Another Confusing Situation

fastpitch17

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OK, We know someone, not close or anything but as she described things to my wife, we had to sit back and wonder, what the hell.

Friend is female. Married for 10 years. She is now 25, has a 9 year old boy and 4 year old girl. She and her family live in a small home that is connected to her parents house. Lived there since married.

Husband went and stayed with his mother in another part of town for almost 2 weeks. Last week her husband came home and told her he was going to take a second wife. Friend said absolutely not. Husband came back with his mother threatening her if she didn't allow it. She stood her ground and said he would have to divorce her to get married again. Mother said no problem and while insulted her saud plenty of pretty women where she lives which sounded like the husband hadn't even found the new lucky woman. RT got involved and chased the husband and his mother away. Now, husband says he is divorcing her and she is glad.

That's basically the relationship background. What's confusing?
Girl had worked for an Indonesian man for 3 years as a housekeeper. 2 years in he son became very ill and was hopitalized. Bill came to a little over 5 juta. The guy she worked for offered to help her and her husband encouraged her to take the help offered. She did and signed a repayment contract. She is uneducated and it ended up being a contract from hell. She did not get paid her 1.25 juta per month for 2 years as repayment. After that he was demanding another 23 juta to pay it off because that is the interest she agreed to. This guy would come to her house every week yelling and screaming outside her home where everyone could hear. She paid him what she could every week. He wanted the paperwork for her mothers house but she was smart enough to say no way. He took her key. Husband never paid a single rupiah towards it saying it was her loan. Husband makes 1 juta a month. RT again gets involved and payoff is now 1.5 juta. She raised that and former employer was to return the next day to get it from her and the RT. He never showed so she has the 1.5 juta and is keeping if and when he returns. She did contact the police about it but they wanted some cash up front to look into it. She is now prepared to finally end this harassment.

Now the weird part. Parents were paid a dowry from the husbands family and oarents basically sold her when she was 15. The only girl. Now that she is getting a divorce her father told her that he has arranged for her to have a new husband as soon as the divorce is final. The father is being paid quite a bit for her, again. The new guy has one wife and is 70 years old but hey, he has money. She told her father that she had no plans to remarry at this time and just wants to build a life for her and her children. Father wasn't going for that and has already given his permission to the new husband to be, for a price of course.

She us now trying to find a kos away from where her family lives. Since she has said she has no plans to remarry, she has been beaten by her drug using older brother and insulted by a younger brother who both live at home and she does their laundry and feeds them. One other older married brother came back from Java and basically put her down very badly. Strange thing since while her father works 500 rebu a month and her mother works, 1.5 juta a month, she pays the bills and does all laundry for everyone. Feeds most daily. She does this by working a number of odd jobs around her neighborhood. None of her brothers give a single rupiah to her parents. The drug user has no job, the younger one cleans ACs.

Evidently at this time she is staying with a friend. Family has contacted about everyone they know of who knows her about her wearabouts. If anyone does know they don't seem to be admitting it to them.

My question would be, if she was married and gets divorced, would that not make her a single oarent who is Independent of her parents? How can a parent be allowed to basicall sell and then resell their daughter? A daughter they never supported and she basically supported much of their needs. I think the parents are seeing the cash as well as the brothers and feel they can take these liberties.

Just another reason I feel girls need a lot more support and opportunities here.
 
If the mentioned lady is Muslim, she will for life have somebody who is her wali (guardian, usually father or other surviving male relative). If she wants to get married in an Islamic rite again, she will need approval from the guardian. The guardian is generally defined as a person who has the right to marry a daughter/woman to a man (usually of her choice).
 
If the mentioned lady is Muslim, she will for life have somebody who is her wali (guardian, usually father or other surviving male relative). If she wants to get married in an Islamic rite again, she will need approval from the guardian. The guardian is generally defined as a person who has the right to marry a daughter/woman to a man (usually of her choice).
The guardian should help and support in the woman's best interest. He should allow to marry her a man of her choosing if this man is suitable and of good moral character according to shari'a standards.
On the other hand, the guardian has no right to force her into marriage with someone she does not want as a husband.
The Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “The virgin should not be given in marriage until her permission has been sought.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6968; Muslim, 1419.

The apparent meaning is that this is general and applies to every virgin and every guardian; there is no difference between a father or any other guardian, hence al-Bukhaari interpreted the hadeeth by saying: “Chapter: The father or other guardian should not give a virgin or previously married woman in marriage except with their consent."
(link)
 
If the mentioned lady is Muslim, she will for life have somebody who is her wali (guardian, usually father or other surviving male relative). If she wants to get married in an Islamic rite again, she will need approval from the guardian. The guardian is generally defined as a person who has the right to marry a daughter/woman to a man (usually of her choice).
Even though she is divorced? This continues throughout her life? From all I have seen or heard of over many years it would seem it is the males who need guardians. I know, a laughing matter since females are put in such a low catagory of human beings because they are seen as not being able to make the best decisions for themselves.
 
In my experience parents here very seldom relinquish oversight and control the way they do in the West, regardless of religion. Most seem to work for their kids' best interests but in this case obviously not.
That said, I can think of at least one locality that is known for monetizing daughters. And stereotypically the men do sweet FA while the women bear life's burdens.
Wasn't a very similar situation discussed in this forum some time back?
 
Even though she is divorced? This continues throughout her life? From all I have seen or heard of over many years it would seem it is the males who need guardians. I know, a laughing matter since females are put in such a low catagory of human beings because they are seen as not being able to make the best decisions for themselves.
It continues till the end of life. However, if somebody leaves the Religion of Peace, this obligation ceases to exist.

Despite the proclaimed equality of Indonesian citizens in the constitution, privileges, rights, and obligations are different based on sex/religion/ethnic segregation, and patriarchy (the real one, not the one claimed in the US).

