist spend, to live here. Every Balinese I know, depends on tourism for their income! I think you fail to realize, most businesses don't pay Taxes!
Isn't it the local population responsibility for paying their share of taxes?
I recognize the positive economic impact to locals, which is obviously why the government allows what is effectively permanent residence via social visas. However, it is pure hypocrisy for any beneficiary of this policy to then complain about its social impacts. As for taxes, some locals don't pay especially casual laborers and those earning less than 50 or 60 juta per year, but anyone working for a local company has their income tax deducted at source, myself included.
 

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I recognize the positive economic impact to locals, which is obviously why the government allows what is effectively permanent residence via social visas. However, it is pure hypocrisy for any beneficiary of this policy to then complain about its social impacts. As for taxes, some locals don't pay especially casual laborers and those earning less than 50 or 60 juta per year, but anyone working for a local company has their income tax deducted at source, myself included.
I think you fail to realize, most businesses don't pay Taxes!
I think @Shadrach meant ... that most of the (international) companies like Starbuck, McDonalds ... etc 'avoid paying tax' ... by channeling money through shell companies. Even not so big Indonesian companies use these schemes, because it is very easy to do .. turn-key-solutions at e.g. HSBC. This is a big problem, also recognized by tax authorities in Indonesia.
 
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I recognize the positive economic impact to locals, which is obviously why the government allows what is effectively permanent residence via social visas. However, it is pure hypocrisy for any beneficiary of this policy to then complain about its social impacts. As for taxes, some locals don't pay especially casual laborers and those earning less than 50 or 60 juta per year, but anyone working for a local company has their income tax deducted at source, myself included.
Did you report all your overseas assets and revenues, and get it taxed in Indonesia, as required by the regulations?

If not, you are one of the free riders, same as retirees and nomads that, btw, are probably contributing to the local econoomy more than you are.
 
are probably contributing to the local econoomy more than you are.

I keep hearing this same point. So spending money in a country allows you to dodge visa and tax rules? Also based on your statement someone who pays some tax is worse than someone who pays none but spends more?

Yes i declare assets and pay tax in Indonesia. Yes i think there should be good visas for retirees. But also yes i think Bali has a huge problem with nomad workers and Russians who effectively live there without paying tax or properly contributing. Your point is just trying to muddy the water as is just blaming the locals for their tax situation. Doesnt mean there isn't a problem with nomads and Russians.
 
Every Balinese I know, depends on tourism for their income!

Bali is not only Kuta, Nusa Dua, Canggu and sanur. According to BPS, in 2023 less than 15% of Balinese productive ages (>15years) are working in tourism industry; lower than Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries.
I live in a village less than 500m from a popular tourist attraction, but the kadus (head of village) told me that only 2 family rely on tourism - my neighbor most of them are peasants.
 
Still, farmers have been leaving their farms because they made no more money and now they're working as teachers, drivers for tourists, in construction, etc.*
I remember reading somewhere that 500 hectares of paddies (the equivalent of 700 football fields) are lost every year. Of course development is a major reason (cf. Canggu) but if the youth doesn’t want to do that work anymore. Same applies in other countries and continents btw.

A good ‘side effect’ of the touristic and esp. culinary expansion, is the demand for local products. See the Michelin in Bali thread. The upscale restaurants want to source (and advertise that they do!) locally. And preferably organic. They can also pay higher prices. That (will) incentivize(s) farmers.

*
According to the 2023 Census of Agriculture done by the Central Bureau of Statistics in Bali (Badan Pusat Statistik Bali), out of the 361,673 farmers on the island, the millennial generation (defined as those 19-39 years of age) account for only 15.18%. This generation is supposed to be the leading workforce in coming years, and this drastic drop in numbers is cause for concern for Bali’s food security. The effects are seen in a comparison done between 2013 and 2023, where over a ten-year period the number of agricultural households has fallen in every category: food crop (-34.13%), paddy (-26.03%), horticulture (-24.19%) and livestock (-27,57%).
 
Yes i declare assets and pay tax in Indonesia. Yes i think there should be good visas for retirees. But also yes i think Bali has a huge problem with nomad workers and Russians who effectively live there without paying tax or properly contributing. Your point is just trying to muddy the water as is just blaming the locals for their tax situation. Doesnt mean there isn't a problem with nomads and Russians.
Lot of Russian companies in Bali are loaded, and they for sure cannot avoid paing taxes with so much money on their accounts, and investing in property. So saying Russians are a problem is just a personal bias. Brits are big problem in Greece and Spain, Aussies are big problem in Bali, following that line.

In real life, rich people spending more are overweighting some small spenders that are reporting their taxes. That is why Sam Altman got a golden visa and you did not.

Locals are guilty for sure for their tax situation, as they are electing their own government.
 
Bali is not only Kuta, Nusa Dua, Canggu and sanur. According to BPS, in 2023 less than 15% of Balinese productive ages (>15years) are working in tourism industry; lower than Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries.
I live in a village less than 500m from a popular tourist attraction, but the kadus (head of village) told me that only 2 family rely on tourism - my neighbor most of them are peasants.
Two thirds of Bali's GDP is coming from tourism (directly, and indirectly). They were crying during covid.
 
Two thirds of Bali's GDP is coming from tourism (directly, and indirectly). They were crying during covid.
correct, but the big cut is enjoyed by very few people who cried louder if the portion is affected.
Everybody cried during covid; yes people in the tourism industry suffering more than the majority of Balinese.
 

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