Some examples:
Women in Shariah law, valid as private law in Indonesia for Muslims, can inherit only half compared to the male heirs. Derived from Islamic law, where a woman is worth half of a man . Hadiths give the explanation-women are deficient in religion and intellect; deficient in religion as they cannot pray/go to a mosque during menstruation, and second, deficient in intellect (meaning stupid-that is why Islam requires two women witnesses compared to one male).

In the Hindu religion, in beloved and magical Bali, the woman heir inherits nothing. Everything goes to the male heir. If there is no male heir inheritance goes to the brothers of the deceased.

A woman is obligated to run the household, while a man is obliged to earn money (Marriage Law).

Non-muslims cannot inherit from Muslims, while the opposite is possible (Sharia law).

Constant push from the government or government bodies to prohibit marriages between Muslims and non-Muslims.
 
We just bought a property which was part of an inheritance and the three siblings male and female (muslim) split the money equally between them. I've never heard that in practice females would get less than males in an inheritance here.
 
We just bought a property which was part of an inheritance and the three siblings male and female (muslim) split the money equally between them. I've never heard that in practice females would get less than males in an inheritance here.
The heirs have the right to split the property between themselves as per their wishes, however, if they do not agree, the 2:1 rule will apply.

Female Hindus in Bali get nothing.

Also, in Minangkabau, West Sumatra, despite being Muslim, the system of inheritance is matrilineal.
 
We just bought a property which was part of an inheritance and the three siblings male and female (muslim) split the money equally between them. I've never heard that in practice females would get less than males in an inheritance here.
Not only do females get less, sometimes they get nothing because they are looked at as being part of her husbands family. Maybe my exposure to the world of kampung existance just makes me see a few things those in the great metropolitan areas don't. Don't know.

A former neighbor has a housekeeper. She lives with her husband and 2 children about 100 to 150 meters from where she works. She lives in a house owned by her parents. One day her older brother came calling and insisted the house belongs to him since he is the oldest son. The parents said he had a right to it. He told the girl to pack up and get out because he was going to move it. Unfortunantly for him and fortunate for her, a week after his demand firnthe house he was arrested for being a getaway driver from a robbery and eneded up in prison. She remained in the house.

I have been told of other examples of older brothers getting basically everything of any value upon the death of a parent, especially the father. In the kampungs it would seem that many of the daughters are exchanged for some type of monitary item be it property, cash, of animals. Sold basically simply because the parents feel they can no longer afford to feed her and have a way out of it. The reason for so many young female marriages. Not approved by civil laws but approved by islamic judges and parents of course. Being real, the daughters are sold off and the parents no longer feel they are their responsibility. There is no 2-1 equations, more like 1-0. The females have little to no worth to their birth families unless the daughter's husband has some value to them and she is used as a conduit to that value.
 
It continues till the end of life. However, if somebody leaves the Religion of Peace, this obligation ceases to exist.

Despite the proclaimed equality of Indonesian citizens in the constitution, privileges, rights, and obligations are different based on sex/religion/ethnic segregation, and patriarchy (the real one, not the one claimed in the US).

Some examples:
Women in Shariah law, valid as private law in Indonesia for Muslims, can inherit only half compared to the male heirs. Derived from Islamic law, where a woman is worth half of a man . Hadiths give the explanation-women are deficient in religion and intellect; deficient in religion as they cannot pray/go to a mosque during menstruation, and second, deficient in intellect (meaning stupid-that is why Islam requires two women witnesses compared to one male).

In the Hindu religion, in beloved and magical Bali, the woman heir inherits nothing. Everything goes to the male heir. If there is no male heir inheritance goes to the brothers of the deceased.

A woman is obligated to run the household, while a man is obliged to earn money (Marriage Law).

Non-muslims cannot inherit from Muslims, while the opposite is possible (Sharia law).

Constant push from the government or government bodies to prohibit marriages between Muslims and non-Muslims.
Religion of Peace? Nothing personal but that's a term that someone with a MAGA hat collection would write.
I guess you know that females have rights under Sharia which counterbalance those apparent slights you mentioned.
As alluded to, this poor lady's woes seem to come from her relatives' greed and not from religion.
 
Obama and Bush are not known to have MAGA posters on their walls at home.
"Islam is Peace" George. W. Bush
"Islam is a religion of peace, charity and justice" Barack Obama

For sure that in Sharia law women have rights, although inferior to men-meaning they are not equal. And slaves have rights also. And apostates are sentenced to execution if they do not repel.

The power over the mentioned person comes in the above case from the law (religious especially, that is the law of the state as well) and customs.

 
Bush did say something like that, and I'm not sure of Obama's exact platitudes right before he unleashed death and destruction on untold thousands.
Since then the term is used sarcastically, like 'let's go Brandon', to carry a derogatory meaning. But we all know that.
You might want to read up on women's rights in Islam before making a comparison with slaves.
I hope the lady in question can make a new start and live happily.
 
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You can enlighten us and explain how women's rights are championed in Sharia law.

Where I come from, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights is followed (Indonesia is a signatory btw), where among other provisions, humans have equal rights irrespective of sex, race, or religion, including the right to marry who you want, without limitation to the above, and some other standards, the line that divides the civilized societies from the others.

 
You can enlighten us and explain how women's rights are championed in Sharia law.

Where I come from, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights is followed (Indonesia is a signatory btw), where among other provisions, humans have equal rights irrespective of sex, race, or religion, including the right to marry who you want, without limitation to the above, and some other standards, the line that divides the civilized societies from the others.

If you're interested enough you'll look it up. There are better teachers than me out there.
It's nice that you're from a place that applies the complete UDHR. Such societies are rare.
 

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